EBP 36psi
Thread Starter
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Tuned
Joined: Oct 2015
Posts: 392
Likes: 86
From: Roebuck, SC
The 03' had inferred EBP, yours should use the sensor. So EBP, BARO, MAP all should be 14.7 at KOEO. IF not, either the readings not programmed right or the sensors broken or the wires shorted.
KOEO:
BARO = 14.4
MAP = 14 (no decimal place on the scanner)
EBP = 36
EBP 36, constant, no matter what temp, rpm, whatever.
Tideman wrote; I'm showing Vref on EBP at 0.91 KOEO.
Check the EBP sensor against one of those other sensors with a digital meter and then find the short before spending any more money on sensors you don't need.
The turbo uses MAP and EBP to determine boost.... why your getting farts and P0299, the EBP is messed up and until you correct that, the turbo won't operate correctly.
There are sensors that take three wires, one wire is vref 5.0 volts, one ground and one that sends the corresponding feedback signal, like Tideman reported .91v represents 14.7psi when KOEO. In your case, its sending 36psi or +2.0v back... shorted.
In your case the wire should read 36psi = 2.229v or each volt is equal to 16.15 psi for the 5.0 volt reference.
KOEO:
BARO = 14.4
MAP = 14 (no decimal place on the scanner)
EBP = 36
EBP 36, constant, no matter what temp, rpm, whatever.
Tideman wrote; I'm showing Vref on EBP at 0.91 KOEO.
Check the EBP sensor against one of those other sensors with a digital meter and then find the short before spending any more money on sensors you don't need.
The turbo uses MAP and EBP to determine boost.... why your getting farts and P0299, the EBP is messed up and until you correct that, the turbo won't operate correctly.
There are sensors that take three wires, one wire is vref 5.0 volts, one ground and one that sends the corresponding feedback signal, like Tideman reported .91v represents 14.7psi when KOEO. In your case, its sending 36psi or +2.0v back... shorted.
In your case the wire should read 36psi = 2.229v or each volt is equal to 16.15 psi for the 5.0 volt reference.
Thread Starter
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Tuned
Joined: Oct 2015
Posts: 392
Likes: 86
From: Roebuck, SC
Hi All, update for you.
I didn't get very far. I did check the voltages at the plug.
-First I checked ground, it had good continuity, no issues there.
-Then checked and found the 5v reference, that was good.
-The signal wire back to the PCM had no voltage and was not shorted to ground.
I haven't inspected the entire harness yet. That's going to take a while so will do that tomorrow.
I did update my Edge CTS scanner, downloaded the newest firmware and software before I hooked it up to the truck.
The CTS scanner does not have Vref for EBP so I'll have to get the Torque pro working. I did set up a variant for it in the app, but the bluetooth doesn't seem to be playing nice so I have to figure that one out before I can proceed with it.
The CTS only shows EBP pressure in psi.
It shows 36psi constantly, plugged in or not, cold or warm, no matter what the speed or throttle condition.
I am thinking it's in the harness or maybe even a PCM problem.
Thanks for all your comments and help, wish me luck as I go through the harness tomorrow.
I didn't get very far. I did check the voltages at the plug.
-First I checked ground, it had good continuity, no issues there.
-Then checked and found the 5v reference, that was good.
-The signal wire back to the PCM had no voltage and was not shorted to ground.
I haven't inspected the entire harness yet. That's going to take a while so will do that tomorrow.
I did update my Edge CTS scanner, downloaded the newest firmware and software before I hooked it up to the truck.
The CTS scanner does not have Vref for EBP so I'll have to get the Torque pro working. I did set up a variant for it in the app, but the bluetooth doesn't seem to be playing nice so I have to figure that one out before I can proceed with it.
The CTS only shows EBP pressure in psi.
It shows 36psi constantly, plugged in or not, cold or warm, no matter what the speed or throttle condition.
I am thinking it's in the harness or maybe even a PCM problem.
Thanks for all your comments and help, wish me luck as I go through the harness tomorrow.
Senior User
Joined: Jul 2015
Posts: 277
Likes: 0
From: CO
On the scan gauge, vref is named cvi (calibration voltage reference). It monitors the +5vdc side of all the sensors that it passes through not just the ebp. Not sure if the Edge is programed with the same xgauge or if it's called something else.
Thread Starter
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Tuned
Joined: Oct 2015
Posts: 392
Likes: 86
From: Roebuck, SC
Edge doesn't have that option. I am less than impressed with it because it isn't as configurable as I'd like it to be. It seems the number of PIDs is limited and it doesn't allow a lot of options to customize the screens. Hopefully the Torque Pro will fit the bill once I get the bluetooth working.
Lead Driver
Joined: May 2014
Posts: 6,545
Likes: 13
From: Virginia Beach VA
so you found 5v for vref, 0 for the ground and 0 for the third wire? How about with the KOEO... did you get 2.229v on the third wire to show the 36psi or .91v to show the 14.7psi to match the others MAP/BARO? Did you try to find one of those, MAP/BARO at .91v on it's plug?
Thread Starter
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Tuned
Joined: Oct 2015
Posts: 392
Likes: 86
From: Roebuck, SC
so you found 5v for vref, 0 for the ground and 0 for the third wire? How about with the KOEO... did you get 2.229v on the third wire to show the 36psi or .91v to show the 14.7psi to match the others MAP/BARO? Did you try to find one of those, MAP/BARO at .91v on it's plug?
I didn't check MAP/BARO last night, time was limited for me, should be able to get to them today. I checked EBP at the plug, disconnected. Will plug it back in, check it that way, too.
The KOEO reading on the EBP connector was 5v ref, 0 ground, 0 feedback wire. (that's what I would expect)
The thing that gets me is EBP shows 36psi on the edge constantly, EBP connector plugged in or not, so that signal is coming from PCM, right? Vref and feedback wires could be shorted somewhere in the harness.
BARO is constant 14.4, MAP varies depending on boost pressure. It's still boosting, but isn't controlling correctly due to EBP value not correct.
With the key off, ref and feedback wire read infinity to ground, ground to ground continuity was good, plug disconnected.
I'll dig into the harness and do the other checks this evening and report back. Thanks again!
Lead Driver
Joined: May 2014
Posts: 6,545
Likes: 13
From: Virginia Beach VA
MAP/BARO/EBP all should read 14.4 KOEO and why you should check MAP/BARO against the EBP so you can see what it should be to verify what the third wire on EBP should read. With EBP plugged in and KOEO, the third wire should read .91v. Yours reads 36psi all the time, that equates to 2.229v (or close) if .91v where to be equal to 14.7psi (sea level). I just did the math for 36 psi using 14.7 that's all.
I don't think the EBP sensors bad since it reads 36psi and they both read the same (old and new). The PCM is seeing 36psi from the EBP, that's what the EDGE is displaying as well. That should be close to 2.229v, find that and you'll find your problem. It could be getting that voltage from another sensor... have you got any codes? Any other sensors misbehaving? Check vref on all the other 3 wire sensors?
Get torque Pro and check vref as a pid.
I don't think the EBP sensors bad since it reads 36psi and they both read the same (old and new). The PCM is seeing 36psi from the EBP, that's what the EDGE is displaying as well. That should be close to 2.229v, find that and you'll find your problem. It could be getting that voltage from another sensor... have you got any codes? Any other sensors misbehaving? Check vref on all the other 3 wire sensors?
Get torque Pro and check vref as a pid.
Thread Starter
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Tuned
Joined: Oct 2015
Posts: 392
Likes: 86
From: Roebuck, SC
Just in from the garage.
I have to hand it to my dear wife, she has been really patient with me on this truck. She told me a few weeks ago go put a nickle in it, push it over a cliff just so I could say I threw something away.
Anyway, here's what I tested. I sharpened my test lead to get through the insulation on the connectors if needed.
KOEO:
All sensors plugged in.
EBP:
vref = 5.0v
ground = 0v
feedback = .02v
MAP:
vref = 4.99v
ground = 0v
feedback = 1.29v
MAP reading on the edge scanner is 14 (it doesn't have decimal places for MAP)
Didn't check the BARO, it's reading 14.4 based on the Edge, looks normal to me.
Thoughts?
I have to hand it to my dear wife, she has been really patient with me on this truck. She told me a few weeks ago go put a nickle in it, push it over a cliff just so I could say I threw something away.
Anyway, here's what I tested. I sharpened my test lead to get through the insulation on the connectors if needed.
KOEO:
All sensors plugged in.
EBP:
vref = 5.0v
ground = 0v
feedback = .02v
MAP:
vref = 4.99v
ground = 0v
feedback = 1.29v
MAP reading on the edge scanner is 14 (it doesn't have decimal places for MAP)
Didn't check the BARO, it's reading 14.4 based on the Edge, looks normal to me.
Thoughts?
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Thread Starter
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Tuned
Joined: Oct 2015
Posts: 392
Likes: 86
From: Roebuck, SC
I took out the battery and shelf on driver side, disconnected the PCM plug. I found the vref and feedback wires in the PCM plug (based on wire color coding), rang them out. No continuity between vref and feedback(that's good), nothing to ground(also good). Good continuity from end to end on each.
I couldn't find the ground wire on that plug (the center one on the PCM), however, no continuity between the vref and feedback wires, good continuity to ground. (battery negative cable)
Harness looks good, no wear spots. The EBP wires go from the sensor to the main harness, take a right toward the PCM. (looking from front of engine)
I may go ahead and unwrap it all to the PCM, see if I find anything. That will be Friday as I can't work on it tomorrow. Sigh... really tired of this.
Thread Starter
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Tuned
Joined: Oct 2015
Posts: 392
Likes: 86
From: Roebuck, SC
Hi Everyone, just an update for you.
The new motorcraft EBP sensor came in yesterday, but I didn't have the opportunity to install it.
So, after work today I installed the new sensor. I had to tie up a lot of loose ends since I was ringing out wires from the EBP to the PCM.
Once it was all put back together, IT WORKED! EBP readings back to normal.
This is one sensor that is worth having a spare in the truck.
Just so you know, the Edge CTS does have an algorithm that interprets normal BARO and displays close to zero (sometimes 1 or 2 psi) at idle.
What a relief. Brand new sensor that was less than a month old failed.
Like my compadres on this board told me, DO NOT buy cheap *off shore* parts.
Back to business as usual. I'll take it out to the super slab tomorrow for a test, but it ran great in the 10 or so miles of heavy driving I did this afternoon.
I also found some excellent information on another board that I will post tomorrow, hope it will help someone.
Special thanks to our board Guru, WatsonR, for being so patient with me. Cheers!
The new motorcraft EBP sensor came in yesterday, but I didn't have the opportunity to install it.
So, after work today I installed the new sensor. I had to tie up a lot of loose ends since I was ringing out wires from the EBP to the PCM.
Once it was all put back together, IT WORKED! EBP readings back to normal.
This is one sensor that is worth having a spare in the truck.
Just so you know, the Edge CTS does have an algorithm that interprets normal BARO and displays close to zero (sometimes 1 or 2 psi) at idle.
What a relief. Brand new sensor that was less than a month old failed.
Like my compadres on this board told me, DO NOT buy cheap *off shore* parts.
Back to business as usual. I'll take it out to the super slab tomorrow for a test, but it ran great in the 10 or so miles of heavy driving I did this afternoon.
I also found some excellent information on another board that I will post tomorrow, hope it will help someone.
Special thanks to our board Guru, WatsonR, for being so patient with me. Cheers!
Lead Driver
Joined: May 2014
Posts: 6,545
Likes: 13
From: Virginia Beach VA
What we should have done is unplugged the sensor and then turned the key on to see if the reading cleared. Continuity doesn't always prove a good wire, only a broken one.
Good job for hanging in there... Truck runs great and you learned something, both equally important!
Good job for hanging in there... Truck runs great and you learned something, both equally important!