Which Option would be more effective?
Thread Starter
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Fleet Mechanic
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 1,724
Likes: 2
From: Vancouver BC Canada
Which Option would be more effective?
I'm looking for some opinions. I bought my v10 because it was such a good deal and had the 4x4, crew cab combo I was looking for. Realistically, the truck is more truck than I need 95% of the time. That being said, I really like it (the power and hauling ability are incredible) and would just like to make it a little more liveable, budget-wise.
Right now I'm getting 10mpg on a good day, city and highway mixed. I haven't taken the truck on an extended highway trip to test the pure highway mpg but I'm not too optimistic it'll be much better.
Keeping in mind a desire for improved mpg, would I be better served to swap axles to a 3.73 gear setup with the v10 or swap out the 6.8 for a 2v 5.4 with the current 4.30? I know the power difference is profound but I would be okay with that. My original preference for a Super Duty was for the v8 anyway.
What do you think?
Right now I'm getting 10mpg on a good day, city and highway mixed. I haven't taken the truck on an extended highway trip to test the pure highway mpg but I'm not too optimistic it'll be much better.
Keeping in mind a desire for improved mpg, would I be better served to swap axles to a 3.73 gear setup with the v10 or swap out the 6.8 for a 2v 5.4 with the current 4.30? I know the power difference is profound but I would be okay with that. My original preference for a Super Duty was for the v8 anyway.
What do you think?
Posting Guru
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 2,060
Likes: 7
From: Burnsville, MN
Its not my impression that anyone can say they did "X" and got a 50% improvement in mpg. The engine just isn't that bad to start with. However, lets say there's something you can do to get an extra 2 mpg, which would be a 20% improvement. If you drive 10,000 miles a year and pay $3 a gallon you might save $600 a year, maybe. It hard to see how that would justify swapping an engine on a decade-old truck.
Plus, oddly enough, its not an absolute guarantee that you'll get a major mpg improvement by swapping to a 5.4. After all, you'll still be moving the same chassis more or less at the same speeds, etc., which will require about the same amount of energy, and so the same amount of gas.
Yes, the 5.4 will weigh a little less and you might get on it a little less, but there won't be some night-and-day difference in the mpg.
A tuner might do something for you, or the gear swap, but its hard to see an engine swap unless you get the engine for free and do the labor yourself......
Plus, oddly enough, its not an absolute guarantee that you'll get a major mpg improvement by swapping to a 5.4. After all, you'll still be moving the same chassis more or less at the same speeds, etc., which will require about the same amount of energy, and so the same amount of gas.
Yes, the 5.4 will weigh a little less and you might get on it a little less, but there won't be some night-and-day difference in the mpg.
A tuner might do something for you, or the gear swap, but its hard to see an engine swap unless you get the engine for free and do the labor yourself......
Thread Starter
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Fleet Mechanic
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 1,724
Likes: 2
From: Vancouver BC Canada
Thanks for the reply. My thinking is that I could sell the v10 for what I pay for the 5.4 so that would be nearly a wash. Same goes for the diffs, I'm pretty sure there are super duty guys out there that would swap axles straight up for the gear change. I would do all labour myself. I've done motor swaps twice before, once putting a motor in that wasn't designed for that vehicle.
Other things I'm thinking about: Truck has 167,000km (101K miles) and I'm going to change the plugs (already bought some Autolites), the truck doesn't have the front airdam so I could find one of those, also the truck has the stock 235/85/16 tires. Maybe bigger tires would effectively raise the gear ratio(lower the number). Also thought about Mikes's 5 star tune.
FYI gas here in BC is $1.20 / liter or $4.50 / gallon.
Other things I'm thinking about: Truck has 167,000km (101K miles) and I'm going to change the plugs (already bought some Autolites), the truck doesn't have the front airdam so I could find one of those, also the truck has the stock 235/85/16 tires. Maybe bigger tires would effectively raise the gear ratio(lower the number). Also thought about Mikes's 5 star tune.
FYI gas here in BC is $1.20 / liter or $4.50 / gallon.
Junior User
Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 90
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I thought I was gettin screwed at 3.12 as gallon here in Ohio. You guys are really gettin screwed. The cartel is draining the wealth out of this country and Canada too. I am going to stop now before I really get ******!
Postmaster
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 2,564
Likes: 11
From: Wayyy NoCal, USA
The major factors affecting fuel mileage of our trucks:
- speed
- rate of accleration
- aerodynamics
- weight of vehicle
Then comes all the stuff you're thinking about. Changing the engine or gears are not going to get you nearly as much as you would hope.
For the reasons Barebones mentioned, if you were to drive the truck exactly the same with a V8 and 3.73 gears, you would likely get within 1 mpg of the V10.
The best solution I've found is a second vehicle for when I don't need the capability.
If it makes you feel any better, we're still about 1/3 to 1/2 the price of most of Europe...
- speed
- rate of accleration
- aerodynamics
- weight of vehicle
Then comes all the stuff you're thinking about. Changing the engine or gears are not going to get you nearly as much as you would hope.
For the reasons Barebones mentioned, if you were to drive the truck exactly the same with a V8 and 3.73 gears, you would likely get within 1 mpg of the V10.
The best solution I've found is a second vehicle for when I don't need the capability.
If it makes you feel any better, we're still about 1/3 to 1/2 the price of most of Europe...
Fleet Mechanic
Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 1,684
Likes: 0
From: Phoenix, AZ
If you were in MN, I'd trade axles with you... Though you'd probably be disappointed that the results aren't quite as drastic. Winter isn't particularly great for mileage. If you don't need the truck 95% of the time, you're probably better off getting a daily driver beater for cheap... yes you will lose the 4x4 and the safety factor, but at those gas prices, it should pay for itself relatively quick...
Don't make the mistake of getting something smaller like it (aka f150, or putting in a 5.4) though; unless it is a wash as far as cost. My old F150s didn't get much better mileage - 1-2 mpg at best, and were way behind this thing in power and capability.
Also, going from a V10 to a V8 will be a lot more difficult... swapping computers and wiring and whatnot, not fun.
Don't make the mistake of getting something smaller like it (aka f150, or putting in a 5.4) though; unless it is a wash as far as cost. My old F150s didn't get much better mileage - 1-2 mpg at best, and were way behind this thing in power and capability.
Also, going from a V10 to a V8 will be a lot more difficult... swapping computers and wiring and whatnot, not fun.
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Hotshot
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 10,101
Likes: 40
From: Pa
I have 3.73s in my truck and I can tell you going from 4.30s to 3.73s is not going to do much of anything for your mpg. I don't forsee you gaining enough mpg with the 5.4l to justify the expense of the swap, especially if you have a CC SD. My neighbor has a 97 F-250 LD (F-150 with increased GVWR) with the 5.4l NPI and he has been getting 12-13 mostly highway.
The winter gas and cold dense air make mpg go down. My last tank was a hair over 10mpg and that was about 40% highway granted there is not a straight or flat road in my state though.
As for the tires I would not go any wider. If you want to increase the diameter and need tires you can look into a set of 255/85R16 tires. I have 285/75R16s on my truck and got better mpg with the stock 235/85 tires. The added width and larger lug spacing of the 285s create more drag.
The winter gas and cold dense air make mpg go down. My last tank was a hair over 10mpg and that was about 40% highway granted there is not a straight or flat road in my state though.
As for the tires I would not go any wider. If you want to increase the diameter and need tires you can look into a set of 255/85R16 tires. I have 285/75R16s on my truck and got better mpg with the stock 235/85 tires. The added width and larger lug spacing of the 285s create more drag.
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Posting Guru
Joined: Apr 2007
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I have been shopping around for a 2001-2004 Escape for my daughter's first car and I like them so much I think I will buy one for myself and keep the miles off my truck and maybe save some gas. Besides, having a third vehicle can be an advantage.
Posting Guru
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 2,060
Likes: 7
From: Burnsville, MN
Ha! That's funny. That's exactly what I did a few years ago. I bought a bottom of the line Superduty for when I needed it, and an Escape for when I didn't. I refer to the Escape as my "High Mileage Option" for the truck!
When I need the power I get 10 mpg; when I don't, I get by with 28 mpg (on true gasoline). They're real solid and comfortable. In six years I haven't had a single problem with it. In fact, we got 65,000 miles on the factory tires...
When I need the power I get 10 mpg; when I don't, I get by with 28 mpg (on true gasoline). They're real solid and comfortable. In six years I haven't had a single problem with it. In fact, we got 65,000 miles on the factory tires...
Thread Starter
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Fleet Mechanic
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 1,724
Likes: 2
From: Vancouver BC Canada
Thanks for the replies everyone.
I've done some more thinking on the situation (what, me obsessing about my truck?! Unheard of!) and I think I'm going to focus on a few things.
Firstly, I'm going to do a tune up, change plugs, fuel filter, maybe o2 sensors if I can scare up the cash.
Second, change the rear brakes. They are unevenly worn and the lower caliper pin bolt on each side has a torn boot so I'm thinking the infamous sticking calipers may be in play.
Third, I'm going to find and install a replacement front lower valence. All of the reading I have done suggests that it helps to redirect air away from undercarriage items that cause drag.
I'm still toying with the gear change possibility. It seems strange to me that Ford would offer a taller gear set if the only effect was to lower power.
We'll see. We have a family trip planned in early February that will be the first time we have stretched the trucks legs since I bought it. Just over 400 miles round trip through the mountains so I'll hopefully get a better understanding of trip mpg.
I've done some more thinking on the situation (what, me obsessing about my truck?! Unheard of!) and I think I'm going to focus on a few things.
Firstly, I'm going to do a tune up, change plugs, fuel filter, maybe o2 sensors if I can scare up the cash.
Second, change the rear brakes. They are unevenly worn and the lower caliper pin bolt on each side has a torn boot so I'm thinking the infamous sticking calipers may be in play.
Third, I'm going to find and install a replacement front lower valence. All of the reading I have done suggests that it helps to redirect air away from undercarriage items that cause drag.
I'm still toying with the gear change possibility. It seems strange to me that Ford would offer a taller gear set if the only effect was to lower power.
We'll see. We have a family trip planned in early February that will be the first time we have stretched the trucks legs since I bought it. Just over 400 miles round trip through the mountains so I'll hopefully get a better understanding of trip mpg.
Junior User
Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 90
Likes: 1
If you are going to tow, you want the 4.30 rear end. The 3.73 is just going to run up your RPM's. I don't think you will be happy with that climbing mountains and towing. If you are not going to tow, 3.73 might help your MPG but not that much. 1 MPG? Just my opinion.
Elder User
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 547
Likes: 2
From: Darien
If you look at the long thread reguarding MPG with the V10 here you'll see mileage is pretty constant with either of the 3 ratios Ford offered. If you got the 4.30s leave them. Makes the truck so much better. One of these days my 3.73 are going to the scrap heap for a set of 4.30s. Brakes dragging is probably the number one cause of mileage lost mechanically speaking. My truck is getting pulled into the garage this weekend for some TLC. I know they are dragging and causing issues. Not the first time any one has had the problem.
Postmaster
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 2,564
Likes: 11
From: Wayyy NoCal, USA
BC - GREAT plan!
Those are the best bang for buck options.
Well, short of driving slower... With the chipped brick aerodynamics of these monsters, even 5 mph will result in noticeable mpg changes.
Those are the best bang for buck options.
Well, short of driving slower... With the chipped brick aerodynamics of these monsters, even 5 mph will result in noticeable mpg changes.