General NON-Automotive Conversation No Political, Sexual or Religious topics please.

who knows wood?

Thread Tools
 
Search this Thread
 
  #16  
Old 05-25-2014, 06:54 AM
jroehl's Avatar
jroehl
jroehl is offline
Post Fiend
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Lafayette, IN
Posts: 6,473
Likes: 0
Received 3 Likes on 3 Posts
Originally Posted by ArdWrknTrk
Don't use iron/steel banding.
It will leave black chemical stains that are impossible to remove due to the tannic acid in the oak .
Plastic banding is okay.

The planks should be stickered. (small pieces of wood crosswise in the stack to allow air to reach all sides of the planks)
The stickers should be aligned with each other so the weight of the wet wood won't cause the boards beneath to bow.
Maybe within a foot from each end and every couple of feet in the middle for those 1 1/2" planks 8' long.
Paint common yellow glue -like Titebond- on the ends of the rough planks to slow evaporation and hopefully prevent checking (cracks originating at the ends of the boards)
Band the stack in a few places at the stickers to restrain wood movement while it drys, if you choose.

The guys at your sawmill should know all this...

Drying Wood at Home | The Wood Database
I second every word of this. Also, you do want to make sure you're getting white oak over red. White oak has a fair amount of natural rot resistance due to its pore structure. Red oak does not, and will rot quickly. One way to tell between the two is to take a piece of each that is about 1/2" square on the end and about 4-6" long. Stick one end into a cup of water. With the red oak, you can blow bubbles in the water, but not with the white oak.

Maybe one point that wasn't clear is that if the wood comes banded, it needs to be unbanded and stacked and stickered as Jim described so that it can properly air dry. If you just stick a banded bundle of green wood into a warm area, the outer boards will probably warp hideously at the ends, and the center boards will not dry at all, except at the ends, where they'll probably start checking (cracking).

Jason
 
  #17  
Old 05-25-2014, 09:39 AM
ArdWrknTrk's Avatar
ArdWrknTrk
ArdWrknTrk is offline
pedant

Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: EXTREME southwest CT
Posts: 23,576
Received 15 Likes on 15 Posts
Originally Posted by tjc transport
yea, they band with plastic strapping. i don't remember if they put the sticks between the planks though. i doubt it because most decking wood is used rite away.

so if i was to seal the ends and build a cabinet in the back yard out of plywood say 4X4X10 with a fan on one end and a vent on the other and let it sit banded in the sun over the summer, it would help it reach the proper moisture level for this area?
No need for a cabinet.
If you are not going to kiln dry and this is for a truck (not some climate controlled environment) you only have to reach EMC.
It is important not to force the drying unless you have REAL control like a kiln would.
Most people will crib and sticker the wood -weighted down- in an open drying shed or even just under a piece of corrugated metal.
Once the wood has given up much of its moisture you can then move the stickered pile indoors to a warmer location like the loft of your friends equipment shed so it might finish drying.

Like any function of osmosis, the wood will give up water much faster when it is completely saturated.
It is getting it to that final EMC that takes a long time without elevated temperatures.
And this is where a lot of the shrinkage occurs. (once the cells are devoid of free water and the cell walls start to collapse as they dry out)

Besides... with all the cost and time of building a structure and running a fan for ventilation, I could go to my local specialty wood supplier and get the kiln dried white oak I need tomorrow, and have the deck on the truck in a couple of days.
M.L. Condon Company Inc.

IMPE, most 'free' wood is not worth the cost of having to deal with drying and loss.
Exceptional planks of flame walnut, birdseye maple or curly cherry are the exceptions.
 
  #18  
Old 05-25-2014, 10:10 AM
tjc transport's Avatar
tjc transport
tjc transport is offline
i ain't rite
Thread Starter
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Marlboro Mental Hospital.
Posts: 61,003
Received 3,118 Likes on 2,174 Posts
ok. this is not free wood either, it is going to cost $225 for the 15 planks.
so since it is going to be in the elements, i guess i should just put it on the truck and then if it does shrink, add a board in a year or so.
i am putting it on like we do trailer decks. carriage bolt through the wood, and a large washer between the nut and the channel of the cross member beam. this way if it moves it will slide along the beam and not crack the wood.
 
  #19  
Old 05-25-2014, 10:26 AM
ArdWrknTrk's Avatar
ArdWrknTrk
ArdWrknTrk is offline
pedant

Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: EXTREME southwest CT
Posts: 23,576
Received 15 Likes on 15 Posts
75"x96"x1.5"/144=75 board feet.
That's $3 a board foot for rough green lumber!
My cost for KD S2S 6/4 white oak is ~$4.35bf.

I didn't mean to say you weren't paying for it.
Just that it costs me more to deal with wet wood than buy it dried.

If you choose to put the deck on right now buy an extra plank and let it be drying while the others do, because it is sure to shrink.
No point in doing it all over again in another year or so.

Be sure to seal the ends.
 
  #20  
Old 05-25-2014, 10:29 AM
hanklin's Avatar
hanklin
hanklin is offline
Hotshot
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Here in No. Calif
Posts: 12,736
Received 684 Likes on 397 Posts
Originally Posted by tjc transport
ok. this is not free wood either, it is going to cost $225 for the 15 planks.
so since it is going to be in the elements, i guess i should just put it on the truck and then if it does shrink, add a board in a year or so.
i am putting it on like we do trailer decks. carriage bolt through the wood, and a large washer between the nut and the channel of the cross member beam. this way if it moves it will slide along the beam and not crack the wood.
Way back when I did a few Kentucky trailers and also Oracle`s trailers for trade shows (before they got uber huge) and if I recall we used 16` WO and it was ship-lapped using carriage bolts liks Tom says. Planks were laminated and not solid.
 
  #21  
Old 05-25-2014, 10:34 AM
tjc transport's Avatar
tjc transport
tjc transport is offline
i ain't rite
Thread Starter
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Marlboro Mental Hospital.
Posts: 61,003
Received 3,118 Likes on 2,174 Posts
Originally Posted by ArdWrknTrk
That's $3 a board foot for rough green lumber!
My cost for KD S2S 6/4 white oak is ~$4.35bf.

I didn't mean to say you weren't paying for it.
Just that it costs me more to deal with wet wood than buy it dried.
ahhh. now i understand!

Originally Posted by ArdWrknTrk
If you choose to put the deck on right now buy an extra plank and let it be drying while the others do, because it is sure to shrink.
No point in doing it all over again in another year or so.
Be sure to seal the ends.
yup, that will be the plan. i am going to call tuesday am and add i more plank to the order.
 
  #22  
Old 05-25-2014, 10:46 AM
ArdWrknTrk's Avatar
ArdWrknTrk
ArdWrknTrk is offline
pedant

Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: EXTREME southwest CT
Posts: 23,576
Received 15 Likes on 15 Posts
Best of luck to you.
I'm sure it will turn out fine!

I hope you understand why the extra $100 cost does not justify my stacking and providing shelter for a year or more and then moving the whole pile inside taking up space again for a few more months, and then jointing and planing it to dimension when I could just pick it up ready to go.
 
  #23  
Old 05-25-2014, 11:59 AM
04badford's Avatar
04badford
04badford is offline
Lead Driver
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: Manteca,Ca
Posts: 7,478
Received 2 Likes on 2 Posts
I liked the table , don't forget about swelling when wet, when I lay out a deck I keep it 1/16 to 1/8 now this is dry wood, wet at this demention will leave larger gaps. so a penny gap would be fine , just treat the whole board real good with non oil penetrate I say this because it will burn or darken the grain, don't use pressure treated material as it will twist and split and try to find old growth lumber tight grain holds up better
 
  #24  
Old 05-25-2014, 12:38 PM
tjc transport's Avatar
tjc transport
tjc transport is offline
i ain't rite
Thread Starter
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Marlboro Mental Hospital.
Posts: 61,003
Received 3,118 Likes on 2,174 Posts
Originally Posted by ArdWrknTrk
Best of luck to you.
I'm sure it will turn out fine!

I hope you understand why the extra $100 cost does not justify my stacking and providing shelter for a year or more and then moving the whole pile inside taking up space again for a few more months, and then jointing and planing it to dimension when I could just pick it up ready to go.
unfortunately this mill is the only game in town.
my options are to buy from them, order out of state online, or buy from a custom millwork supplier to cabinet shop/ furnature makers.

Originally Posted by 04badford
I liked the table , don't forget about swelling when wet, when I lay out a deck I keep it 1/16 to 1/8 now this is dry wood, wet at this demention will leave larger gaps. so a penny gap would be fine , just treat the whole board real good with non oil penetrate I say this because it will burn or darken the grain, don't use pressure treated material as it will twist and split and try to find old growth lumber tight grain holds up better
for a regular deck like i did at my parents condo i do 1/4 gap for expansion contraction due to weather conditions.
but this has to be wood on wood with no gap.
i actually wanted to do tongue and groove but they do not do that. i would have to go to the millwork supplier for that, and it is close to $8 per board foot, or over 3 times the price for mill cut wood. .
 
  #25  
Old 05-25-2014, 12:44 PM
04badford's Avatar
04badford
04badford is offline
Lead Driver
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: Manteca,Ca
Posts: 7,478
Received 2 Likes on 2 Posts
Southern pine with Marine varnish , you can get the T&G at the lumber yard, we use it for flooring , the 3/4 T&G is for roofing , Marine varnish would really seal it .Kiln dryed too
 
  #26  
Old 05-25-2014, 02:37 PM
tjc transport's Avatar
tjc transport
tjc transport is offline
i ain't rite
Thread Starter
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Marlboro Mental Hospital.
Posts: 61,003
Received 3,118 Likes on 2,174 Posts
that is what i am replacing. average life for SYP here is jersey on a deck is only 8-10 years tops before it rots out.
 
Related Topics
Thread
Thread Starter
Forum
Replies
Last Post
IB Tim
General NON-Automotive Conversation
8
10-13-2011 04:02 PM
wezol5484
General NON-Automotive Conversation
40
03-23-2011 12:02 PM
boulderdentist
General NON-Automotive Conversation
24
02-26-2007 01:20 PM
CowboyBilly9Mile
General NON-Automotive Conversation
7
10-25-2005 12:29 PM
shaggymane
General NON-Automotive Conversation
3
06-16-2004 10:43 AM



Quick Reply: who knows wood?



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 11:07 PM.