My '87 had been sitting all winter and the battery was low so I put the charger on it. My dumba** reversed the cables and I saw the magic smoke coming out of the charger after 3-5 seconds, and jerked the lead clamps off. The charger was toast, but I got another, and the battery charged up fine. I started the truck and it ran well. Thought I'd dodged a bullet.

Fast forward two weeks, I went to start it and it ran 5 seconds or so, stalled and refused to start.

I've got power at the ignition coil, and have diagnosed the ICM, according to this diagnostic, (Part 2 -Ford Ignition Module Test. Distributor Mounted Module (ICM).) it's missing the PIP signal. Before I replace the PIP sensor in the distributor, is there a chance I fried the EEC?

And is the PIP sensor the same thing as the distributor pickup coil? I can't find the PIP sensor (so called) on Rockauto"s site.

I'm getting a code 14 out of the OBD1 self test.

Thanks in advance,

Alto

 

To replace the pickup in the distributor, you must take it apart. You have to drive a roll pin out of the gear, press the gear off the shaft, remove the shaft from the bowl, remove the pickup from the bowl, install a new pickup, and then the shaft, press the gear into place while making sure the hole in the gear aligns with the hole in the shaft, then the roll pin. Good luck. Check for rebuilt distributor prices as they are not much more than a pickup, gear and roll pin. I did it once, and never again.
If you are getting codes from the ECM, it likely is functional.
Did you follow the test tree you provided verbatim, using a LED and not skipping any steps? If not, don't spend any money on parts until you do.
The pickup in the distributor has a 'rubber'(?) thing that carries the leads for the TFI to plug into. The material turns to goo over time, and allows the leads to possibly disconnect from the TFI. I would pull the distributor and check that the leads are connected tightly, especially if you have recently replaced the TFI. The leads WILL move out of the way to avoid making a connection especially when you don't want them to do so.
TFI is Thick Film Ignition ... the ignition module.
tom

 

Thanks for the reply, tomw. I did follow the step except I used a test light instead of the LED (I know, I know, but I'm busy at work and didn't have time to do a Radio Shack project yesterday). I'll swing by and pickup an LED after work and repeat the test.

It does sound like it would be easier to replace the distributor with a reman. It's hard enough to get to on the 2.9, buried as is. An since those old TFIs are problem children just replacing the whole thing seems best.

Thank you again for your time, tomw!

Alto

 

I redid the diagnostic in post 1, with the LED setup described, and got no flashing.

I replaced the distributor with a reman from Rockauto. No change, still cranks fine but won't start.

Is the eec next, or is there some other test I can run?

Alto

 

I am sure you checked crankshaft position and cam position for TDC on #1, and the rotor pointing to the #1 plug wire before installing the distributor as it won't work unless you did.
Did you see any sparks? Meaning, did you pull a plug wire and install it onto a plug, ground the outer shell of the plug and crank the engine. It should spark if the ignition is working.
The computer will fiddle with timing after the engine reaches operating temperature, but before that the timing is fixed at 10BTDC, and the base timing set, by distributor position. It does nothing really until warmed up. If it were running, you would pull the jumper {little rectangular block inline with one of the distributor wires} to let the distributor alone control timing. That is what you do to set the base timing.
You may have lost fuel pressure. You can test for residual pressure after turning the key to ON for a short time by depressing the center core of the schrader valve on the injector fuel rail. If you don't hear the pump run when the key is first turned to ON, check the rollover switch under the glove box under the heater core at the top of the carpet/floor mat. Check the fuel pump relay on top of the ECM.
tom

 

Tom,

I used the procedure outlined in the distributor instructions, which was to place index marks between the distributor body and engine, and index rotor position on edge of distributor. With that method I'm not supposed to have go to TDC, as long as the motor isn't cranked over. The new distributor went in with all index marks lined up.

The inertia switch is good and I've got fuel pressure.

I'll check for spark when it stops raining.

Thanks for your thoughts.

Alto

 

No spark. I'm going through the PIP and ICM tests again.

Alto

 

PIP and ICM tests the same- no flashing from led setup.

 

Well, either the LED is not functional... or has reversed polarity ... or the TFI &/or pickup in the bowl of the distribulator is not working.
Set the distributor and crank where you can replace it as you did previously, remove it from the truck, (sorry to suggest, it is just easier to connect to the pins for testing) and run through the tests from the beginning.
I did not look at the LED setup from the diagnostic page, but expect it has a limiting resistor in there somewhere to prevent the LED from burning out. Make sure the LED is still functional before condemning the distributor.
If it passes the tests, then the problem is elsewhere.
You should, from memory, have 12V to the coil with the ignition "ON". You can actually produce a spark if things line up, by cycling the key from Off to On and back. The coil will power up, build a field, and it will decay when the key is moved to OFF. Anyway, you should check voltages once more to determine that the ignition switch is working.
tom

 

The LED does have polarity- it has a black and red lead and the black is neg, the red always tests to B+. The instructions are clear on that and I followed them to the letter. The LED lights up on battery power, so it's good.

All at KOEO;

I've got B+ at ignition coil. ( Ignition Switch should be good.)
I've got B+ at Ignition Control Module . (#4 circuit wire)
I've got ground at #6 circuit wire at ICM.

All these tests performed twice.

The other tests require cranking the engine, so removing the distributor wouldn't help there.

What I don't have is a switching signal from the ICM to the coil, or from the PIP to the ICM.

I removed and visually inspected the EEC, and no burned spots or swelled caps.

From the way I described marking the distributor and rotor, could I be 180 off on timing? I should still see the ICM and PIP switching signal on the LED, I think.

Alto

 

If you didn't move the crankshaft, you should not be 180 off. If you were to remove the distributor, and turn the gear by hand, you should get sparks out of the coil. You *might* have to ground the distributor body.
From your description, I think you have a bum re-man distributor. It has the TFI mounted to the distributor? or is it the remote model? I don't know when it was remoted. If distributor mounted, then it should be covered by warranty as defective.
This system needs power and ground to operate, spin the rotor, and sparky you get.
The computer doesn't enter the picture until it's warmed up. I don't have a diagram, mental or paper, but if you give it power and ground, it should spark when spun. After all that is what it does when the engine turns the aux shaft and thus dist & oil pump drive...
Again, if you left the crankshaft un-rotated, it should go back without problem. The only thing you would/could do to upset the timing is not bias the gear 'backwards' a bit so when it is engaged and put in place, the spiral of the teeth rotate the rotor back to the original mark made. If you note, the rotor will turn a bit as it is removed from the engine, so you have to account for that when you put it back in place.
tom

 

It's the distributor mounted TFI, and it's funny you should bring up turning the gear by hand. I took the old dist out, grounded it's body, hooked up the black wire of the LED setup to the PIP circuit of the TFI and turned the gear by hand and watched the LED flash. It eventually stayed on while turning just to confuse issues, but I think that tells me the hall effect sensor is operating.
Thanks for clarifying the role of the computer, that saved me time and money.

And yes, I transferred the index markings from the old dist to the new, and counter-clockwised the gear a little so that the rotor ended up at its index mark when the dist was fully seated.

 

I'd suspect the remanned dist, too, except I remembered that I wasn't getting the PIP signal out of the old dist either, which was what led me to replace it.
Just thinking out loud here, but not getting signal switching from the old or replacement dist might indicate insufficient voltage capacity TO the ICM. My last test with the old dist, I had the old dist hooked up with a jumper supplying B+ through the LED, and I got the LED to flash turning the dist shaft. That didn't happen while it was still installed and cranking. I have B+ at the ICM, but I haven't load tested the supply wiring to see if the wire is load capable.

Those LEDs are crap, the first one went bad after four tests, and would no longer light even by the battery.

I swung by and got another, and after the old dist test, it would no longer light up, even by direct connection to the battery. They're rated 12-16V, so I don't know what's wrong with them.

I'm going to check the ignition switch tomorrow, as I've replaced it twice in the last two years. Those pot metal crimps weaken and let the body of the switch open up. The last time I replaced it I epoxied the crimps in place, but they may have come loose and given me a bad connection to the ICM.

Thanks for shooting out ideas, everything helps!

Alto

 

You are finding what I tried to explain about LEDs. They will handle the voltage properly, but will burn out quickly as you have noticed when they are not limited by a resistor in how much current is available. I don't have it memorized by any means, but I'd put a resistor in series with your new lights.
You also cannot use the LED to supply the power to the TFI. It cannot handle the amperage and will let out a teeny tiny wisp of magic smoke when it dies. You might not even see it escape, but when you touch the LED leads to power, it will not respond any more.
I think if you take the shorting plug out of the socket, you take the computer totally out of the circuit. There is a plug, with a jumper installed, between the inner fender pile of wires and the distributor that hangs out of the plastic shroud. It is removed to allow the TFI to do the engine timing as done when the engine is cold and the ECM is not allowed to diddle with the timing. The ECM does look for the PIP signal, and when it gets in charge will use the PIP as 'base' timing, and move it +/- from base as it sees fit. I have seen 20+ degrees of advance and I think more when the computer is in charge.
Either way, you have to provide the TFI with power from another source. Have you checked for presence power in the wires when the key is ON? Have you powered the coil and then removed power to see if it sparks? You can ohm out a coil, but I don't remember the numbers. A good spark generally means a good coil, but there are some exceptions and I never figured that one out. New coil injected a miss to a Vulcan.
tom

 

I don't know much about LEDs except that when people do taillight conversions they need to add a resistor inline as you say. But according to Abe at the easyautodiagnostics websites, that 276-0270 LED has a built-in resistor. That's why I say they're crap.
When you talk about the "shorting plug", you mean the SPOUT connector? I might remove that and see if things change.
Today I'll rig up a jumper from a key-on power source to the TFI #4 circuit wire and see if it'll start. That should tell me if the power source wire is bad.

I don't understand about powering the coil then removing power- that happens every time I turn the key to run and off again.

Alto