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1967 - 1972 F-100 & Larger F-Series Trucks Discuss the Bumpsides Ford Truck

Possibly adding a power....oil filter

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Old Nov 1, 2015 | 10:02 AM
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Possibly adding a power....oil filter

Since the Dump Truck is such low duty, and will sit around a lot I have been considering an oil priming system to reduce the start up damage that was obvious on the tear-down. The main bearings in the caps were completely swiped and this thing only has 74k miles on it. Don't know if I'll do it or not, but right now it looks like this:
12V Oil/Fuel pump, bronze gears and housing, 3.7gpm , ~$70
Remote oil filter kit ~$35 (so the pump can get 'inline,' more on that later)
Oil Check Valve ~$40
Various fittings and hose. this is where you can get killed if you say go with -6AN stuff. Yikes!
That rig will give a complete 5 quart pass in 21 seconds give or take. I looked at the sandwich filter adapters and concluded they just allow a bypass (being in parallel) with the oil filter so that's out. Take the oil feed, put in a Wye; one side to pump, one side to check valve. Then a Wye on the other side of the pump and also check valve to bring it back together. The check valve ensures we don't just cavitate and the two Wye's give a bypass to the pump so it is not a restriction in normal engine operation. I'd just operate it as a switch under the dash. Might put a timer on it later if I do this.
 
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Old Nov 4, 2015 | 04:50 PM
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Before you do that consider maybe your engine's problem was the PO using cheap oil filters. And/or cheap oil. Cheapie oil filters have less filtering media and no internal check valve. So they allow upstream oil to go through them back down in the pan. So on start up the oil pump has to fill all this back up before the bearings get any oil. I suggest using Ford Motorcraft part number FL1A.
 
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Old Nov 4, 2015 | 06:37 PM
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I do not think you do not need to do anything heroic if you use a high-quality filter with a good check valve. Motorcraft is fine, as Jeff said, or Puralator.
My 240 with a horizontal filter used to rap rods to beat the band for three seconds. I changed brands, the problem went away. The cheapo "F" and "W" filters work okay on engines where the filter sits vertically, like GM. But if it sits at an angle or horizontally, the chamber leaks dry.

Ford engineers knew what they were doing.
 
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Old Nov 4, 2015 | 07:08 PM
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Sounds to me like you're looking for an engine pre-luber like an Accusump by Canton Racing Products: Accusump Engine Oiling Systems
 
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Old Nov 4, 2015 | 07:35 PM
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Yeah, the Power Oil Filter title is misleading. I am looking to pre-lube before firing. As I said, this thing is going to sit. A lot. Additionally I have been reading up on the FE oiling system and deficiencies thereof. I did open up the main bearing ports to match the holes in the main bearings. The drag racers are against this as it may weaken the saddles. The dump truck isn't going for best quarter mile time, so no worries there. I am going with a high volume pump (it's only 25% more than stock) and am still on the fence about restrictors in the oil ports on the heads. Some calculations are necessary. this isn't a Galaxie cruising at highway speeds so the restrictors are most likely not necessary. Additionally, the crank journals were polished so I'm running a little looser than factory. The low RPM range this engine will see as normal operation I believe also justifies an HV pump. Thoughts?
 
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Old Nov 4, 2015 | 09:05 PM
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For the FE, I suggest restricting oiling to the heads, a high volume oil pump, a windage tray, and an extra quart of oil in the pan.... plus to hedge your bets, an Accusump.
 
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Old Nov 5, 2015 | 02:44 PM
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Or just go with a kit like this Engine Pre Lube System Insta-Lube Kit , not saying that in particular as there is plenty out there. Just remember the kits depend on the oil filter having a very good anti drain back valve.
 
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Old Nov 6, 2015 | 06:31 AM
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Nice options, but I'm going for cheap. I did look into the dry sump configurations for my Mustang a while back, and they aren't cheap even when you roll your own.

Windage Tray: I'm thinking not necessary as this thing will live 99 & 44/100 of the time under 2K RPM. Recall, it is a Dump Truck.
Add a quart: That's just good insurance. I need to pickup a dipstick for a Mustang if I already don't have one.
Oil Restrictors in the Heads: This I'm still on the fence about this as it is the high pressure from high RPM at cruise speeds (which in this case is 45MPH, lol) that cause the trapping of oil in the valve area. At the same time, that lowers the oil flow to the heads at low RPM which is where this thing is going to live. Possibly the HV pump and restrictors could potentially be a wash in this situation. At the very least I'm going to do a spreadsheet of flow rates with various orifices (restrictors) to compare to stock in the RPM range of interest. And I will most likely end up opening up the return port in the head(s) because oil sitting there is doing just about nothing.
 

Last edited by Rasputin53; Nov 6, 2015 at 12:36 PM. Reason: added concerns/explanations
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Old Nov 6, 2015 | 01:37 PM
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I would not sweat it. There are tons of these motors living long lives without any fancy oiling.

If anything, if it sits for long periods, I would crank it for a few moments before touching the throttle(that is how I start all my hot rods). That will give it a chance to start moving oil before it fires. If it starts too easy, then pull the coil wire(or put a shut off switch under dash).

Nothing worse then to hear someone start their car and hear it rattle its brains out til it gets oil pressure. Ugh.

Not that a preluber is bad, but you can work around it.
 
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Old Nov 6, 2015 | 05:13 PM
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Accusumps or the like are cool. Always wanted to use one. Just fill it up before you shut down and dump it before startup. Oil Pressure gage pops up to 30 psi or so before you hit the key. Seen them used in speed boats a lot.
 
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Old Nov 7, 2015 | 09:31 AM
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Like op said these old FEs with low oil pressure at idle have thousands of miles on them and many with 200+ for the lucky ones.

If it was me, I'd would lower the choke rpm like I have done on all my vehicles down too 1200 rpm at cold starting.

I think that 1800 rpm on a cool azz motor does more damage then anything else.

But oil stays in on the bearings a long time the ring will slowly bleed out faster.
Many engine sit for long periods of time an get on going Energizer Bunny
Using Heavier oil may help bleed with off, or an additive like STP.
my 02 cents
Orich
 
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Old Nov 7, 2015 | 09:45 AM
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Like op said these old FEs with low oil pressure at idle have thousands of miles on them and many with 200+ for the lucky ones.

If it was me, I would lower the choke rpm if auto choke like, I have done on all my vehicles down too 1200 rpm or less at cold starting.

I think that 1800 rpm on a cool azz motor does more damage then anything else.

But oil stays in on the bearings a long time then the rings do that will slowly bleed out faster.
Many engine sit for long periods of time an get on going Energizer Bunny
Using Heavier oil may help bleed with off, or an additive like STP.
my 02 cents
Orich
 
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Old Nov 7, 2015 | 12:43 PM
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Originally Posted by orich
Like op said these old FEs with low oil pressure at idle have thousands of miles on them and many with 200+ for the lucky ones.

If it was me, I would lower the choke rpm if auto choke like, I have done on all my vehicles down too 1200 rpm or less at cold starting.

I think that 1800 rpm on a cool azz motor does more damage then anything else.

But oil stays in on the bearings a long time then the rings do that will slowly bleed out faster.
Many engine sit for long periods of time an get on going Energizer Bunny
Using Heavier oil may help bleed with off, or an additive like STP.
my 02 cents
Orich
Hey Rich, what do you think about using a partial synthetic oil in a fresh FE like OP has?
 
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Old Nov 7, 2015 | 04:26 PM
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It's not the low op at idle that is my major concern. It's the fact that after 74k miles, the original bearings on the crank were *all* swiped which I will attribute to long spans between runs. Granted, I probably will not put another 74k on this thing, but for ~$200 to basically ensure bulletproof I see that as a reasonable investment. I like the AccuSump system. It's just a classic ballast tank. I have some leftovers from my automation days (air actuators) that I think I can just swap the seal material on the piston and change the end plate and have that type system. Even if I have to make a new piston, NBD, my little 9x20 Enco can handle that and then some.
 
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Old Nov 7, 2015 | 06:03 PM
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Originally Posted by JEFFFAFA
Hey Rich, what do you think about using a partial synthetic oil in a fresh FE like OP has?
Hey Jeff about 10-12 yrs ago, I tried using some synthetic oil. I was given a few qts and added one qt. mixed with my oil non synthetic oil. I was using 20-50 wt. then. I now forget what wt. the synthetic oil was I tried.

I still had my c/o camper on at that time then heading up too Yosemite for about 5 days. I forget the oil Wt grade as I got it from my ex-mother in-law that my ex-father in-law bought and never used before he pass on to another place.
I'm not sure where he could have gone , it could have very well been a Hot or Cold place at that that time.

I noticed my oil psi gauge bouncing around more then normal on about 90-95* temp of day.
I thought, I just better stop and check the oil level. Sure as ***** it was down a qt low.
I had just about one hundred miles on it after, I added that one qt. of full synthetic oil. Yup one qt. low it was now. But was running in 3rd gear a lot going up hill 40-45 mph and like all fe's after the newness wear off they all get oil leaks from one place or another a little until ya just say the hell with trying keep fixing them as the fix and another place will start leaking

Jeff if a guy could set up the piston skirt clearance to about 005-7ths IIRC. like those little 4cyl Toyota to help cut down on cyl. blow by may hold the synthetic oil in it. The lower end bearing clearance is about the same on both the lower ends. Then get it all sealed up from other oil leaks.

An once the cam is broken in and the engine is not wound up to high to float the lifters but in the normal rpm ranges. should be all right.
Orich
 
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