This is something that has puzzled me for a long time and I can't really get my head around it. This is not a challenge to anyone!!

So often we end up discussing whether someone needs a 250 or 350 to tow a given load and invariably someone posts that they are essentially the same truck with only very minor, easy to overcome differences. So this is a two part question.

Question #1 is: How do we actually know that is the case? Is it something that is simply being repeated on FTE or is it published somewhere? The reason I ask is in the past I often heard the same thing about motor home chassis at a time when I was privy to a lot of information not shared with the buying public and the folks saying that were wrong in almost every case. So how do we know?

Question #2 is: If they are virtually identical, why is Ford doing that? It seems to me from an inventory/manufacturing/marketing standpoint it makes almost know sense.

I have wondered about these two issues for a very long time and have not been able to arrive at firm answers.

Steve

 

deleted.. not useful.

 

They were essentially the same truck. Verified with part numbers and some discussion in other threads with the engineers.


As of 2017 though there are some differences depending on gas vs diesel. Mostly in my understanding is the transmissions.


Don't quote me but the gas Super Duty F250 gets the same tranny as the F150 now. Just beefed up.


I think the axles are different now too. the Gas still gets the Sterling 10.5 but diesels now get a dana.

 

Just my 2c, but for this thread I think it would be a great idea if we dispense with opinion and stick with as close to fact (at least cite a link that appears to be authoritative).

I think the link below is very telling. A ford engineer is admitting that: The axles used for the 2015 F-250 and SRW F-350 are the same.

Also, I think it is very telling that he said this, "John, we know you're very interested in this based on some of your previous posts. We have different horsepower and torque ratings for the F-250 and F-350 6.2-liter V8 due to different test procedures used for the different gross vehicle weight ratings of each truck. Engine output for both the F-250 and F-350 is the same, it's just that the rating is different because of the GVWR."

Really? I won't comment as I'm the one saying let's stick with fact and leave opinion out of it. It's a fact he wrote that. I leave the reader to form his own opinion.

https://www.ford-trucks.com/forums/1...l#post14353068

 

I agree completely with sticking to facts. As I said initially this is not a challenge.

As a former business owner, I just can't get my head around the marketing strategy. Why not just offer a F350 SRW or DRW? It seems like it would make things simpler. Is it related to registration or insurance rates? The annual insurance for my F150 and F350 DRW are almost identical. Just puzzled.

Steve

 

Looking at mine, I'm pretty sure it's a Sterling 10.5; seems to be confirmed here: https://www.ford-trucks.com/forums/a...6&d=1478460718

 

Ok. Thank you Steve! This was an awesome exercise.

I opened this document up in two viewers and put them side by side: https://www.ford-trucks.com/forums/a...6&d=1478460718

Here's what I see:

Frame is the same (or at least the verbiage is identical between the two trucks Chuck).

Brakes are the same.

Shocks are the same.

Engines are the same.

Tranny's are the same. (Edit: Diesel gets a beefier one. See post with pic below).

Rear axle (250 still has the Sterling 10.5, 350 now has the Dana M275.)

Rear axle ratings (F250 is 6,200 -- note, far less than sterling 10.5 on last year's 350), vs. F350 is 7,280 with Dana.

Rear leaf springs (F250 has no Auxiliary, F350 does) -- but description is identical of the basic pack as far as I can tell.

Anti-Sway bar is OPTIONAL on BOTH SRW's.

Wheels are the same.

I've verified tires are the same in a prior thread.

So that's as close to fact as I can muster, somebody please check me -- I'm sure it's easy to make a mistake.

 

Steve,

As to why they market the F250 all I can do is guess

I'm assuming that in some states is registration cost, need for a CDL, insurance, or something like that. I also think that as F150 people 'step up' the F250 is less intimidating, seems like less of a farm/work truck?

With the extremely minimal cost difference, (which further bolsters that there can not be much difference between the trucks) that's all I can come up with.

 

I haven't waded through all of it, but I have the same thing you posted on the axles when I wrote it down. I am going to put it all it a spreadsheet on Excel. Lots of info though and worth more than a quick glance. Appreciate you posting the link.

It is all interesting because as capacities increase, what we use to think of as F250 territory is being taken over by F150s and the new F250s have higher ratings than my old F350. If you think of ratings from days past, you can be way off the money. I was just noodling around looking at the tow rating for my 2010 F150HD last night and was surprised to find out how much it was rated to tow with a 5.4.

Steve

 

In Ontario, my F 250 is rated for 9,800 lbs. thus no requirement for annual emmisions inspections, safety inspections or a CVOR (commercial Vehicle Operators Regulation) on the other hand an F 350 needs all of the above as the 350 is rated for 12,000 lbs and in ontario the thershold is 10,000 lbs.

 

Interesting. I wonder if there is something similar here in the states. Since all the truck manufacturers do something similar, it seems like there must be a rationale beyond the need for complexity and potential inventory control problems.

Steve

 

Here in Massachusetts up to 10k pounds can be registered personal or commercial. 10,001 pounds and up is automatic commercial. So all F350 are automatically commercial registration. But a private person can register commercial without commercial insurance.
So it gives the option of a heavy duty pickup. Keep in mind that towing an rv is not the same as towing commercially.

 

Thank you for that. I noticed a bunch of footnotes for diesel -- as the two 'standard' specs are gassers. I'm pretty sure there are differences. Like this one. (Note, does not change my opinion that the trucks are basically the same; but for accuracy I post the pic below).

 

Uh Oh. I think I may have just found a difference. I wonder why my wheels are not available on the F-350. Looks like they have much smaller ones? I wonder if this is true, why nobody's mentioned it, and if it has anything to do with weight ratings? I searched hard and can't find any weight ratings for any of the wheels...but then again, it's only not available on the 6.7L as far as I can tell. Maybe it could be ordered on a gasser F-350?

 

Are those very small differences in ratios the result of electronic programming? I'll bet those are not mechanical differences. And look at the difference in oil capacity between the 6.2 in F250s and F350s. I find this stuff fascinating!