Ive been talking about putting a set of ladder bars on my truck for awhile now. Im finally putting a set on. I looked around and I couldnt find a set that I liked that could justify the cost in my mind so I decided at the end of my search I could build a set better than I could buy and save a ton of $. The amount of axle wrap I have with my set up is beyond what you could imagine even with the low HP and TQ numbers I think Im making, maybe around 300/600 to the ground.
Heres the start of what Im doing. 1" ID 1/4'' wall seamless tubing I got from my shop I got 4 pieces roughly 9 feet long







I wanted to use the old A-frame style bars because they work and look good. 9" centers on the vertical bars at 78" from the end (skinny side) heres the first one, it took me maybe 2 hours to build







The second one next to the first one. I worked on the second one for maybe 20 mins a night when I got home from work, I was working 12s an hour from home, too tired to finish in one night







Heres one more bar installed on the second one with my 20 mins







Both done at this point to the same point... They were tacked together using a 110 craftsman gasless mig welder. The second one took about 3 hours total to get EXACTLY like the first







I know you guys might have something to say about this picture but bear with me... I will be getting all the right parts later, I dont drive the truck much anymore so it will be ok.......
I got some 5/8" grade 8 bolts and nuts. I tacked the nuts onto the ends of the bars and I cut the heads of the bolts off to make my own joints



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I took the studs that I was left with after I cut the heads off the bolts and tacked them to another piece of pipe. I didnt cut the new joints down yet because I dont know exactly how wide I want them to be yet



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Just to confirm the size of my axle I used a C-clamp to pull a measurement



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Redneck dial indicator.... 3-1/2"



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I got some 3/16" flat stock 6"x12" to shape and weld to the axle when I get to that pointI layed it out to go half way around the axle. I dont know what shape or where its foing to land yet, this leaves me a lot of room for adjustments later



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If I had a hole saw that was 3-1/2" I would have tacked the two pieces together and used that but I had a metabo and a grinder so thats what I used. I put slices in it so I could get the steel out



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This is what it looked like after the metabo had its way with it



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Then I took the grinder to it to clean it up and this is what the out come is. I had a piece of 3-1/2" pipe laying around for comparison. I had to do that X4



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Heres my work bench and the tools I used



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Just so were clear... I used the 110 mig welder JUST to TACK weld this stuff together!!! I will be using a 480 mig welder when I can get access to it, dont trust a little 110 for something important to stay together long with a lot of punishment.

This is the point that Im at now I will be adding more to this as I get it done

 

Very nice. Nothing wrong with a 110 mig for mockup.

 

Thanks I got all the stuff in the pictures all welded up last night. Now I just need to make up the brackets to bolt on the frame for the front of the bars. I might make them up today. Thats the next point so I can see where I want the rest of the bar to land on the axle.

I thought there might be more people interested in this type of build but I guess I was wrong, owell if it helps one person down the road it was worth snapping the pictures and posting them

 

I got them done for the most part, Ive just got a few more things to do like drill 4 more holes, replace all the bolts with grade 8 bolts grind and clean up the welds on the bars themselves then paint them



Heres a few pictures of one of the brackets I made for the front support in order of how I built it (bear with me photobucket decided to cut a few of the pictures short)



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Here you can see I ground down all the sharp edgeds because I knew I would wack my head off of it ever time I got under the truck if I didnt.

There are 2 bolts that tie into the bottom of the frame rail and I plan to add 2 more on the upper portion also, I still have to get grade 8 bolts to replace all the bolts in the pictures now.



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I pulled a hard measurement and cut the bars down to the exact length and tacked the nuts onto the end.



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In the other pictures I took of the brackets I planned to make I didnt round out the hole near deep enough, here you can see I had to take it back 2 more inches (bottom piece) The top piece is the finished product, I obviously had to made 4 total



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Like an idiot I went ahead and tacked this piece to the axle..... I got ahead of myself and played hell trying to get the other piece lined up right



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This is the proper way to fit the brackets to the axle..... assemble it first! (hopefully you guys can see it







At the last minute I changed my mind and cut all the bolts off of my home made heim joints in favor of a thicker piece of tube. The original ID of them was almost 1", I found a piece of 1-1/4" tubing with a 1/2" ID and welded all the bolt studs to it instead because I planned on using 1/2" bolts so that would eliminate and slop I would have had... its a nice tight fit.



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One thing I didnt think to account for was my exhaust and where it exits the truck, I have a 1" or so clearing between the bars empty.... Ill take care of the whrn I get a chance and have a plan of attack










Last but not least here is what the truck looks like now with them installed



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As far as axle wrap goes I noticed a very big difference in the 5 miles it toook me to get home, it wasnt gone completly because I didnt adjust them all I did was put them on and call it a night at that point. I will be adjusting and fine tuning them to get all the wrap out.



If anyone has any questions on anything Ive done... ever... feel free to asks away

 

Great thread! I admire anyone that fabricates stuff!!!

 

Do you have some more pictures of them on the truck. It is hard to tell how you mounted them.

To be honest with you I would be willing to bet that you break one of the joints on the axle. Fabtech had a set similar to this and they had lots of failures. Think about how it mounts to the axle and every time you hit a bump the leaf spring wants to move up and back. The bars are going to want to follow that path. Think about it if the only thing in the picture was the leaf spring, the axle and the bars. You hit a bump and the leaf spring moves up and the bars have to follow.

But it is fixed at the axle and pinned at the frame and turns the bar into a bending member, if it is strong enough to handle the bending stresses then it will find the next weakest link which is the joints. Now if you just had one connection or one bolt holding it on at the axle, the bar can now pivot and it is no longer a bending member.

I wouldn't be suprised if you notice that your truck rides a little stiffer in the rear as well.

A good check would be to throw a little weight in your truck and back up one wheel on something. If something is going to go that would be the time... Good luck and props for building your own bars.

 

Great job. I to admire fab work.

On a side note still love the look of the truck and those wheels. I will say no more.

 

Layson, Correct me if I'm wrong, but it has to flex at both ends, correct?

 

People really get into heated discussions regarding how to properly build traction bars. There are a couple types you have the single bar and the triangulated bars.

The triangulated bars (2 mounts on axle) are by far the coolest looking, but it is a lot harder to build a system that enables your suspension to still work like it did before the bars. To reduce the amount of impact they make on your suspension is all in how the front connection is at the frame. That is the key factor. If it doesn't allow for the horizontal and vertical translation of the leaf springs than it is impacting the ride and travel of the suspension. It is almost like a large rear sway bar. Alot of these guys incorporate a shackle style connection at the frame to account for this. Unfortunately if you actually have not drawn the system up in 3D you have no real idea of how much tranlation you need. It also only will travel in a very tight radius. That translation is not going to match the leaf springs, which can lead to them binding up.

You can google search fabtech traction bar failures and look at the images of the traingulated bars. You can see some bars actually bend at the end up near the frame, where the section necks down. Or it fails at the highest stress area at the joint at the axle connection.

The single bar setups (single mount on axle) are a lot simplier but don't look as appealing. The single bolt at the axle enables the bar to pivot at the axle to allow for the suspension travel. But inorder to do this correctly it has to be a certain dimension off the axle to keep it from wraping or impacting your ride. What the single bolt does at that axle is make it so all you need to allow for is horizontal tranlation at the frame. That is why I am a big proponent of the One Up Offroad traction bars. The frame mount and alxe mount enable the suspension to be unaffected by the bars. Your springs will also ride better since your springs are not trying to fight the wrap and work as designed. You can still tow, offroad, do whatever you want and the truck will do what it is supposed to do.

But guys build both style setups all the time and depending on what you are looking for they can work. They may not work for everyone and for every application... Heck some can actually cause more hop... LOL

 

Thanks guys.

Layson I don't have any more picture but I can take some and upload them. Just so you have a good idea the 4 brackets I made in the 10th picture of my second post with pictures are welded to the axle, if photobucket wouldn't have chopped my picture down you would be able to see them bolted onto the ladder bars before I welded them on.
If I'm fallowing you right, in theory I should be able to pull one of the bolts out of the brackets on the axle and possibly be ok.
I don't DD the truck anymore and haven't had time to mess with it anymore. When I did drive it for the short drive I did notice a huge difference in axle wrap without adjusting them at all.

 

Reps to Layson (and I'm stingy as heck with reputation points because I feel they need to be earned). He's right on. I may be able to clarify some of the things he's getting at.


On a leaf spring setup, it's easy to think that the axle moves in a true vertical path from full droop to full compression. This is hardly the case. If that were true, no shackle would be needed to compensate for length changes as the suspension cycles. In this instance, the only part of the spring we're worried about is the front half - from the center pin to the front mounting perch.

As the suspension cycles, the distance from the center pin to the front perch will change. It will be at it's farthest distance when the leaf spring is flat and the distance will shorten as the spring bends (either positive arch or negative arch). When building traction bars, anti-wrap bars, ladder bars , etc., it's VERY important to factor in these changes in length because if you mount the bars rigid to the frame and the axle, the setup will bind. This is because the bars cannot accommodate the length change of the leaf spring. The problem is REALLY exasperated when there is a lot of arch to the springs (as the OP's picture shows).

This, however, is only half of the equation. The bars themselves move in an arc as the suspension cycles and the axle tube gets closer and farther from the frame. This compounds the problem caused by the leaf spring length changes. You've got two different forces working to tear the mounts off of the "ladder bars" and another force trying to shear the head off of the center pin in the leaf springs.

Good luck!

 

Be great to check out your mounts to the frame and axle.

For now just drive your truck and get a feal for how it rides and how it handles. It might just work for you. It appears to me that it wouldn't take you much time to fab up something different down the road. Props for you for not getting all pissed off with me... LOL.

Why thank you...

 

I'm not here to get pissed off lol I'm here to help anyone else out, and try to solve a problem I have with my own truck. Ill post some more pictures this weekend when I get a chance to finish them up.