400 Big Block Right???
Hotshot
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From: south louisiana
Elder User
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From: Sin City, USA
Amen. For 20 some years I had never heard of the 351M being called and "Michigan" NOR a "MIDLAND" until Al Gore invented the internet.....and then I found out that me and every Ford fan I knew were wrong, it's a 351 Michigan or maybe that's a 351 Midland....either way, it's a big block :/ sarc!
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The public and the aftermarket world might of called them modifieds, but Ford Corporation never did.
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The 335 series engines are classified as mid-blocks as well.
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From: Northeast, OK
actually called them. So I'll keep my opinions to myself and hope to see some real facts. 
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Because some people have little else to do and opinions they want to share. Having been born in the 40's (yes, I'm old) I certainly remember talking about these engines as they came out. But what we, in my little corner of the world, called them has little bearing on what actually called them. So I'll keep my opinions to myself and hope to see some real facts.
actually called them. So I'll keep my opinions to myself and hope to see some real facts. FTE Stories
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Was it NumberDummy who posted something somewhere around here not real long ago, part of some parts catalog (I'd guess the Engine section) in which Ford explicitly referred to it as Modified? I think it was from Section 60 somewhere....
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Also, I have many old Ford Motorsport Catalogs in storage. The oldest is 1984 which was either the first or second one Ford published and in everyone of those "Official" Ford publications they call the 351M a Modified and the 400 a 400, not a 400M. That's fact not opinion. These can still be found on eBay while excerpts can be found posted around the internet.
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Those are the kinds of facts I'm looking for. 
As Chris/ctubutis has urged many times, we need to be posting facts in FTE so that we aren't like the other forums where all you have are opinions - and you don't know whom to believe.
As for me having opinions, I certainly do - probably more than I should. And, I do share them on here, but I try to limit stating opinions to areas where there aren't facts. For instance, "what's the best carb?" There's no factual answer to that, so I share my opinion.
However, what Ford called the 351M and the 400 is an area where there are facts, so we should stick to facts.
Classified as mid-blocks? By whom?
As Chris/ctubutis has urged many times, we need to be posting facts in FTE so that we aren't like the other forums where all you have are opinions - and you don't know whom to believe.As for me having opinions, I certainly do - probably more than I should. And, I do share them on here, but I try to limit stating opinions to areas where there aren't facts. For instance, "what's the best carb?" There's no factual answer to that, so I share my opinion.
However, what Ford called the 351M and the 400 is an area where there are facts, so we should stick to facts.Classified as mid-blocks? By whom?
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Looks like it was both Gary and NumberDummy!!!!
The factory-supplied Ford literature is as authoritative and credible as we can get, even though it is not always correct but there are absolutely zero opinions involved there...
The factory-supplied Ford literature is as authoritative and credible as we can get, even though it is not always correct but there are absolutely zero opinions involved there...
Just to stir things up a bit, ..... I've always heard that Ford never called the M a "Modified". However, that's not quite true. I've attached a page out of Ford's Master Parts Catalog from 1980 through 1989. Note the highlighted references to the 351M as Modified.
Now, if ctubutis sees this he'll confirm that I'm not going to the bank with anything the MPC says since I've found lots and lots and lots of errors in it. (In fact, yesterday Chris said something to the effect of "The parts catalog confirms that" and I put the
emoticon in my response.) But, it is interesting that someone at Ford called it a Modified, and said someone was either editing or creating entries in the Master Parts Catalog.
Here 'tis, but if you want to see it up close and personal go to my Misc album.
Now, if ctubutis sees this he'll confirm that I'm not going to the bank with anything the MPC says since I've found lots and lots and lots of errors in it. (In fact, yesterday Chris said something to the effect of "The parts catalog confirms that" and I put the
emoticon in my response.) But, it is interesting that someone at Ford called it a Modified, and said someone was either editing or creating entries in the Master Parts Catalog.Here 'tis, but if you want to see it up close and personal go to my Misc album.
351M introduced in 1975 Ford/Mercury Passenger Cars, was referred to as Modified from day one by FoMoCo parts & service reps, partsguys, parts managers, mechanics, service writers, service managers.
But the general public (as usual) was mostly unaware back then...and still is today.
I remember back in the late 1970's when a customer was arguing with a parts guy at the counter (it wasn't me). The guy claimed M referred to Midland.
I stuck my nose in, told the customer that Ford had no engine assembly plant, nor any other facilities in Midland TX, so how the hell could M refer to Midland?
I then said...it refers to Modified...PERIOD!
Uh huh...did you buy both of these trucks new? If not...how do you know if these amber lenses were factory installed or replaced...for whatever reason...sometime later?
This wouldn't be the first time that park lamps were swapped...and the owners did this, not only when the trucks were brand new, but are still doing it today.
1973/75 and 1976 F100/350 before serial number C50,001 have clear park lamps...from serial number C50,001 have amber park lamps, as do 1977's.
But some people didn't (and still don't) like the amber lamps, so install clear lamps instead. Personally, I prefer the amber lamps, but as Mr. Fixit has discovered, I've been non-conformist since day one!
But the general public (as usual) was mostly unaware back then...and still is today.
I remember back in the late 1970's when a customer was arguing with a parts guy at the counter (it wasn't me). The guy claimed M referred to Midland.
I stuck my nose in, told the customer that Ford had no engine assembly plant, nor any other facilities in Midland TX, so how the hell could M refer to Midland?
I then said...it refers to Modified...PERIOD!
Uh huh...did you buy both of these trucks new? If not...how do you know if these amber lenses were factory installed or replaced...for whatever reason...sometime later?
This wouldn't be the first time that park lamps were swapped...and the owners did this, not only when the trucks were brand new, but are still doing it today.
1973/75 and 1976 F100/350 before serial number C50,001 have clear park lamps...from serial number C50,001 have amber park lamps, as do 1977's.
But some people didn't (and still don't) like the amber lamps, so install clear lamps instead. Personally, I prefer the amber lamps, but as Mr. Fixit has discovered, I've been non-conformist since day one!
Casting Center has absolutely nothing to do with it.
351M = M refers to Modified / It does not refer to Michigan, Muncie, Midland or anything else.
There's no such thing as a 400M .. it's just plain 'ol 400.
351C = 1970/74 Ford/Merc Passenger Cars/Ranchero's.
351M = 1975/79 Ford/Merc Passenger Cars // 1977/79 F100/350 / 1978/82 Bronco / 1980/82 F150/350.
400: 1971/79 Ford/Merc Passenger Cars / 1978/79 Lincoln/Continental Mark V // 1977/79 F100/350 / 1978/82 Bronco / 1980/82 F150/350.
FoMoCo never referred to any engine as a "small block." Small block is a GM term.
And btw: 351M's were very prone to cracking cylinder heads. Many were replaced under warranty or customer pay, but some were welded.
Have the puppies magnafluxed first, to verify they're not cracked.
351M = M refers to Modified / It does not refer to Michigan, Muncie, Midland or anything else.
There's no such thing as a 400M .. it's just plain 'ol 400.
351C = 1970/74 Ford/Merc Passenger Cars/Ranchero's.
351M = 1975/79 Ford/Merc Passenger Cars // 1977/79 F100/350 / 1978/82 Bronco / 1980/82 F150/350.
400: 1971/79 Ford/Merc Passenger Cars / 1978/79 Lincoln/Continental Mark V // 1977/79 F100/350 / 1978/82 Bronco / 1980/82 F150/350.
FoMoCo never referred to any engine as a "small block." Small block is a GM term.
And btw: 351M's were very prone to cracking cylinder heads. Many were replaced under warranty or customer pay, but some were welded.
Have the puppies magnafluxed first, to verify they're not cracked.
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From: Northeast, OK
Couldn't have been me. I'd never stir things up.
As for ND, you can't possibly believe him! He said "I've been non-conformist since day one", but that doesn't fit with the Bill I know. He's all sweet and does everything SWMBO says.
As for ND, you can't possibly believe him! He said "I've been non-conformist since day one", but that doesn't fit with the Bill I know. He's all sweet and does everything SWMBO says.
Hotshot
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From: south louisiana
I'm sitting here looking at a 2002 copy of the Ford Racing (a Ford Motor Company publication) catalog and on page 114 the 351M is listed as a 351M (Modified) So don't sit there and tell us Ford NEVER referred to it as anything else. You sir are wrong. Way back when in the 70's everyone called it the 351 Modified. The 351C was the Cleveland. Ford modified the 400 to come up with it. That was the only reason it was called the Modified and nothing else.
Post Fiend
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From: Coutts Canada
Here's one other question to test the knowledge of those here, has anyone ever found Ford literature that calls any ford motor a big block or small block? I've only ever seen engine series referred to.