I am trying to get and old F-5 ,1 1/2 ton truck running. It has not been running for at least 12 years. I removed the heads as the engine would only partially turn over using a wrench. I cleaned out the mud dobber nests and installed new head gaskets.At this point the engine turned over with the starter. I put water in the radiator and then the engine would not turn over. I removed the heads again and found water in the # 7 & 8 cylinders. I removed the water and thinking I may have a starter problem, I had the starter rebuilt. It still will not turn over like it originally did. I tried to pull the truck in gear for about eight feet but the rear duals just slide. What have I done to freeze the engine ? Any suggestions as to what I should try next. I did not want to pull the engine as I think at my age (73) that would be quite a task.

 

If you pulled the heads and found water in the cyls, I'd say that the block or heads are cracked. Very common problem. How much water was in these cyls? If they were partially filled or full, that would create a hydrostatic lock ( I believe that;s the term used) The water won't compress like the air and gas mixture would, so it is basically locked. Did you put the heads on and fill with water again? If so, you probably have the same problem again. Clean it out again, put a little oil in the cyls and check the crankcase for water. If there's no water in the oil, try to spin it over again without the water. Try to start it dry and just run it for a few seconds before it heats up. If you get it to turn over again, I'd do a compression test also to see if it's worth trying to start it.

Barry

50 F-1

 

Barry thanks for your reply.The # 8 cylinder was nearly full and # 7 had a little water in it but the rest were dry and a little water came out of a head bolt below these cylinders when I was removing the head. My neighbor said like you that the water in the cylinder was locking it up. The heads are off now and I can not turn the engine over either with the starter or by using a wrench on the front pulley hub nut. My neighbor suggested that I pour a little brake fluid into the cylinders and then stuff a paper towel into the cylinder and light it. He said it would heat the block up and possibly free up the pistons. He claims this is what he does when he repairs old one cylinder engines that he collects. I have never hear of this so I may try this method. He says there is just enough rust caused by the water to freeze the pistons. I have loaded the pistons with penetrating oil hoping that this might help to free up the pistons. There is no water in the oil pan so I think I may have caused the water to get int the cylinders by not having all the head bolts torqued properly.I am willing to try all other methods and will revert to pulling the engine as a last step.

 

That might cause the water to get in there by not torqueing them down. You could have a warped head also. These blocks also crack around the head bolts nearest each cyl. Some are harmless, some can go into the cyl walls. Hopefully, this is not your case. I'm surprised the water would create enough rust to lock those pistons that fast. The poenatrating oil is a good idea. I've never heard of the brake fluid trick. There was a post earlier about the starter locking up a engine. Do you have the little brace on the front of the starter? You might want to pull the starter out and then try to spin the motor by hand. I've freed up a few flatheads by using a wooden block about the size of the piston and giving it a rap or 2 to unseat the rust in the rings.

Barry

50 F-1

 

There is no brace in front of starter but I will try to remove the starter again and see if that helps. I will also try the block method as that seems to make more sense that the brake fluid method. I let you know if I get it freed up.

 

My starter locks my engine about once a year. I put it in high gear and push it backwards from the front. I have to get it rocking pretty good before I hear the clunk of the starter pinion gear releasing the ring gear on the flywheel. It is worth a try; no tools required.

 

If you need that littlr brace for the starter, I have several extras here. You can have one for the price of postage and a padded bag.

Barry

50 F-1

 

Barry I do have a little brace in front of the starter that connects to the starter and then is secured to one bolt on the oil pan.I assume this is the brace you are referring to. I don't believe I have a stater problem as I just had it rebuilt so I am pretty sure that the ring gear is releasing from the flywheel. I have put the Marvel Mystery oil in the cylinders and letting it soak and trying to turn the engine manually by wrench as well as tapping the cylinders with a block . This oil was suggested in the previous post you mentioned about stater locking up engine. Hopefully daily tapping and turning manually will eventually free it up.

 

Your starter cranked the engine with the heads on, and now it can't turn the engine with the heads off. It sounds like some type of mechanical interference. I would try removing the starter, and turning the engine with a wrench. The starter could be locking the flywheel.

 

Thanks guys for your input. I finally have the engine freed up. I put Zepreserve penetrating oil in the cylinders and had one person bump the starter while I used a wrench and a hammer to tap the wrench. It turned slowly at first but then spun over rapidly. I also had a couple of valves that were sticking but now everything does just fine. I am waiting now for my new head gaskets and head bolts to arrive so maybe in a week or so I will be able to check the compression.Thanks again for your help.

 

Glad to hear you got it freed up. If you need anything for the engine, I've got some parts, such as starters, carbs, generators, lots of head bolts, heads, distributors, etc.... let me know. It's just ollecting dust in my garage.

Barry

50 F-1

 

Might also check the heads with a straightedge for any warp-crude, but it works fairly well with care. Also, not being a flatty guru, I don't recall offhand, but do any head bolt holes go into the water jackets? If so, don't forget the sealer. No fun doing it again at age 73, or 23 for that matter!

 

Barry ,I will keep you in mind for parts. I have ordered new bolts but all they had in stock was the short ones so they have back ordered the long ones(appros. 2 5/8 in) I have the original bolts that I removed but I broke one when I first replaced the heads. Do you have the long ones,it takes 14 long and 10 short per head.I intend to chase the threads this time as I belive there was some crud in them causing me to break one and possibly not getting proper torque which cause my leakage problem. Do you know if it is wise to use Permatex aviation sealer on the bolts or would it better to use just anti seize? I don't know if any bolts go into the water jackets ,however water did come out of one bolt when I removed it,so it must go into the water jacket. A friend of mine has a surface grinder so I am going to have him check them to see if they are warped.

 

Most of the bolts do go into the water jackets. It's a good idea to chase the threads as you said. I would use some type of sealer on the bolts. I scrounged up 27 long and 21 short head bolts. If you want them, pay the postage to your address and they're yours. I'd rather see someone use them than toss them out.

Barry

50 F-1

 

Barry let me know cost and I will send you a money order. My address is Leo Mills,1021 Kouns Lane,Edwardsville,Kansas 66111. My email address is kvwinery@aol.com or you can call me collect at 913-422-5025 in order to give me your address as to where to send the money order. I will be glad to send additionl $ for your help and you need to make something on these parts.