metriccar,

Sounds like you have bad body grounds.
Make sure the small wire going from the NEG post of the battery to the body (not frame) has a good clean ground. If the battery cables have been replaced this wire may be missing.

 

OK, I think I see what you're saying.

These computers are basically embedded controllers - they have one specific task to do, and they know how to do that very well - via the programming instructions contained in ROM.

I think the specific variant of the program instructions are what you're referring to as a Catch Code.

What you call a Drawing Number, I call the Engineering ID number.

When I go shopping for computers in the JY I look for the same drivetrain and same Calibration Code (or, one that the Parts Catalog suggests should work, as there are literally hundreds of such codes).

Yes, I know that parts stores and junkyards use the numbers printed/cast/embossed on the parts, I guess that's not really a bad thing to do.

 

If the PCM is going bad, shouldn't it give an error code? I ran the scanner the other day, and got 11, 11,
Once I ran it and got 11, 11, 67.
Then I got an 11, 11, 32.
But other times, just been 11, 11.

 

Be more specific....

There are two tests - KOEO (key-on engine off) and KOER (key-on engine running) and the results displayed are associated with those specific tests.

The CM (continuous memory) codes are only what it remembers about what it has encountered in recent history.

A computer that's "going bad" can be diagnosed with a tool designed just for that purpose.

 

Sounds like voltage problems.
The 67 has to do with the transmission neutral switch and the 32 is low voltage coming from the EVP sensor..
Check your body ground.

 

Would mind explaining that.
I have never heard of such a tool.

 

There is something similar for sale in the ebay link above:









Basically, they are computers themselves, you attach the vehicle's computer (the Subject computer) to it and one of the tools it offers is to stress the thing - say, feed it a certain pulse rate at 10X the expected normal input - to try and force an error to arise. The tester will feed the subject with known quantities & values of data and knows how the subject (vehicle computer) should respond.

Notice that you remove the subject computer from the vehicle so as to remove all other influences that could affect the tests - the wires & sending units.

The testing device is presumed to be good, as are the cables it uses.

Here is a brand-new one from Amazon:

Amazon.com: Thexton 126 Ford EEC-IV Breakout Box: Automotive



Here is a Rotunda 007-00085 transmission tester used to test the E40D transmission - this thing can remove the controller in the vehicle from the equation, as well as sit in between to help pinpoint the source of a problem:

 

Thanks for the clarification Bill!

 

ctubutis,

The breakout box or BOB has no computer inside. I have had one for many years and have used it a lot. It is not for testing the computer. Most of the time you use it without the computer attached to test sensors, wiring and solenoids.
It is just a device to hook to the computer plug to get access to the wires going to the computer without making holes in the wires. You can also hook it at the same time to the computer to monitor the voltages going back and forth to the computer. It also has a switch to open the SPOUT wire but it does not generate any outputs itself.
But in no way does it test the computer to see if it is going bad.
I do not know where you got the wrong information on the BOB.

The transmission tester is just that. You can operate the solenoid in the transmission and some of them will let you monitor the grounds that the computer is sending to the transmissions solenoids and the transmissions temp. But in no way does it test the computer to see if it is going bad.

When I buy a truck I will go out and get a spare computer for it from a salvage yard, hook it to the BOB and truck. Then run the KOEO and KOER tests to make sure I get no bad codes. Of course I run the test also on the trucks computer first to make sure it has no codes.

You could hook a scope to the 5 volt supply and check for ripple other than that I do not know how to test one to see if it is going bad. If I have problems with the truck I will just sub it out with the spare for that truck.

There is also a EEC-IV Monitor, Rotunda 007-0047F and a EEC-IV Monitor Recorder, Rotunda 007-00021, I have both of them also but they do not test the computer either.

 

Chris (ctubutis) sent me a P/M, asked me to respond to your thread.

There are no Ford part numbers marked on parts after 1956, just casting or ID engineering numbers (when applicable). I've never heard of a Catch Code.

Marked: F2TF-12A650-JA = Ford part number: F2TZ-12A650-JA replaced by: F2PZ-12A650-AXA and this part number was replaced by: F2PZ-12A650-BCA = Obsolete

Last MSRP: $316.74 // Dealer net cost: $205.88. FoMoCo is infamous for replacing 10's of 1000's of part numbers EVERY *&% $*&* YEAR!

ONLY one source "shows" all three of these replaced/obsolete parts: COLLECTORS AUTO SUPPLY in Oroville WA = 800-414-4462. Do not be surprised if they give you a "song and dance" excuse!

I hate listing this place as a source, cuz not only don't they call peeps back when they say they will, but usually say they have to check their warehouse in British Columbia to see if they have the parts.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
But, you may be able to get a remanufactured PCM for far less.

Subford will prolly recall the following: Last November FTE member wagonerki (Keith, lives in Sedro-Wooley WA) bought a 1991 F350 351W Stake Bed locally (Rialto). It hadn't been driven since 2008 and he couldn't get it to run correctly.

He was staying at my home at this time because he had bought a 1966 Bronco powertrain on ebay in Riverside, then flew here and bought this truck off Cragslist to use it to transport the Bronco parts back to WA.

I suggested Keith contact Subford to run past him all the problems he was having. After replacing the parts Subford suggested, it ran better but the MPG from Rialto to my home (about 45 miles) was awful, almost draining the 10 gallons he had put in the tank!

He ended up taking it to a shop and found out it needed the PCM. I crossed the ID number over to the Ford part number. Both the shop and Keith then called around various autoparts stores and looked online.

Keith and the shop found it rebuilt several places (FTE sponsor Rock Auto had it), but delivery time was three days.

Since Keith had already been here a week and had to be home before Thanksgiving (2 days away), I suggested he call Engler Brothers Auto Parts in Santa Monica.

They said a parts warehouse in Azusa had one, could have later that day. I told Keith to pay for the puppy over the phone, get the address of the parts warehouse and have it put on "will call."

We then drove over to Azusa (in my new F150, I put over 500 miles on my truck driving Keith around ) and picked the puppy up. Keith was able to leave that night, drove straight thru to WA (over 1300 miles) without a problemo.

So, now that you have all three of these part numbers, look around and see if anyone has one. Keith paid $125.00 for the puppy, its refundable core charge was $75.00.

 

Thanks everyone for their help!!! This has been a frustrating experience for me to say the least because it seems auto mechanics are not able to help when I take it to a shop. I took it to the shop for THEM to know about and perform the voltage test on the EGR valve! I really don't feel like replacing something I don't have the right size wrench or even see a way to get to it!

Well, I went to the junkyard today, for another part, and lo and behold, after going to 6 yards trying to find one, I found one at another yard after going there for something else. the exact same serial number PCM as mine. F2TF-12A650-JA. I put it in and can't tell a difference really. Maybe I'm being unreasonable in expecting a 1991 F250 460 with 96k original miles that holds very steady vacuum at 18 inches and has very consistend psi compression around 155 in all cylinders to run as smooth as my old truck, an '04 F150 4.2L? After all, this new truck may have flipped on the odometer. After putting the other PCM in, it did run just as rough at first, but seems to run smoother now, but still has what sounds like a miss. This PCM only cost me $20 and I still have the original. I haven't had any hard shifts yet but my other one didn't do it all the time either. I'm thinking the EGR issue related to code 32 is still the culprit. I'll follow the suggestions on this thread. I went to the mechanic for them to help me out but it seems whenever I take a vehicle to a mechanic they just want to throw parts at it. The way I see it I just saved $130 by not buying a rebuilt one (if I could find one), or who knows how much if they weren't obsolete and the mechanic said that and an EGR valve would cure all that ails me.

All the tests I have done are KOEO. I'll take a look at this thing to see if I can do a KOER.

Main reason I wanted to do this was because this truck sucks the gas down but I found if I hold it at 55 it's not nearly as bad... and the fact I seem to be real **** about my machinery. The miss is not that bad.

 

As noted above the 32 code says the EGR valve is below closed (voltage wise).
The KOEO test is an electrical test and nothing more.
You have to get a 11 on the electrical tests before even running at KOER or looking at the CM codes.
Check your voltage at the EGR sensor on top of the EGR valve with the key on.
For more information on the EGR sensor click on the link below:
Fuel Injection Technical Library » EGR Valve Position sensor (EVP)

A closed EGR valve will not make it run bad. It may not get as good MPG as if does as when the EGR valve is opened at mid throttle with no load. The EGR valve is closed at idle and WOT anyway.

 

Very old thread, I know, but I'm wondering if anyone knows how to use these tools?

I am having an intermittent stumble under load in high gear in my 1990 E350 with 460 CID engine. I am wondering if some sensor is dropping out.

Do the above device(s) record sensor input and allow playback to identify a failing sensor?

Steve

 

Yes they do.

 

Defining Intermittent Driveability Symptoms

The EEC-IV Monitor* and the EEC-IV Monitor Recorder* are useful tools for diagnosing intermittent driveability symptoms or Continuous DTCs that cannot be resolved through the diagnostics in Pinpoint testing. This section contains diagnostic procedures and data using the Monitor and Recorder in a symptom-oriented or Continuous DTC manner.

If available, the Service Bay Diagnostic System (SBDS) can be used for Intermittent Diagnostics. Refer to «Section 5A», Quick Test Appendix, Test Equipment, for additional information on SBDS.

Intermittent is a randomly occurring drive symptom for which no hard DTCs (KOEO, KOER) are revealed by Quick Test. Often the Quick Test will show "Pass DTCs" while the drive symptom still exists.

Before proceeding with the following procedure, be sure that:

l Customary mechanical system tests and inspections reveal nothing. (Remember, mechanical component problems can make a good EEC system react abnormally.)

l Quick Test (Section 5A) and associated Pinpoint diagnosis (Section 6A) have been completed, but the symptom or Continuous DTC is still occurring.

l If available, review of Ford Technical Service Bulletins (TSBs) and inquiry into OASIS turns up no applicable articles.


Purpose of this Section

The Monitor and Recorder function as a "window" into the EEC system. Through this "window" the user is able to view the sensor values and signals sent to and from the Powertrain Control Module (PCM). The PCM uses these values to make decisions which increase engine performance. The Monitor can display these values during both engine off (KOEO) and engine running (KOER) conditions. The advantage of the Recorder is the ability to take a "snapshot" of selected EEC signals that can be stored and reviewed later.

A basic working knowledge of the EEC system is critical to efficiently troubleshoot the symptom or Continuous DTC. No diagnostic procedure can account for all the possibilities that may be encountered. This diagnostic procedure only attempts to provide basic steps and methods for isolating possible causes.

The diagnostic procedure used in this section is a symptom or Continuous DTC based approach to isolating the damaged system, circuit, or sensor. Often a mechanical fault will cause a good EEC system to react abnormally. In those cases, the use of a Monitor with this diagnostic procedure will enhance the ability to eliminate possible EEC faults and also locate mechanical faults.

NOTE:
*In this section, the EEC-IV Monitor and EEC-IV Monitor Recorder will be referred to as Monitor and Recorder.



/