5.4 3v performance desire
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Joined: Jan 2013
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From: Portland
5.4 3v performance desire
I have a F250, with 235k on the it and need to rebuild or replace and want more power. I really need some quality input. If I had on old 351, or 302 I'd be golden. But I want a hot 250, 2005. So it leaves me questioning what is out there. Please give your in-put on the best thoughts on power & or 
rebuild.
rebuild.
MMNC (SS)(Ret)
Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 11,606
Likes: 151
From: SE Georgia
sell it and get a Powerstroke
seriously
I've had a few of the 5.4 3v motors. They respond well to boost, but there is no magical pill for making big power with the motor.
For $4-5k plus some custom work you can get a custom supercharger setup that will put you about 350-400 HP at the wheels. But then your trans is going to start thinking about failing with those kind of miles. the driveline in these late model trucks eats about 100 hp. So yeah, your current motor has 300 HP, but you might be lucky to see 200 HP at the wheels. A blower will put you near 500 HP at the crank...but that 100 HP or so loss sucks. Custom tuning with a SCT tuner can help lower those losses to about 70 HP due to parasitic losses
plus you'll have to rebuild the motor itself which isn't cheap for a modular motor.
seriously
I've had a few of the 5.4 3v motors. They respond well to boost, but there is no magical pill for making big power with the motor.
For $4-5k plus some custom work you can get a custom supercharger setup that will put you about 350-400 HP at the wheels. But then your trans is going to start thinking about failing with those kind of miles. the driveline in these late model trucks eats about 100 hp. So yeah, your current motor has 300 HP, but you might be lucky to see 200 HP at the wheels. A blower will put you near 500 HP at the crank...but that 100 HP or so loss sucks. Custom tuning with a SCT tuner can help lower those losses to about 70 HP due to parasitic losses
plus you'll have to rebuild the motor itself which isn't cheap for a modular motor.
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Tylus ive been looking around and have not been able to find hard numbers. What is the drivline loss on the automatic vs manual in these trucks?
MMNC (SS)(Ret)
Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 11,606
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From: SE Georgia
there isn't a huge "hotrod" market with the superduty. I'm taking my numbers from the 04-08 F-150's. over in the F-150 tech area there is a great post by Ken (original owner of FTE) where he documented OEM baseline HP, supercharger power, then supercharger + blower power.
I had a 06 F-150 that I supercharged that had the 5.4 3v motor, but a 4 speed transmission. a 4x2 sees in the neighborhood of 80 HP loss, the 4x4's see about 100 HP losses due to the extra rotational mass from the transfer cases.
The 5R110 trans that your truck has is a great transmission, but it's still a power sucker. I've never seen a 5.4 powered superduty dyno sheet, so can't honestly tell you what the stock rear wheel HP numbers are. final RWHP HP's might be wrong....but I know the crank #'s are spot on
btw, the 5.4 3v and the 4.6 3v are essentially the exact same motor except for displacement. they have the exact same heads. I suggest you look into the Detroit Rockers (Brenspeed) or the FRPP Hot Rods. They are pretty hot camshafts that are known to produce 30-40 extra RWHP in the 4.6 3v motor. Those cams + good tuning might make your truck a bit funner. The cams however are a pretty "hot" cam. They have a good lope to them and cause issues with Ford automatics due to the lope. Requires a good tuner to prevent CEL's
I had a 06 F-150 that I supercharged that had the 5.4 3v motor, but a 4 speed transmission. a 4x2 sees in the neighborhood of 80 HP loss, the 4x4's see about 100 HP losses due to the extra rotational mass from the transfer cases.
The 5R110 trans that your truck has is a great transmission, but it's still a power sucker. I've never seen a 5.4 powered superduty dyno sheet, so can't honestly tell you what the stock rear wheel HP numbers are. final RWHP HP's might be wrong....but I know the crank #'s are spot on
btw, the 5.4 3v and the 4.6 3v are essentially the exact same motor except for displacement. they have the exact same heads. I suggest you look into the Detroit Rockers (Brenspeed) or the FRPP Hot Rods. They are pretty hot camshafts that are known to produce 30-40 extra RWHP in the 4.6 3v motor. Those cams + good tuning might make your truck a bit funner. The cams however are a pretty "hot" cam. They have a good lope to them and cause issues with Ford automatics due to the lope. Requires a good tuner to prevent CEL's
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Joined: Sep 2010
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The 5R110 trans that your truck has is a great transmission, but it's still a power sucker. I've never seen a 5.4 powered superduty dyno sheet, so can't honestly tell you what the stock rear wheel HP numbers are. final RWHP HP's might be wrong....but I know the crank #'s are spot on
They are pretty hot camshafts that are known to produce 30-40 extra RWHP in the 4.6 3v motor. Those cams + good tuning might make your truck a bit funner. The cams however are a pretty "hot" cam. They have a good lope to them and cause issues with Ford automatics due to the lope. Requires a good tuner to prevent CEL's
MMNC (SS)(Ret)
Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 11,606
Likes: 151
From: SE Georgia
Cams + tunes will run you about $1,000 if you do all the install yourself...assuming you don't already have a tuner. if you have a SCT device, about $750 or cheaper. Cams were $650-700 last time I priced them out. While in there, pull the intake and do the VCT delete for more HP gain...but that will cause a little low end TQ loss since the plates won't be able to finely modulate air flow
That will give you 30-50 RWHP over current setup. Doesn't sound like a lot, but that's a rather impressive gain for not a lot of money. Plus, your truck will get the old school 60's era Lope to the exhaust which IMO is worth the install alone
well there you go. Ford never offered the 5.4 3v with a stick in the F-150, so I've never seen a dyno graph...so can't do a comparison of stick vs. auto drivetrain losses
also since you have a stick, any decent tuner can get you optimal gains. no transmission worries
should be fewer losses though, even with a 1 ton stickshift/clutch
don't know. Recommend you contact Brenspeed or Ford Racing and ask them. The FRPP Hot Rods are generally loved by Mustang guys. The Detroit Rockers (Brenspeed) are also very popular
That will give you 30-50 RWHP over current setup. Doesn't sound like a lot, but that's a rather impressive gain for not a lot of money. Plus, your truck will get the old school 60's era Lope to the exhaust which IMO is worth the install alone
also since you have a stick, any decent tuner can get you optimal gains. no transmission worries
should be fewer losses though, even with a 1 ton stickshift/clutch
don't know. Recommend you contact Brenspeed or Ford Racing and ask them. The FRPP Hot Rods are generally loved by Mustang guys. The Detroit Rockers (Brenspeed) are also very popular
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Trailering
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Cams + tunes will run you about $1,000 if you do all the install yourself...assuming you don't already have a tuner. if you have a SCT device, about $750 or cheaper. Cams were $650-700 last time I priced them out. While in there, pull the intake and do the VCT delete for more HP gain...but that will cause a little low end TQ loss since the plates won't be able to finely modulate air flow
That will give you 30-50 RWHP over current setup. Doesn't sound like a lot, but that's a rather impressive gain for not a lot of money. Plus, your truck will get the old school 60's era Lope to the exhaust which IMO is worth the install alone
That will give you 30-50 RWHP over current setup. Doesn't sound like a lot, but that's a rather impressive gain for not a lot of money. Plus, your truck will get the old school 60's era Lope to the exhaust which IMO is worth the install alone
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Actually i have a zf6 i was wondering the difference in loss of it vs thr 5r110. I know both are big and heavy with lots of rotating weight. But the manual has got to do better it sure feels like it does seat of the pants.
Most of those mustang cams give up low end power dont they? I wouldnt want to have to start messing with a 2000-2500 bottom end of power band in a superduty!
Most of those mustang cams give up low end power dont they? I wouldnt want to have to start messing with a 2000-2500 bottom end of power band in a superduty!
i have two trucks with ZF6 transmissions. Truthfully they shift…… like a truck transmission. It’s not gonna be like shifting a Mustang or corvette. The throw is long. I did buy one of those shorter throw shifters and while it tightened up the shift throw pattern, it by no means made it more sporty.
as far as the performance aspect of your 5.4….unless the truck has some special meaning I.e. was grandpappys or daddy’s truck and you were both conceived and born on the bench seat of that truck….i wouldn’t bother dumping the money for performance in that vehicle. You’ll NEVER recoup any of that money.
Depending on your needs go buy a fun truck to play with and keep this as the daily or buy the truck that fits the needs and sell this one.
IF you love the truck….instead of dumping thousands into that engine go find a wrecked diesel and swap that in it. Or a wrecked 7.3 gasser…I’m sure someone wrapped one around a tree by now.
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