You were close!

Yeah, I don't know what to make of Moog anymore. They used to have good a group of people in their engineering department and then like all the Federal-Mogul groups, Ichan slashed and burned all the R&D facilities in the 2007-2009 timeframe. Regional salespeople too. And with all the companies moving off-shore it's getting tough to make a call.

Did Mr. D state what they are going to use?

 

Nepaco, I think, getting it balanced too. I used to work with him back in the day. Maybe I'll stop by when I pick it up. And yes Sean they where,plus they where the heavy duty one's

 

Mr. D, good rep but never personally depth with them.

NEAPCO, New England Auto Products Corporation. They've been around a very long time, went through acquisitions and mergers like all the auto supplier companies, I believe a mix of USA and Chineese ownership now, worldwide supplier. I remember they bought Ford's driveshaft manufacturing during Fords shedding of divisions to reduce Union involvement. Supplier to NAPA. I've used NEAPCO for the u-joints on Gravely tractor driveshafts as they were the OE.

All that doesn't mean squat unless the guy building driveshafts likes them

 

I felt a little bit better when he said it wasn't my fault. I wonder if I can get Moog to eat some of this expense. They said it was common problem

 

They had a help line and on-line process. Uncle Carl might only offer a replacement part or cost, but it would be worth a try. I remember about a decade ago the wiper division developed a rubber blade formulation that just dissolved contacting the road de-icers so they were replacing windshields.

Did they say the Moogs were coming apart?

 

Ya, blow up brand he called them. Said he wouldn't even put a drive shaft in his balancing machine with them on the drive saft

 

That sucks! I was always a big fan of Moog. Sure am glad I just replaced my entire suspension with as many Moog parts as possible.

Did the driveshaft guy say anything about Spicer? IIRC they were the bomb ten or twelve years ago.

 

I do t know about y'all,but I'm getting tried of having to do jobs twice due to substandard parts that I pay good money for. The government got to step in before there are a lot of deaths.

 

Aftermarket auto parts are driven by pricing. Over the thirty years working for the same company within engineering development and testing I've seen all of the product lines being driven by price only. The public like to believe it's the greed on the company and executives, and to a minor extent that's true, but the real driver is pricing. It's why I sat through meeting where discussions covered why plants were closed in the northern sections of our country, to the southern states, to Mexico, to China, and lastly then to India. I haven't been with them for almost a decade so God only knows the latest migration. During all those discussions, everyone in that room was dismayed what it did to the past employees, to the quality of parts, and never about how much more money the company could make. It truly was move with the competition or die.

This progression started decades ago. And I can certainly say the rise of nationwide stores such as Autozone, Advance, O'Rileys, and later the advent on on-line marketing such as RockAuto put tremendous pressure on the industry. The competition of of these avenues to gain customer share meant that they were looking for their lowest cost supplier. The person walking into the store always was looking for the best price. It's human nature. But as much as the people want to pay the least for products, they want a good income for themselves. Most companies make 3% profit on gross sales. I watched as labor costs and environmental regulations closed the last full scale aftermarket rotor plant in this country and it got packed up and moved to China.

Right now you can buy a Dana U-Joint for about $35, $45 if it comes in a Motorcraft stamp of approval. Or a Moog, AC Delco etc for about $15. Or even go down to $4-5. Which U-Joint does the average walk in customer buy at AZ/Advance. Especially with more price pressure of a discount code? What do those auto parts stores say to the supplier about what their customer wants and the price point they need?

We can have the same discussion about anything. I bought one of the last 34" HDTV tube sets made in this country 18 years ago for $2800. Walk into Walmart and one get a 34" for less then $200. Tech has driven part of that reduction for sure, but not making the TV in the US labor and regulation market was a huge driver. And now the US assembly line worker who made that TV is now selling them at Walmart.

If my old company made the the same brake pad for the 89 T-Bird that cost ~$100 at the dealership then it would cost around $300 if still made in the now closed Virginia plant. Is anyone here inclined to pay $300 for a set of brake pads? No.

The government is not going to regulate aftermarket auto parts, nor do you want them to. There's no regulations, to me, the most important safety parts on cars and trucks, brake materials, unlike Europe. In fact when NHTSA looked at doing so years ago it determined there was no need. If they are not going to do that, there are not going to do drivetrain or steering system parts.

Market quality and pricing is the market driver. So what do we want to pay for a quality part. Most nationwide chains mentioned about aren't worried about warrantee returns until the handling or customer complains effect their bottom line. Broken U-Joint, it costs them close to nothing to get the manufacture to replace the part. Not a problem for them. Most retail items get a 100% markup at that level except at discount chains. Maybe 25-50% at the distribution level. 10-15% at the manufacturers level. NAPA had an additional distributor level so that cost them dearly. What do you think that $4 U-joint over at RockAuto cost to make.

Most parts I buy from the dealership. No, wait. The STEALERSHIP. The one source that requires a full level of quality control and manufacturing specs that no retail chain requires. But yet they are called the STEALERSHIP. And even for their aftermarket Motorcraft brake parts lineup they were the ones who put pricing pressure on closing the last aftermarket rotor manufacturing plant in the US and moving to China in order to compete with AZ/Advance/O'Rileys pricing pressure. You can buy the rotor made at that same China plant at Advance for less money then the Ford dealer, but it doesn't have the same quality control for grain structure, machined finish or runout. Depends on what you want to pay.

Off the soapbox rant, and it wasn't directed at you Per4mance.

And I'm guilty of installing a Moog tie rod end on my truck just this past week. Pricing, you know. A decade ago with a six figure income, it would have been a Motorcraft brand.

 

It isn't just auto parts, it's everywhere you look! Everything is made like crap these days.

I do a lot of residential repairs, and I can tell you from experience that the quality of most everything at Home Depot and Lowe's has noticeably dropped while the prices have gone up significantly. Anything made of metal has gotten thinner or been replaced with plastic, including light fixtures and faucets, 12 gauge wire is starting to look like 14 gauge, all forms of tubing and pipe getting thinner walls. Just yesterday I picked through an entire pallet of 2x4s to get eight that weren't bowed, twisted, or split.

In order to get acceptable quality car parts locally, I HAVE to go to the dealer almost always or order online. The chain stores' in-house brands and cheap rebuilds like Brake Best or Cardone are unimpressive to say the least. But like Jack said, if all people are buying is the cheap stuff, that's all they're going to stock. We have become a Wal-Mart nation...

 

This is why I love having a spare car. I can mail order good stuff instead of being at the mercy of the parts stores nearby. Places like dennys driveshaft, drivetrain america, and northern drivetrain carry all the Spicer parts you'll need. Sometimes you can take the p/n and find it on Amazon prime, I've done that with u-joints for my wrangler (a TJ rubicon, the reason I have this truck - to tow it).

Dennys Driveshaft and Driveline Parts High Speed High RPM Balanced Steel and Aluminum Drive Shaft Specialist
https://www.drivetrainamerica.com/
Northern Drivetrain, LLC

 

Chris,

Oh, we have. There was a story a few months ago listing the largest employers in each state. As I went through it, Walmarts kept coming up over and over. The second largest by memory were some university systems. So it's mostly government and Walmart. You could cynically say the haves and the have nots. But with that we get me off on my political rant.

I agree with Home products as well. The same situation exists due to the market. A few years ago I stripped down some 14ga wire doing rework and I had to stop to read the insulator labeling to make sure it was 14. And it breaks easily on a bend through a hole in a stud.

 

Sad to say and not trying to start a political debate , American gov has let this happen, larger company's moved over seas for les wage production, it's in every market, electronics, home repair, auto, and so on , it first started when steel moved shutting down American jobs just so they could prevail a heathy pay out, our forest are being bought up by China as we speak so they can ship it , mass produce hardwood flooring , furniture and what ever else they sell back to the U.S.,I for one have no choice but I still look for USA made products, and getting harder everyday, made ( henco de Mexico) ford did it too, but they didn't do the buy out like other auto makers , in my Cattle is USA/ USD grade select 1 been this way for many years, unfortunately the grading just like lumber has dropped why ? Foreign trade, We need to get this Country back stop foreign in shipping and get our factory back up and running , quit buying foreign products ( kind a hard to do).

 

Very well said! I wish I could rep you an that but need to spread some love

Thank you for that commentary!

 

Start your own manufacturing company and you'll quickly see why so many jobs in manufacturing went overseas.

I did just that (twice, actually), and my desire to create American manufacturing jobs quickly succumbed to the realities of doing business in America today.