For those driving large trucks (Not large people driving trucks, lol), I was curious if there was anything you've changed or done to make them more daily drivable.

I am at a decision making spot in my build that will effect a great deal; weather to keep the duallys or go the 4x4 route. I do have to drive in the snow, but I am thinking the size of this truck may make it possible to not need the 4x4. (I have a thing for large tires and a low ride though...)


I don't want this truck to be difficult to drive, something that just sits till I need it and not what I choose to just go out. I am thinking I need to replace the pedals, either that or figure out a way to shorten the play in them. I have to travel my foot a loooong ways and when you're trying to stop a big truck in a hurry, its a bit nerve racking. It seems they once had air brakes, but not anymore, still have the cyclinder, the gauge and the lines, just no compressor. Anyone know if that effects anything? (like how a car with the powersteering removed drives worse than one that didn't have it to begin with)

I was curious if there was any sort of master cylinder or what not that should also be replaced, mine still has the original and I'm under the impression not having a dual chambered one is risky. Or are these large truck set ups not the same risk?


Also, what about steering, have you found anything to make it easier? Right now it turns about as fast as the USS Destroyer.


How about power? Have you found the stock engine to be enough after all the gearing?

And anyone know how to manually check or change the rear axle on a 2-speed? My button got stolen (seriously? wtf, who steels a button) and I'm not sure if I'm driving in low or not, or if first is really that low, ha.

 

The risk of not having a dual chamber master cylinder is if you have any failure of any component in the brake system, you lose all braking ability. That doesn't change if it's a small car or a big truck. Replacing the stock m/c with a dual chambered unit separates the front and rear brakes, so if you have a problem with one end, you still have some brakes to stop the rig. It is a highly recommended upgrade.

I'm not familiar with an air-over-hydraulic brake system. But I'm not the foremost expert on large truck brakes, either. SFAIK, it's either one or the other. If you had air brakes, but now have hydraulic, I would think it's been modified. Or else perhaps all your air parts are for something entirely different. Air brakes work opposite from juice brakes. The air pressure in the system actually releases the brakes, and when you step on the pedal, that releases the air pressure and the brakes grab. In this way, if you have an air pressure failure, the truck will not lose all braking, but will actually stop.

I'm not sure where I was going with all this. Modern power hydraulic brakes can be adapted to the larger trucks just like anything else, if that's what you're looking to do, and can be accomplished with either hydro-boost or vacuum. You'd just need to look for different vendors from the 'normal' F-100 stuff.

Hope this helps.

 

Thanks, thats important to know. I'll have to climb under there when its a bit warmer (when you get a high of 4 degrees working outside, in the snow, on cement sucks, lol) and see how it's all hooked up. People have mentioned seeing a compressor mount on the engine, and all the lines and everything are still there... I wonder if it be worth it to put one on and change it if everything is there... course they switched it for a reason maybe beyond the compressor.

I just noticed that the brakes seem "weak", like only the last inch of the pedal works and have like 9" of play. It worked better when I added more fluid, but all the fluid shot out a hole that was in the top of the bolt for the master cyclinder... about 12" straight up, boy was I surprised, lol. It shot out everything I had added, but before it did the breaks kicked in sooner and there wasn't nearly as much play.

I'm not use to anything this old or this big, so questions abound.

Anything I can check without taking it apart? Or is this just how the old brakes where? I'd love to hear from someone driving an F-600 on that...

 

Stephen,

While I don't have any direct experience with a Ford truck the size of yours, I do have more experience than I want to talk about with a brand X truck the same size as yours and of the same vintage. I've looked through the manuals for the Fords and the layout and even some of the parts are the same between makes, so I'm pretty sure that the driving experience will be similar. And it sucks. I honestly think that you'll hate it. These things were built to work hard and driver comfort wasn't much of a consideration.

The rear suspension, to begin with, has virtually no flex at all unless you've got a pretty good load on. Every bump jars your teeth and that takes a lot out of you after awhile. You've mentioned shortening the frame a few times. If you reduce the wheelbase, the ruff-rider effect will be even worse. You're really going to want to do something about it.

Since we're already back there, let's talk about the 2-speed axle. Put that on the "sucks pond water" list, too. I can't quote the exact numeric ratios, but they can be accurately described as stupid low and ludicrous low. Top speed on my '57 Chubby in high gear, high range is 50 with the engine screaming for mercy. Low axle range is intended to move a tremendous amount of weight from a standing stop. Unless you've got 5 or 6 tons on, it's never needed. I don't think you'll find it to be useful at all. If you want to drive it as much as it sounds like you do, you'll at least occasionally want or need to take it on the highway and the gearing just isn't practical for that.

Then there's the brakes. I'm not sure exactly what kind of system yours has as far as being straight hydro or air over hydro, but you can be sure that it's a single circuit in either case. It does work when everything is is good shape, but like 52 Merc said, all it takes is one fault in the system and you're in trouble. My truck has dual wheel cylinder drums in the rear and single cylinder drums in the front with a single circuit master and a Bendix Hydroboost vacuum booster. I've gone COMPLETELY through the system and it does stop adequately, but it's not like a sports car or even a modern pickup. I use this truck on local rural roads and it's fine for that. City traffic is another matter. I'm fearless and I wouldn't even consider it. Parts for the brakes on these big old trucks are extremely difficult to find and sometimes it's impossible. I had to modify and substitute similar parts from newer trucks on this one in a few places. Prepare yourself for an expensive hassle if you do brake work.

I've never been brave enough to drive mine in the snow, but I tend to think that it wouldn't be a pleasant experience without a lot of weight in the back. In mud or snow, you'll always have the most traction with the least amount of tire in contact with the ground. You want all the weight on a narrow tire to cut through the snow. The wider your contact patch, the greater the tendency is to "float" on snow and spin. I can't help but think that two tires would be even worse.

Whether your 272 is going to provide enough power is going to depend on how you set the rest of the truck up, how you gear it, and what your expectations are. Frankly, since it runs good, I think I'd set the rest of the truck up the way you want it first and make a determination on the powerplant last after you've had a chance to drive it.

 

I typed so much that I figured I'd better start a new post! I think that you should go with your gut. You've had a plan to shorten the wheelbase, do a 4x4 conversion, and build a custom stepside bed almost since you bought it. For what you want to do with the truck and the kind of work you do professionally, I think that your plan would net you a truck that will fit your needs well and you'll actually want and like to drive.

There are MANY ways to go about what you want to do, but here are my suggestions:

Figure out how much you want to shorten the frame and where and then find a rear axle and suspension donor. I think the '67 - '72 F-250 or F-250 would have the same frame width, so the swap could be as simple as locating the assembly on your shortened chassis and then drilling the holes and mounting the spring brackets. An F-350 axle could be had with dual rear wheels, so that option is still on the table. I think that could really look cool with a step side bed if done right and you'd still have plenty of weight and hauling capacity. You're probably going to want to be looking at about a 4.10 ratio.

Either a Dana 44 or Dana 60 solid front axle can be had or set up with 8-lug wheels to match the rear and several gear ratios are available for them as well. I can pass along some information and sources on front axles when you get to that point to help you know what to look for. I'm not exactly sure what to tell you to do about the front suspension. I think what you have will be too stiff if you downsize the truck. Look around and see if you can find a set of springs and brackets off of an F-250 or F-350 of your vintage.

Scrap the entire brake system and replace it. If you go the 4x4 route, the wheel hardware will take care of itself. Convert it to a dual circuit master. I'd probably want a power booster on a truck that size, too.

The balance of the 4x4 powertrain could consist of the engine and tranny you already have combined with a divorced NP205 transfer case. Running a divorced case will give you the flexibility of swapping the engine and transmission later on without a lot of trouble if the stock pieces don't work out.

No matter what direction you decide to take, do lots of research and think it all through - especially your honest expectations for the finished product. You got a nice, blank canvass to work with right now, but once the torch touches the steel, you're more or less locked in!

 

Thanks for the input, that pretty much confirms what I've been thinking (lol I've started and stopped before i posted this topic several times).

When I was looking for a truck, I was looking for anything, even just a cab, then this one fell in my lap and even had the fenders I would need for larger tires. I've wanted it to be a 4x4 since before I bought it. I'll never move more than 1,000#s, and if I really need to, crap I'll just rent something, it's not like I'm running a farm where I need to on a daily basis, and even then an F250 or F350 would be more than enough to do the job.

Just not practical for daily driving, and I don't want it to just rust away as it sits hoping to see a use one or twice a year.

Thanks for the input!

 

I am doing basically the same thing with mine.


I am planning to use a "hydrobooster" like my 94 3/4T diesel Suburban has installed. It uses power steering pressure to operate the brake booster.

I like the idea of the hydraulic boost and the dual res/split system.


I'm also keeping my 292 Y-block and will use the E4OD automatic I recently had rebuilt. (pics in the gallery)

I'll also add power (assist) steering. I think it might have been an option in 56 or 57. The drag-link control valve is an easy addition and it's the same or very similar to the control valves used on newer E300 vans.

It'll be easy to add the control cyl to the tie rod.


I also have a 5.83:1 2 speed axle. I doubt I'll be able to shift on the fly but I don't think I'll need to. (or want to) 5.83:1 is plenty low and with the automatic it'll shift pretty nice.

Just remember that if you change the transmission, you'll need to find a suitable E-brake.

You don't want to have to chock that thing to keep it from rolling away and over some little old lady!!!






Cheers,


Rick

 

I installed new single master cylinder as it was stock,and new hoses and belts and tune up and my 56 F600 now has the bed removed.
It needs weight on the rear wheels badly. Even if you build a bed from a couple of longbeds....you will still need alot more weight over the rear axle.
I just moved mine around in 8'' of snow and I have 2000 lbs of weight on the frame....it drives like a tank.....almost as good as my awd truck.
When I bought it...I knew it was huge and would drive like a 56.....that is the way I like it. I hope to drive it to my ranch next fall and will drive the whole trip.....It will be a real wild ride!!

 

Bill,


I love the pictures you have in your gallery!

Especially the engine color!

Mine is gonna be yellow too!!!



You didn't use a high mount pump on this engine. It's not the one in the F-600 is it?

 

Rick...I thank you for the comment.
The high-drive fan is in my 56 f100....and it will soon come out for a 223.
A buddy wants a yblock and since I have about 6 of them ...decided to go with a 223,so we will swap soon.
My 64 yblock was red....all my yblocks are yellow....and my new one is yellow...and original paint/I pressure washed it,and wow was it clean....so no new paint for it. Just pale yellow.....or daytona yellow from duplicolor or plasti-coat.
Bill

 

Rick....I am getting 3 sets of ram-horns soon....cannot wait till they get here. One pair on 2 56 F100s and 1 pair on the engine pictured above on the 56 F600....

 

YOU ARE GONNA LOVE THEM!!!


John Mummert has done a "bang-up" job on them!!


I also want his intake manifold and valley cover!