I ain't that brite... thanks anyway - we are all on a learning curve together. VO is a biocide - bacteria cannot grow in it. Bacteria/algae CAN live/grow in water that is in VO. Dewater your WVO asap and store out of sunlight/avoid temp swings (to mitigate condensation) and you shouldn't need algae/biocide. Beware of products that have alcohol in them - don't wanna accidentally make bio-d in your fuel tank!!

Those 12v heaters have been known to 'scorch' VO and send burnt particulates downstream - they've been the death of many an IP. Be sure ya have filters downstream if using these.

I wonder how much coking could be undone using water injection.

 

Interesting thought on the water injection? I'd be curious to know that as well! I did mess w/ HHO for a little while before WVO........didn't get anywhere.

I've heard of over heating vo as well and that is why I asked Dave about temps and if he ran his heaters constantly or switched them. I do not have a gauge set up yet; but I do want to add a vacuum gauge & a temp gauge for my Racor500 (2micron) filter this is installed between the tank and the pump. I believe around 150-160 is where you want your fuel temp? I also make every effort to not get my oil over 200 when processing as well. Right now I only have an Arctic Fox fuel heater off the coolant lines and I do not believe that is heating the fuel very much or as much as I would like.

That is why I built my new processing building so I can control the temp better of the oil I am processing and once it is done waiting to go into my truck. Didn't have any spare room in the garage for doing this plus there is no way my wife would have gone for it.

 

Its not the output temps, its the heater temps. Some as high as 400*+ to get that 80* rise in VO...

 

So how do you manage it? I would think either a thermostat or a temp gauge on the fuel line? And what do you do for heaters? If you don't mind sharing.....

 

I am enjoying my learning curve.
My 12v heaters are on the outside of the line and make no contact with the fuel. I know some are designed using glow plugs (or similar heat sources) and do contact the fuel (bad idea). My 12V heaters are also longer than the ILH sold by some companies. The shorter the ss wire the hotter, however with constant high volumn fuel flow the fuel quickly goes to the engine or returns to the tank. I have a temperature gauge and run warm fuel, not hot fuel.
Having the filters is always a good idea.
Our trucks (1999 to 2003 with 7.3) do not have an IP. We have a lift pump and a HPOP. Our injectors are hydraulic operated and electronic controlled.


Water injection is a good route to go. Someday i want one. A gentleman, DCS is really into it and has lots of experience.

Yes, how do you?

 

Right now I do not manage it.....the only heating I have is the Arctic Fox Coolant Fuel Heater which I believe is sufficient once the truck gets warmed up in the summer time here in Florida. But it is definitely not enough during this past winter. I want to add a 12v heater or two to my setup up so I can turn it on before I start the truck and shut them off once the truck gets heated up and let the coolant heater maintain it. I also need to add a vacuum gauge to my filter to give me the heads up for when it's getting clogged and I think adding a temp gauge to the fuel line is a good idea so the fuel does not get too hot. How hot does your fuel get after running a while w/ both of your heaters going? Also I sent you a pm.....did you see it? Thanks, Todd

 

First, my apologies. I do not look at PM's often enough. I will check and respond through the PM to you.

The above Quote on heat is misleading.
I believe you asked SSJ about his heat situation and i was attempting to emphasize the question to him.
I does look like i was asking the question of you. My error.

My fuel temperature only runs warm. I have never seen it above 140°. I would prefer it to be warmer. That is why i am discounting the "scorch" comment from SSJ when using a heat source that is indirect to the fuel. The fuel in these trucks is constantly flowing. It is a challenge to warm it.
If you dip a glow plug in the fuel for heat and some vo folks were doing it while on the learning curve years ago, there is a strong possibility you will scorch or otherwise cause fuel problems. That idea is about as outdated as the use of IP's on these trucks. We don't.
I am confident SSJ knows these trucks do not have an IP so i do not understand why he brought that up.

For years during the early 2000's many were talking about the tollerence of DI (believed bad) vs IDI ( believed good) engines on vo. Within the vo community i was considered gutsy (or foolish) for doing this to a DI truck and a new one at that. I believe i stood alone at the time concerning DI. I heard (and sometimes still do) horror stories of how i was damaging/destroying my DI truck because of DI and single tank (please) on vo. Well, my truck is still my daily driver years into this experiment. Isn't it interesting that this 7.3 has proven to be among the best ever for running on vo ( the 6.0 is terrible by the way). I have an occasional hiccup, so what (I am looking for the source of a fuel leak now that has nothing to do with my vo use) , i deal with it. Many of the same people who once were skeptical are now owners of DI vehicles running on vo. Some have two tank systems, some have single tank systems.
There is more than one way to get the right results.
The choice is yours. Required-NOT, but build it to tolerate your area. (Sorry for the ramble).

 

After reading through the posts in this topic, I couldn't find an estimate of how much VO costs to make. My guess is that, once you've included the cost of the processing equipment, your own time (no-one's time is really free), raw material costs, and transportation, you're not really saving that much over commercially-produced fuels.

The original topic was asking about alternative fuels for the 7.3L diesel engine so, while you're considering VO, you should also give Diesel-CNG Dual Fuel some consideration. Since the OP is in San Francisco, the cost of CNG is in the range of $2.05-2.55/GGE. In terms of DGE (Diesel Gallon Equivalent), CNG costs about $2.34-2.91/DGE. For comparison, OK CNG is selling for as low as $0.75/GGE or about $0.85/DGE while UT CNG is selling for as low as $1.02/GGE or $1.16/DGE.

A diesel-CNG system is just a way of substituting high cost diesel energy with low cost CNG energy. The amount of substitution depends upon the sophistication of the CNG fuel controller. OEM systems like the Westport ISX-G engine can substitute 95% of diesel BTUs with natural gas. Cheap Diesel-CNG systems have minimal control so, if you turn up the CNG, you have to keep your foot off the gas pedal.

 

There are a lot more IP-equipped diesels running on WVO than PSD's - thats the only reason I mentioned it. David's heaters are just before the filters so this was kind of a non-issue for him, but I wanted to mention it in case someone had other ideas... Those hard chunks of 'carbon' wouldn't be very welcome in our injectors either - but I don't know of anyone who has wrecked any PSD sticks with electric heat yet. The Vegtherm heaters are infamous for this problem, as were the glow plug contraptions.

I use coolant to heat the VO. All of my fuel lines are TIH (alum fuel line inside heater hose), I have a Frybrid in-tank HE, coolant-wrapped VO filter and a 16plate FPHE just before the heads. I have a 203* t-stat and also use an aux coolant pump to insure coolant flow thru the VO loop. My system(s) are also 'deadheaded' on the VO-side, there is no 'return to tank' - the heated fuel is consumed by the engine. I see 180-200* VO before the heads with this configuration. There is absolutely no difference in the way my trucks perform with the different fuels.

One of my friends likes to say our engines get so hot they need a RADIATOR to keep'em cool - why not use some of that 'free' heat to warm our VO?? Of course, that only helps AFTER the engine is running - hence the need for a 2-tank system...

Listen, I ain't too brite - seriously. I can say I have seen more VO 'conversions' than anyone I've met and I have a very open mind. What I have seen is that the 'investment' in a good conversion is rapidly returned if ya drive much. To the point that the BFT 'Vegistroke' system is an EXCELLENT INVESTMENT for saving money - even at $3250 or whatever it costs now. Do the math - How many gallons of diesel is that and how long will it take you to use that much? After that, its PAYING YOU back every time you drive. Hell, I have more problems finding ways to spend all that money than I do with my trucks' conversions. This system is so complete anyone who can change spark plugs is qualified to install it - and ya never have to go to the hardware store!!

Oh, I figure my VO costs me about $0.10 - $0.15/gal to dewater and filter. (I have a few places at home who give me all their WVO for free) This includes the gasoline for my collection pump, the electricity and all the filters/etc used to make 'fuel'. I have found quite a few people around the country who will sell me dewatered/filtered oil for $1/gal and take advantage of that every chance I get. Out west its a different ballgame though. There is stiff competition for WVO there in the 'land of fruits and nuts'. The wacko 'greenies' and their biodiesel counterparts combined with a saturated yellow-grease commodities market have made the stuff as expensive as diesel in many places along the left coast. FL is leading the way at making it the same way over here - but much of the country still pays to have WVO hauled off and many places are excited when I say I'll take it for free. Just do yourself (and me) a favor and always ASK for the oil. The thieves are making this more difficult all the time - besides, ya don't wanna get caught stealing MY oil.

 

very good reading and thank you for posting links for more info, this has my curiosity about setting up a turkey cooker and the 5 gal bucket processor.

 

Thank you SkySkiJason.......some good points/info there!

The only reason why I'm looking into the 12v heaters is because my setup is a single tank and my coolant fuel heater doesn't work until the truck is warmed up. So I think Dave's 12v heater will help do the trick as well as changing my return to before my coolant heater, then the 12v heater, filter & then the factory pump. I still need to do some research on this as to the best method; any insight on how your return is done would be very welcome. I do want to add RiffRaff's FRx, but that will be later. Unlike you, my $$$$ are very stretched right now w/ today's economy! Not too many people doing remodels or new homes right now and my fee's have dropped thru the floorboards!

 

I don't know if this has been tried before, but chek this out.
Amazon.com: JR Products HTH-A Holding Tank Heater: Automotive

JR Products Holding Tank Heater is a holding tank heating element is an easy and practical way to winterize your RV or trailers tanks. It can be used on either fresh or septic tanks. It is dual voltage ready for both 12 volt and 110 volt applications. These elements are thermostatically controlled to stop the contents of your tank from freezing. It comes with a 24 inch ground wire for safety. Each heater draws approximately 1 Amp AC and 10 Amp DC current when in use. Multiple elements can be used where needed for tank coverage.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Would it work if bonded to the bottom of a fuel tank. Plug it in at night or 12 volt when on the road maybe?
I have a small 110v heating pad with an inverter and it is used as a heated pad when driving. Works very well and could also be mounted to the bottom of a fuel tank and then wrapped with insulation. Low wattage but quite warm.
Bob Bates

 

My diesel system is stock except for adding check valves at the heads. The VO pump is internally regulated (FASS HPFP) so there is no return on the VO-side. VO is fed to the opposite end of each head via the 'test ports'. There is a solenoid valve between the VO filter and the heads that allows me to bypass the VO check valve, pump, filter, etc and flush diesel thru the heads and back to VO tank in order to 'purge' all the VO from the engine.

For you guys, (if I can't convince you to do a 2-tank ) I'd consider a couple valves and tees in the supply and return lines before fuel pump. When you want to be 'looped' close the valve on return line to tank and open the one between the tee's - so your sucking fuel from the tank and the return line at the same time. I would keep the option to return to tank since this is the only way to remove air from the system. The FRx would only be effective if return goes to tank... FWIW, air is not the end of the world for our injectors - it will make engine louder - aka 'cackle'.

 

What about waste oil or propane?

 

Between my buddy and his brother they have (3) 7.3l; one bought a Welcome to Golden Fuel Systems! - PRODUCTS MAIN system and then copied it for the other 2 trucks and they have been working great. He teases me about the purge setup they have......but I could afford to build it when I started messing around w/ it. I do have the switching valves already and my fabricator buddy is suppose to be getting me a price to make a tank.....but that is another day. But my buddy has the FASS fuel pump and loves it, his brother has the Raptor in both of his and he has had one fail. I'm still on my stock pump because I can afford to upgrade.
Tee'ing in the return is a good idea w/ a manual valves and I didn't even thing about the fact that the FRx would be pointless if I did that.....
Thank You! I think I may even do this, this weekend!