R-12 Freon Replacement Options
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Junior User
Joined: Feb 2003
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From: Ohio
R-12 Freon Replacement Options
My A/C on my '89 Bronco is not cooling as it should and the compressor is cycling more often than usual. I add some R-12 about 4 years ago bu this time unfortunately my stockpile of R-12 is gone.
What are my options so far as refrigerants? The simpler the better!
What are my options so far as refrigerants? The simpler the better!
Laughing Gas
Joined: Jul 2003
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From: New England
R-12 Freon Replacement Options
Bite the bullet & go with R-134a. Do it right--have ALL the R-12 flushed out, pull 29.2" of vacuum for at least half an hour, flush all the oil out, change the evaporator, & charge with R-134a.
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R-12 Freon Replacement Options
dont get a conversion kit for 12 to 134a. The auto stores will tell you to to make money 134a oil doesnt hurt the igsisting stuff.
the oil is mo or poe same as r12. just get the 134a freon and dump it in. also you dont need to evac the system and pull a vac. if you do that , dont waste your time with a half hour vac. 10 minutes is fine. Im a hvac tech. industrial commercial and res.
good luck.
the oil is mo or poe same as r12. just get the 134a freon and dump it in. also you dont need to evac the system and pull a vac. if you do that , dont waste your time with a half hour vac. 10 minutes is fine. Im a hvac tech. industrial commercial and res.
good luck.
Junior User
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R-12 Freon Replacement Options
There is a "conversion" (~$45) kit at most auto parts stores, which have some refrigerant cans and lube oil. Another good thing to buy is the R134a "guage" (~$20) which allows you to check the low pressure side to help determine how much refrigerant to add. Otherwise you can't tell how many cans to add, and you might add to much, a bad thing. I recharged mine and now it freezes my hands. Thats a good thing.
Posting Guru
Joined: Sep 2002
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From: San Antonio, Texas
R-12 Freon Replacement Options
I thought I might jump in here. I have worked with my dad for as long as I could walk, and he has about 30 plus years experience with all types of air cond. And now I do some work on automotive air cond.
snootsnout, I am happy that you too are educated enough to know that the conversion kits from r-12 to r-134a are usless.
I have been dumping 134a into r-12 systems for years with no ill effects, and the two oils mix like they were made for each other.
I have even been told that the r-134a oil can eat away r-12 o-rings.
yea right
later guys.
snootsnout, I am happy that you too are educated enough to know that the conversion kits from r-12 to r-134a are usless.
I have been dumping 134a into r-12 systems for years with no ill effects, and the two oils mix like they were made for each other.
I have even been told that the r-134a oil can eat away r-12 o-rings.
yea rightlater guys.
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Junior User
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From: Ohio
R-12 Freon Replacement Options
So the consensus is that the oil and the evap do not need to be changed. And am understanding this part correctly, just add the 134a on top of the R-12? Do not evac the system?
I also assume that my leak is not bad enough to worry about as it took four years to leak down. Right or wrong?
I also assume that my leak is not bad enough to worry about as it took four years to leak down. Right or wrong?
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R-12 Freon Replacement Options
you dont need to pull a vac unless the system is out of freon if theres pressure in it than just add the freon till the air gets cold.
if theres not pressure(push in the schraoder valve) than youll have to pull a vac 5 to 10 minutes is fine . if its a very slow leak than i would just add freon every couple years, good to go.
if theres not pressure(push in the schraoder valve) than youll have to pull a vac 5 to 10 minutes is fine . if its a very slow leak than i would just add freon every couple years, good to go.
Posting Guru
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From: Southern MD
R-12 Freon Replacement Options
Originally posted by Schlump
My A/C on my '89 Bronco is not cooling as it should and the compressor is cycling more often than usual. I add some R-12 about 4 years ago bu this time unfortunately my stockpile of R-12 is gone.
What are my options so far as refrigerants? The simpler the better!
My A/C on my '89 Bronco is not cooling as it should and the compressor is cycling more often than usual. I add some R-12 about 4 years ago bu this time unfortunately my stockpile of R-12 is gone.
What are my options so far as refrigerants? The simpler the better!
Go to http://www.ackits.com/forum/categories.cfm?catid=17
Read at least the top, and bottom two posts about a proper conversion. Then make up your mind.
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R-12 Freon Replacement Options
there is no "flushing the system" if the leak is small add freon every year or two. if you dont mind spending a lot of money than you could go with a typical mechanics recommendations. But if its a small leak or a big leak , once the system looses a certain amount of charge, than the compressor will shut off on low pressure "low pressure control". as long as the atmosphere has not penitrated the system there is no reason to pull a vac, and the rest is all about the almighty dollar to the shops.As far as problems down the road by following my advise, not possible.Why you ask? because the worst that could happen is the compressor will go bad and that wont happen because of a low charged system, it just wont run period, because of the lpc.
Post Fiend
Joined: Feb 2000
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From: Kansas
R-12 Freon Replacement Options
snootsnout, I disagree with your post. I see that your a "hvac tech. industrial commercial and res" OK
However, a brief review of the threads here would show many reasons not to do what you recommend. 94van's reply is correct and to diverge from it is at your own risk.
I doubt that people will have the level of success that you claim.
However, a brief review of the threads here would show many reasons not to do what you recommend. 94van's reply is correct and to diverge from it is at your own risk.
I doubt that people will have the level of success that you claim.
New User
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R-12 Freon Replacement Options
i hear you , but i see nothing in the threads with any merit. i see what mechanics tell the average consumer to scare them into waisting there money , just like in my field , also i speak from experience. Yes auto ac is a little different than what i do everyday but the ac principal is the same and the same r12 in the old auto is the same i use in low temp systems. same with 134a but thats for auto only.I would like to know a specific problem that you believe would arrive from my advise.
Post Fiend
Joined: Feb 2000
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From: Kansas
R-12 Freon Replacement Options
94van already covered it. $$$$$$
If you want direct links to threads - that can be done. But you can use the search option just as well as I can.
My mine concern is that you are providing advice that could cost members here more money. It is realistic to convert a system with the help that is provided here. Going to a shop is more often than not expensive, but it is possible to do the conversion oneself. There are several threads about the problems people have encountered when taking a shortcut. Compressor lock up comes to mind.
The bottom line is to do your research before changing the system or doing it yourself.
If you want direct links to threads - that can be done. But you can use the search option just as well as I can.
My mine concern is that you are providing advice that could cost members here more money. It is realistic to convert a system with the help that is provided here. Going to a shop is more often than not expensive, but it is possible to do the conversion oneself. There are several threads about the problems people have encountered when taking a shortcut. Compressor lock up comes to mind.
The bottom line is to do your research before changing the system or doing it yourself.
Last edited by Ultramagdan; Sep 2, 2003 at 09:39 PM.
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R-12 Freon Replacement Options
i dont need to look at the threads. I know what i know as fact. The advice i gave is correct. You sir kind of remind me of a few customers that i have encountered over 10 - 12 years. Engineers that think because they are intelligent that they know how to repair refrigeration systems. not so. If you havnt done it and dont know 100% , than you just dont know. the members can choose on there own, there big boys , if they go with a complete change over it will cost them a hell of a lot more money than a seized comp. like i said before the comp. has a safety. I would advise you to talk to a real mechanic not a 5 year out of school mechanic , but a 30 year vet. thank you for your opinion i love being right.
