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Combining Chebby and GMC into TOTAL sales is a true flaw in your rational. That is like Toyota combining total sales with Lexus...or Nissan with Infiniti, etc. etc. etc.
Chebby is a brand. GMC is a brand. FORD is a brand. RAM is a brand.
FORD outsells all those brands! Period.
It is GOOD business strategy to combine costs in building a product...and help reduce production costs.
IMHO...FORD has nothing to worry about with the other brands taking the top spot!!
OBTW: Diesel is NOT the be all...end all of engines. They service a purpose, but in the US, the majority of consumers want and demand gas engines. Therefore, FORD listens to its customer base...and provides those products.
biz
Say what you want about brands and chassis, Ford has lost almost 50% of their market share and it is killing their sales. Mark my words Ford will pay the price and lose their quantitative modeling crown.
I've driven the Euro Rover diesel and would drive it all day and night over the Ecoboost. I've already ordered a Disco diesel for the wife to replace her Cadillac and Touareg TDI.
As for my fleet I may or may not fill some of the lighter duty rigs with EcoStroke's but being in the industry I know the potential tech and performance available, and for Ford to just throw global products at America isn't going to lead them back from the brink of losing their crown. And the Aluminum design for work truck fleets is a HUGE hurdle I probably won't be able to overcome. However if they apply the same forethought and investment to light duty diesels they have to flat plain crank design, Ecoboost's, Coyote, and Scorpion the sky is the limit. There is a saying in our industry of engineering, "Don't try and reinvent the wheel." The Ecoboost is trying to reinvent the wheel. Diesel is the wheel. Diesel is and always will be the most efficient combustion cycle possible with the least amount of moving parts. That's scientific fact whether you prefer a diesel or gas vehicle.
Originally Posted by NASSTY
The Ecodiesel is a dog compared to the Gen1 3.5 Ecoboost. 2 seconds slower from 0-60 and 2 seconds slower in the 1/4 mile and it can't tow as much # as the Ecoboost.
The Ecodiesel has the advantage in MPGs, but sucks at everything else.
Paper champions don't mean anything or Ram would have 75% of the market. As in any experiment there are 100's if not thousands of factors. With those factors multiplying I infinitely so are customers buying habits, while people at Ford are being narrow minded in their research.
This is still America and foreign manufacturers sell to that while so many of the exec's in America have bought into the Socialist mindset, America as a whole is still the same blue blooded rebels we've always been. I can throw an CARB Certified tuner on an Ecodiesel and destroy an Ecoboost all day. Then there's the real world products. 85% of customers if not more never use the max payload or towing capacity of vehicles. In the real world I've never spoken with a single Ecoboost owner, that is honest, that gets 22+ MPG. And I can hypermill with the best. My brother on the other hand is like real world expert and drives like John Force and can find the worst case economy in a Tesla at probably 50 miles range. Hypermilling his F-150 ecoboost I was able to get best 19-21 on 35"s. His son's Ram Eco-diesel we have seen multiple 24's on 35"s and a 2" taller lift on more aggressive tread. The acceleration and ride regardless of paper crowns feels light years ahead of the F-150. We've been begging Ford for air ride and they gave us 10 cameras for the hand full of idiots that shouldn't be towing anyways. I take pride in being able to be a man and load up first try. Enjoy the pusification of what used to be the toughest trucks on the market.
In your defense the only F-150 customers that I've talked to that have seen good economy have been with the 2.7, but it's performance and capability is nowhere near either the Eco-boost or Eco-diesel. And I'm sure Ford's 10 speed will put the Eco-boost back in the same ballpark as the Ecodiesel's 8 speed. But the ride, interior, and esthetics of the Ram are far better than the Aluminum, Fireplace grill, Fake Cattle Hide, Leaf sprung, F-150.
Originally Posted by Diesel_Brad
That has got to be the ONLY article I have seen of the 5.0 getting less than 20mpg
The only problem with the ram is it's a mpg queen, no towing, no payload!! Only thing ford needs to do is make the new 150 diesel capable and it will sell like crazy.
80-90% of buyer will never tow or haul anywhere near the max capacity. They get in and test drive. As other manufactures find things they prefer like ride, comfort, leather quality, steel construction, endless USB ports, apps, bed lighting, DIESEL, and so on it is another sale and more market share lost, until your product has inevitably become obsolete. Capable is having a flagship that drive sales. For Dodge it's the Hemi. For Jeep it is utility. Ford Ram it is ride quality, interior, esthetics, steel construction, Cummins, and now the Ecodiesel. That is a large list.
Originally Posted by Tom
Interesting poll.
I refrained from voting because I'm not really the kind of guy who would pay top dollar for something like that. I paid $33,500 for my F150, and I could see paying a few grand more for the same truck with a capable diesel engine. No chance would I pay $45K for such a truck.
I test drove the EcoDiesel and really liked it, had the deal been there I probably would have bought it. My F150 is a rocket ship of a truck, and while fun, I don't really need that. I could live with 7,000 lbs of towing capability and mid-20's for fuel economy. Don't regret the F150, but if I were doing it again I'd look really hard at the available diesel options.
I've never paid full price. Look at those prices as MSRP, as I price ranged them from so using Autotrader.
I purchase/source all of my families vehicles, all of our fleets, and for many friends. Here is a list of a couple:
2011 F250 KR $54k
2016 3500 Denali $58k
2017 3500 LH $62k
2015 1500 LH $48k
2012 f150 Platinum $47k
All new only gasser being the F-150. I talked him into coming down market from the 3/4-1 ton market. The F-150 Eco-boost is suffice for that market but we were very disappointed by the service record and quality. The ride was nice though. Not air ride nice but better than the GM half ton. I can't get over that grill design on the 2015 newer F-150. They lost me at Aluminum though.
Originally Posted by Frantz
Then why should Ford care what you want? Really it's like the folks whining about manual transmissions yet refuse to buy anything new. Ford makes truck for new truck buyers, not for the used market.
Because they are losing market share! They lose enough and you loyalists that buy whatever garbage they build end up with a Nissan XD or Honda Ridgeline. lol
I'd still take gas over diesel. I live in northern Canada and can vouch that all this garbage DEF system that was designed for California does not work up here. I manage a company with a fleet of of trucks that half are still running pre-DEF systems and the other half have the DEF equipment on and can honestly say 95% of all of our repairs are related to that. The day they design a diesel without that again maybe the day I buy one but not before that. I drive a 6.2 gas 2011 f350 and a 2.7 2016 f150. Works without hiccups in any weather. Both drive great.
Say what you want about brands and chassis, Ford has lost almost 50% of their market share and it is killing their sales. Mark my words Ford will pay the price and lose their quantitative modeling crown.
I've driven the Euro Rover diesel and would drive it all day and night over the Ecoboost. I've already ordered a Disco diesel for the wife to replace her Cadillac and Touareg TDI.
As for my fleet I may or may not fill some of the lighter duty rigs with EcoStroke's but being in the industry I know the potential tech and performance available, and for Ford to just throw global products at America isn't going to lead them back from the brink of losing their crown. And the Aluminum design for work truck fleets is a HUGE hurdle I probably won't be able to overcome. However if they apply the same forethought and investment to light duty diesels they have to flat plain crank design, Ecoboost's, Coyote, and Scorpion the sky is the limit. There is a saying in our industry of engineering, "Don't try and reinvent the wheel." The Ecoboost is trying to reinvent the wheel. Diesel is the wheel. Diesel is and always will be the most efficient combustion cycle possible with the least amount of moving parts. That's scientific fact whether you prefer a diesel or gas vehicle.
Paper champions don't mean anything or Ram would have 75% of the market. As in any experiment there are 100's if not thousands of factors. With those factors multiplying I infinitely so are customers buying habits, while people at Ford are being narrow minded in their research.
This is still America and foreign manufacturers sell to that while so many of the exec's in America have bought into the Socialist mindset, America as a whole is still the same blue blooded rebels we've always been. I can throw an CARB Certified tuner on an Ecodiesel and destroy an Ecoboost all day. Then there's the real world products. 85% of customers if not more never use the max payload or towing capacity of vehicles. In the real world I've never spoken with a single Ecoboost owner, that is honest, that gets 22+ MPG. And I can hypermill with the best. My brother on the other hand is like real world expert and drives like John Force and can find the worst case economy in a Tesla at probably 50 miles range. Hypermilling his F-150 ecoboost I was able to get best 19-21 on 35"s. His son's Ram Eco-diesel we have seen multiple 24's on 35"s and a 2" taller lift on more aggressive tread. The acceleration and ride regardless of paper crowns feels light years ahead of the F-150. We've been begging Ford for air ride and they gave us 10 cameras for the hand full of idiots that shouldn't be towing anyways. I take pride in being able to be a man and load up first try. Enjoy the pusification of what used to be the toughest trucks on the market.
In your defense the only F-150 customers that I've talked to that have seen good economy have been with the 2.7, but it's performance and capability is nowhere near either the Eco-boost or Eco-diesel. And I'm sure Ford's 10 speed will put the Eco-boost back in the same ballpark as the Ecodiesel's 8 speed. But the ride, interior, and esthetics of the Ram are far better than the Aluminum, Fireplace grill, Fake Cattle Hide, Leaf sprung, F-150.
80-90% of buyer will never tow or haul anywhere near the max capacity. They get in and test drive. As other manufactures find things they prefer like ride, comfort, leather quality, steel construction, endless USB ports, apps, bed lighting, DIESEL, and so on it is another sale and more market share lost, until your product has inevitably become obsolete. Capable is having a flagship that drive sales. For Dodge it's the Hemi. For Jeep it is utility. Ford Ram it is ride quality, interior, esthetics, steel construction, Cummins, and now the Ecodiesel. That is a large list.
I've never paid full price. Look at those prices as MSRP, as I price ranged them from so using Autotrader.
I purchase/source all of my families vehicles, all of our fleets, and for many friends. Here is a list of a couple:
2011 F250 KR $54k
2016 3500 Denali $58k
2017 3500 LH $62k
2015 1500 LH $48k
2012 f150 Platinum $47k
All new only gasser being the F-150. I talked him into coming down market from the 3/4-1 ton market. The F-150 Eco-boost is suffice for that market but we were very disappointed by the service record and quality. The ride was nice though. Not air ride nice but better than the GM half ton. I can't get over that grill design on the 2015 newer F-150. They lost me at Aluminum though.
Because they are losing market share! They lose enough and you loyalists that buy whatever garbage they build end up with a Nissan XD or Honda Ridgeline. lol
Ford isnt losing the market share. why build a manual transmission truck when 95% want the automatic? not much business sense to build something no one wants. most manual transmission guys dont buy new either. I would not have a diesel. Ive been around them, and they are too expensive for what they do.
Combining Chebby and GMC into TOTAL sales is a true flaw in your rational. That is like Toyota combining total sales with Lexus...or Nissan with Infiniti, etc. etc. etc.
Chebby is a brand. GMC is a brand. FORD is a brand. RAM is a brand.
FORD outsells all those brands! Period.
It is GOOD business strategy to combine costs in building a product...and help reduce production costs.
IMHO...FORD has nothing to worry about with the other brands taking the top spot!!
OBTW: Diesel is NOT the be all...end all of engines. They service a purpose, but in the US, the majority of consumers want and demand gas engines. Therefore, FORD listens to its customer base...and provides those products.
biz
He's not the only one who combines the two; a lot of people do it, and for good reason. http://www.autonews.com/article/2015...ales-rivalries
The Silverado and Sierra are essentially the same truck and roll off the same assembly lines, and are owned by the same parent company. Cadillac shares some GM platforms too, but an Escalade is a lot more different from a Tahoe, than a Silverado and Sierra are from each other, so people don't normally combine them. I've heard that the only reason for continuing the Sierra is for fleet sales (heard this back when I worked at a Chevy dealership). They sell them at the same dealerships as larger GMC trucks, so it offers them "one stop shopping" to fleet managers who are there for the larger trucks but also buy pickups.
But anyhow, I don't think most people would be willing to pay the premium for a diesel in a half-ton, that doesn't offer much advantage over their 3.5EB. If they needed a lot more towing torque than the EB has, they would buy a 3/4 or 1 ton. Also, the tightening diesel emissions standards make them a lot less attractive to people, since it hurts their efficiency, and most people are really annoyed by needing DEF.
You're really coming off like a zealot, here. And that's okay, because we all have our own opinions. I think yours are ill-informed though.
Originally Posted by houseofdiesel
In your defense the only F-150 customers that I've talked to that have seen good economy have been with the 2.7, but it's performance and capability is nowhere near either the Eco-boost or Eco-diesel.
The 2.7L IS an EcoBoost engine, and its measurable performance is vastly superior to the EcoDiesel. The EcoDiesel needs 17.4 seconds to complete the quarter mile, and 9.5 seconds to hit 60. That pales in comparison to the 2.7L EcoBoost, which hits 60 in 7.0 seconds, and just 15.0 in the quarter mile. It's not even close.
Originally Posted by houseofdiesel
Because they are losing market share! They lose enough and you loyalists that buy whatever garbage they build end up with a Nissan XD or Honda Ridgeline. lol
By which metric are they losing marketshare? Sales in 2015 were better than they've been in ten years!
You seem to be the type that adjusts facts around your opinion. That's okay, free speech and all. Doesn't make you right, though.
I'd still take gas over diesel. I live in northern Canada and can vouch that all this garbage DEF system that was designed for California does not work up here. I manage a company with a fleet of of trucks that half are still running pre-DEF systems and the other half have the DEF equipment on and can honestly say 95% of all of our repairs are related to that. The day they design a diesel without that again maybe the day I buy one but not before that. I drive a 6.2 gas 2011 f350 and a 2.7 2016 f150. Works without hiccups in any weather. Both drive great.
And hence why Ford's market share has shrunk from 46% of truck marks shares to 29%. Most people if buying a V8 HD will go for the Hemi, Power Wagon, or LS powered GM's. As for the 2.7l if you are buying solely on economy then the Canyon/Colorado's will start eating those sales with 31+ mpg.
Originally Posted by brokenleg
Ford isnt losing the market share. why build a manual transmission truck when 95% want the automatic? not much business sense to build something no one wants. most manual transmission guys dont buy new either. I would not have a diesel. Ive been around them, and they are too expensive for what they do.
I bought a brand new 2013 Ram just for this reason and MPG from the Cummins over the Ford SD. If that accounts for 12% of Rams sales that's 4-8% of sales going to Ram from GM and Ford. Lost market is lost sales. If Ford gains .5 mpg from sloping the front end on the F-150 vs the Atlas design and loses 50,000 annual customers because they thing the mini van front clip is fugly, the MPG gain doesn't mean crap for their bottom line regardless of a trophy being added to their chest for MPG. If you **** off enough customers it doesn't matter that you have a hand full of loyalists left. They have insane Union and Supplier financial obligations that they will never be able to meet and fulfill if they continue to lose market share.
As for the CARB equipment I guess that's why many refuse to comply. Ford's last remaining controlled market share is the HD market at roughly 48%. The 6.7 Scorpion is the only thing holding that market share. I've had zero problems with my 2011 6.7 SD. I can't remember exactly but I think I read a report that the Scorpion accounts for 66-75% of all SD sales. My DPF Equipment and Medium Duty Semi's are another story. Mark my words. Ford is going to lose the HD market share because we as a large share are not going to fill our fleets with Aluminum SD's.
Originally Posted by Delta Echo
But anyhow, I don't think most people would be willing to pay the premium for a diesel in a half-ton, that doesn't offer much advantage over their 3.5EB. If they needed a lot more towing torque than the EB has, they would buy a 3/4 or 1 ton. Also, the tightening diesel emissions standards make them a lot less attractive to people, since it hurts their efficiency, and most people are really annoyed by needing DEF.
They better do something to stop the bleeding. Lost market and lost sales are lost sales. And doubling down or putting all your eggs in one basket is proving to really hurt Ford's market share, especially if the market collapses. Bottom line is as long as they continue to not offer what people like me are being offered elsewhere the trend will continue and Ford will lose their coveted crown of bed selling pickup.
You're really coming off like a zealot, here. And that's okay, because we all have our own opinions. I think yours are ill-informed though.
You seem to be the type that adjusts facts around your opinion. That's okay, free speech and all. Doesn't make you right, though.
I supplied data that shows how F-150's shrinking sales are killing Ford's market share. About 60-75% of F-series sales are Super Duties. If Ford sales increase year over year by 5% and GM's sales year over year increase by 5%, but Ram's sales increase 18%, Ford and GM lost market share to Ram. That is 5-10% of sales lost because you are being narrow minded. If you continue the same business plan, the results will not change but continue. If Ford lead the way and developed the Ranger first, or diesel 1/2 tons first then those sales would be sales taken from other manufacturers. It economics and finance 101. If the market crashes yes I pull back my production, but to regain those loses I expand my product lines to retain profits and market value. The trophies are meaningless if you are giving away sales and shrinking your market value. That's sales lost, nothing zealotry about it, just business fundamentals. But Ford's decisions are obviously no longer about sales at all or what the majority of customers want. Most just leave and don't speak their mind. A good business owner wants people to complain before losing their business. What happened to the America where the business catered to the customer and not the other way around?
Say what you want about brands and chassis, Ford has lost almost 50% of their market share and it is killing their sales. Mark my words Ford will pay the price and lose their quantitative modeling crown.
I've driven the Euro Rover diesel and would drive it all day and night over the Ecoboost. I've already ordered a Disco diesel for the wife to replace her Cadillac and Touareg TDI.
As for my fleet I may or may not fill some of the lighter duty rigs with EcoStroke's but being in the industry I know the potential tech and performance available, and for Ford to just throw global products at America isn't going to lead them back from the brink of losing their crown. And the Aluminum design for work truck fleets is a HUGE hurdle I probably won't be able to overcome. However if they apply the same forethought and investment to light duty diesels they have to flat plain crank design, Ecoboost's, Coyote, and Scorpion the sky is the limit. There is a saying in our industry of engineering, "Don't try and reinvent the wheel." The Ecoboost is trying to reinvent the wheel. Diesel is the wheel. Diesel is and always will be the most efficient combustion cycle possible with the least amount of moving parts. That's scientific fact whether you prefer a diesel or gas vehicle.
Paper champions don't mean anything or Ram would have 75% of the market. As in any experiment there are 100's if not thousands of factors. With those factors multiplying I infinitely so are customers buying habits, while people at Ford are being narrow minded in their research.
This is still America and foreign manufacturers sell to that while so many of the exec's in America have bought into the Socialist mindset, America as a whole is still the same blue blooded rebels we've always been. I can throw an CARB Certified tuner on an Ecodiesel and destroy an Ecoboost all day. Then there's the real world products. 85% of customers if not more never use the max payload or towing capacity of vehicles. In the real world I've never spoken with a single Ecoboost owner, that is honest, that gets 22+ MPG. And I can hypermill with the best. My brother on the other hand is like real world expert and drives like John Force and can find the worst case economy in a Tesla at probably 50 miles range. Hypermilling his F-150 ecoboost I was able to get best 19-21 on 35"s. His son's Ram Eco-diesel we have seen multiple 24's on 35"s and a 2" taller lift on more aggressive tread. The acceleration and ride regardless of paper crowns feels light years ahead of the F-150. We've been begging Ford for air ride and they gave us 10 cameras for the hand full of idiots that shouldn't be towing anyways. I take pride in being able to be a man and load up first try. Enjoy the pusification of what used to be the toughest trucks on the market.
In your defense the only F-150 customers that I've talked to that have seen good economy have been with the 2.7, but it's performance and capability is nowhere near either the Eco-boost or Eco-diesel. And I'm sure Ford's 10 speed will put the Eco-boost back in the same ballpark as the Ecodiesel's 8 speed. But the ride, interior, and esthetics of the Ram are far better than the Aluminum, Fireplace grill, Fake Cattle Hide, Leaf sprung, F-150.
80-90% of buyer will never tow or haul anywhere near the max capacity. They get in and test drive. As other manufactures find things they prefer like ride, comfort, leather quality, steel construction, endless USB ports, apps, bed lighting, DIESEL, and so on it is another sale and more market share lost, until your product has inevitably become obsolete. Capable is having a flagship that drive sales. For Dodge it's the Hemi. For Jeep it is utility. Ford Ram it is ride quality, interior, esthetics, steel construction, Cummins, and now the Ecodiesel. That is a large list.
I've never paid full price. Look at those prices as MSRP, as I price ranged them from so using Autotrader.
I purchase/source all of my families vehicles, all of our fleets, and for many friends. Here is a list of a couple:
2011 F250 KR $54k
2016 3500 Denali $58k
2017 3500 LH $62k
2015 1500 LH $48k
2012 f150 Platinum $47k
All new only gasser being the F-150. I talked him into coming down market from the 3/4-1 ton market. The F-150 Eco-boost is suffice for that market but we were very disappointed by the service record and quality. The ride was nice though. Not air ride nice but better than the GM half ton. I can't get over that grill design on the 2015 newer F-150. They lost me at Aluminum though.
Because they are losing market share! They lose enough and you loyalists that buy whatever garbage they build end up with a Nissan XD or Honda Ridgeline. lol
TFL barely got 17mpg while test driving the Titan diesel, it's an over hyped joke. The 5.6 got close to 18 on their test.
Hey house, just go on over to the RAM forum. I'm there too, but not so much lately. Anyway, seems to me that you like RAM Ecodiesel better than F150. I like Rams too, but I'd never buy a 1/2 ton diesel. I've owned about 5 diesels over the years, so I know a bit about them. From what I've researched about Ecodiesel, they have a serious problem at about 100,000 miles. Blow to smithereens or some such. For my money so far, Ford makes the best truck.
About 520,000 F150s sold, and about 245,000 Super Duties. Meaning F150s make up nearly 70% of gross sales. Roughly 30% of those are the 3.5L EB, and 30% of those are 2.7L EB. Yep, nobody wants 'em.
Back to the point at hand I suppose. I'd love a diesel half-ton if the value were right. Would have to be capable of towing, deliver outstanding efficiency, and come at a modest premium over the top-level gas engine. Something a bit more powerful than the EcoDiesel would be perfect.
About 520,000 F150s sold, and about 245,000 Super Duties. Meaning F150s make up nearly 70% of gross sales. Roughly 30% of those are the 3.5L EB, and 30% of those are 2.7L EB. Yep, nobody wants 'em.
Hey house, just go on over to the RAM forum. I'm there too, but not so much lately. Anyway, seems to me that you like RAM Ecodiesel better than F150. I like Rams too, but I'd never buy a 1/2 ton diesel. I've owned about 5 diesels over the years, so I know a bit about them. From what I've researched about Ecodiesel, they have a serious problem at about 100,000 miles. Blow to smithereens or some such. For my money so far, Ford makes the best truck.
Most Euro Diesels call for service of the timing chain in that time frame. Our F-150 Eco-boost exploded at 100k so does that mean that all are? It also blew out a couple CV's and the front ring gear in the F-150. Not to mention that majority of the Ford Stealership service area was loaded with F-150's with the cabs removed for engine failures. Have you owned or driven the Ram 1500 with air ride and the 8 speed? Maybe I should go test drive the aluminum F-150 with the 10 speed and see if it comes close to comparing. Cause from my experience the 1500 Longhorn Laramie is light years ahead of the F-150 Platinum and is returning 15% and above better economy.
Originally Posted by Tom
More speculation not backed up by fact. Here's data for 2015:
About 520,000 F150s sold, and about 245,000 Super Duties. Meaning F150s make up nearly 70% of gross sales. Roughly 30% of those are the 3.5L EB, and 30% of those are 2.7L EB. Yep, nobody wants 'em.
I wish they had to actually produce the complete breakdown. If those statistics are correct then I stand corrected, but the F450 and F550 sales are missing from those data graphs. I admit they probably do not make up 300,000 trucks. Market share lost is sales lost. Throwing money at the problem is the only thing starving off the pack of wolves at Ford's tail and it won't last if they neglect the fringe, if that's what I am, customers. Especially when we are fleet owners and operators. The data reflected in that link didn't specify the $10k incentives Ford was offering to get people into those trucks either. If they had a 5% manuals, 15-30% diesel, or 10-30% mid size owners segment they wouldn't have to offer incentives at all. Who knows maybe in 10-15 years when all trucks are mandated to be Aluminum and diesel's are banned by the enviro anti-science retards I'll come around.
And I can't recall where I read it but CARB and the EPA have regulations set to hit forced induction gas motors in 2020. So it will be interesting to see how the anti-engineering anti-science mandates effect the Ecoboosts. Maybe they will have the tech nailed down by then with the diesel market being the guinea pig.
Back to the point at hand I suppose. I'd love a diesel half-ton if the value were right. Would have to be capable of towing, deliver outstanding efficiency, and come at a modest premium over the top-level gas engine. Something a bit more powerful than the EcoDiesel would be perfect.
As was my intent and I bet if they invested what they did in the 2.7 EB, Scorpion, or flat plane cranks for Le Mans, they'd sell hundreds of thousands diesel F-150's. Instead they are returning to another partnership like the International/Navistar ordeal and just slapping Rover diesels into the F-150.
I read the earlier data I was referencing wrong. HD sales in 2010 Ford controlled 50% of the market. I wonder what percentage of their lost market value then is due to Ram's 1500 and what percentage is due to Ram's Cummins, because Gm too has lost huge market shares to Ram, but I could care less about GM. I'm not trumpeting Ram because I want to buy Rams. I'm explaining why I'm buying Ram's and GM's though I've always been a Ford guy. Ford could easily have me back as a customer if they offered a class leading diesel F-150 that even beat the Colorado/Canyon on mpg and offered better quality interiors throughout the F-series with air ride suspension that would make my life long GM owning father ditch his Escalade. Hell I'd even dump the H3T Alpha I picked up my daughter for it.
11-05-2016, 11:18 AM
