I've got a toyhauler with a gross weight of 11,600lbs and the hitch weight lists at 2,690. I don't understand what that really means. I know you have to have a 5th wheel to handle that weight, but can the F250 or the F350 (6.0 psd) bed/frame handle that type of 5th wheel? Will it cause the front of either truck to lift up too much and ruin handling? Don't have any experience with a 5th wheel so I'd appreciate any recommendations. Thanks!

 

The gross weight of your trailer, 11,600 lbs., is the maximum the trailer can weigh by itself. The hitch weight, more commonly called "pin weight" here for a 5th wheel, is the amount of weight transferred to the hitch in the truck when the two are hooked together. The hitch point should at least be over the axle, a little forward by a few inches is better. When it is forward of the centerline of the rear axle, a small fraction of that weight is then transferred to the front axle as well. Too much forward, and you will overload the front axle, too far to the rear, and you will lose steering. What you also have to take into account is the individual axle ratings (GAWR) on the door sticker. You shouldn't go over those. Then you should look at the GVWR (gross vehicle weight rating) of the truck, you shouldn't go over that when you add in that 2690 lbs, you, passengers, fuel, cargo, etc. to the truck's weight. Then there is the GCWR (gross combined weight rating), which is in the owner's manual. This is the total rolling weight--truck, trailer and everything in and on them.

A trailer that size is probably pushing the limit with a F250 diesel, just because the diesel engine itself is so heavy. Not that it can't get it moving, it would just be harder on the suspension and axles. An F350 dually would be better suited as it could easily pull and support that weight, plus the extra set of rear tires would give you more lateral stability going down the road.

Jason

 

I agree fully with Jason, while the 11,600 could be handled with the 250, the 2690 in the bed would drag that bad boy down. I am a beliver in dual wheels for heavy loads. It gives a lot less white knuckle pressure.

MT

 

I printed this thread out to hand to my manager. I want to see what he makes of it.

If I can - since he's a ford guy, maybe I can git him on here.....

~Wolfie

 

That sounds awfully high for the pin weight. Hell your looking at well over a ton sitting in the bed! I would double check that weight. Your going into 450-650 territory there. I have seen many large 5th wheels that were top of the line units with every imaginable option weighing in at 17,000+lbs with only a 1,800 pin wieght. My mom and dads NU-Mar weighs 16,000 and the pin weight is 1400lbs. It still drops his 350 4x4 onto the helper springs. Just enough to remove the rake on the truck.

 

I've wondered how they come up with the pin weights for the toy haulers. With the box empty, all the weight is going to be ahead of the axles. Seems like the pin would lighten up when the toys are loaded.

Here's some numbers from my new rig:
Tow Vehicle is a 2006 Ford F-350 6.0L PSD, DRW, 4x4, Crew Cab, Long Bed, Signature Series 18K hitch, LineX Under the Rails Spray-in Bedliner,3/4 tank of fuel, driver on board. The truck has the Tow Boss Package with 4:30 rear axle ratio.
4800 Front axle - Rated for 6000
3600 Rear axle - Rated for 9000
8400 Gross - Rated for 13,000
GCWR - 26,000
The new trailer is a 2007 Nu-Wa HitchHiker Champaign Edition 37CKRD triple axle with 4 slides, dual A/C, Combo Washer/Dryer.
Advertised weights are:
Axles - 6084 each for 18,252 Total
Dry - 14,180
GVWR - 18,700
Both of them across the scale under the same condition listed above (3/4 tank of fuel, driver on board)
Front axle - 4900
Rear Axle - 6620
Trailer Axles - 12,500
Gross Combined - 24,020
Calculated Pin weight - 3020.
Actual trailer weight (GCW - Truck) 15,620
I figure the limiting factor for loading this baby up will be the GCWR of the truck, since I have pleny of room on all the axles, and both of the GWR figures.

 

Well, one way to figure it out is to weigh the truck itself while hitched and the trailer off of the scale. Then load the toy and see how much it lightens up.

Weighing it with the truck on the scale and trailer off of it while hitched and no toy inside should give you the GVW of the truck with the load on, then weigh the truck all by itself without the trailer and subtract the lesser from the higher. -I bet it turns out to be the estimated pin weight of the trailer without a toy in it, or real close to it.

The trade off here is that you have more load on the truck without the toy inside, but you have more combined weight (and therefore pulling, stopping, and turning issues) when the "garage" is full.

 

Check this site out real quick
http://www.meadowlandford.com/2005-f...ruck-specs.htm
it list the payload capacites of each, I personally know each truck can handle more than that, however, it is over the manufacture recommendations and depending on state could be illegal if you are over that. The F250 would be pushing the limits if not over where it is rated just above 3,000lbs. If you don't have a truck already, and its soul purpose is going to be towing the trailer, get a 350 duallie.

 

I was thinking the same thing. The front jacks on the trailer must be very large. That pin weight seems off. When they design these trailers they get pretty close on the balance weight and where to put the axles. Mine doesn't even get close to the overloads on the springs . I would check the numbers and find out whats what.

 

I agree with the weight of the Pin, or I should say get it weighed. I have a 5ther thats rated at 11500 any my pin weight is right at 1600. As for numbers my truck is rated at 13500 GVW and 23000 GCWV. My truck loaded is about 8800 with all the goodies. That gives me 4700 to play with. I guess were I am going with that is a ton on the rear of these new truck just give them better traction. I do agree a 450 or 650 is a good tow truck but the new trucks have a pretty high rating also. Heck with my 5ther on there it barely squats my rear. I get about a 1-2 inch drop. My only regreat is I wish I got a dually but I got the truck then located the 5ther on sale later. Plus my wife hated the last dually during the winter months (9 of them) PS the Dually F350 is rated at 23500 unless you get the 4.88 rearend according to my book but I think the TowBoss ups that as mentioned above. For $600 more I would go minimum F350. Look at a dually if its not out of your budget.

 

toyhaulers are designed different than a regular 5er or TT. they have much higher tongue weights unloaded to counter act the weight of toys. throw in 3 or 4 dirtbikes, maybe a quad or 2, gas for the weekend and it adds up quickly.

 

You also have to figure where the black and grey tanks are mounted. Water & solids must weigh into the situation - and any engineer is going to factor the maximum full tank load into that pin weight figure.

Or at least, I WOULD. So what does it really do to the pin load?
I honest to Peterbuilt want to know!

Then you also have to factor in all of the luggage compartments. Where are THEY? Forward or behind the springs and axles...

A smart designer would load heavy in the ones forward of the trailer tires, fill up the tanks that are ahead of the tires, and leave all of the back empty. And THEN figure the load by weighing the hitch weight.

I would bet on the pin weight a trailer is rated at being THE VERY WORST POSSIBLE LOAD. I expect if you load it right, it isn't anywhere near it.

Let's also think about interior storage while we are at it. You can...

I tell you what, okay people? If you were a loadmaster for an airplane, you would have to distribute weight in such a way that the aircraft CENTER OF BALANCE is where it ought to be. This is also how a trailer needs to be packed, think about it.

If you think of it this way - you can set up the ideal load for the best handling of your rig.

 

These kinds of questions are "no brainers".
Get the biggest truck you can afford,buy TH/TT after.If you already have the TH,then a truck rated to pull safely.(still don't understand the SRW 1 ton thing)
I live in an area where its downhill after a big pull, and many OHV'ers come here to ride. At least once a week there is a mismatched truck/trailer spilled across the lanes.
Do yourself a favor, buy the truck the can haul/stop the load. Load it properly,and drive the speed limit.

 

Whichever truck you buy I would recommend checking into a set of firestone ride rite air bags (suspensionconnection.com, and other sites). They will help level out the pickup and smooth out the ride. They made a hell of a difference pulling my fifth wheeler. Plus while towing at night my headlights are not pissing everyone off!

 

I am a newbie here so I hope somebody can help me make sense of all these numbers! I have an F350 super duty SRW 2003 6.0 L Diesel long bed truck and I want to upgrade my 5th wheel to one that has a max weight of 16,000 lbs. I was surprised to hear others say my truck couldn't haul it. What do you think??