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  #1  
Old 03-23-2013, 07:32 PM
whalebus2112 whalebus2112 is offline
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Im ready to take the plunge

Hey guys. Im new to this section but not the idi one. I am a average working guy who has an exspensive hobby of riding my rzr in the mountain. We try to take a trip from Sc to Tenn about every 2 months but the $300-$350 fuel bill is killing me so I figure if I can invest some time an money to save money in the long run then lets do it.


I have a 87 super cab with a 093 turbo with a flat bed an it does everything I need to do. I also have a company truck so my idi only gets maybe 100 miles a month if I dont head to the hills.

I have done research til my eys have bled an I have decided to do a 2 tank system on wvo. My father in law is building me a 100 gallon tank for my flat bed an I need some quick info.

I plan on running a piece of pipe threw the tank so I can use my coolant to help get the oil moving. What size nipple will I need to connect to the heater hoses so I can make a heat exchanger? 5/8? I plan on running the tube right over the outlet on the tank so it just warms that area. Also what size nipple will I need for the fuel line outlet to make it easier to connect with what ever heated hose everyone is using?

Sorry for all the questions but my wife is going to leave me if I spend any more time on the computer. I have spent like 3 hours a night for 2 weeks lol

I have the funds so now I need to get a parts list together so if any one has any recomendation then let me know. Oh yea , I want to do a seperate system for the wvo an start it on diesel and turn it off ont it. I Think I am going to use the 2 in 1 hose with the fuel line in it. I know I need some check valves an a way to T tap the wvo return back t0 the supply line . What is a good way to switch between the fuel sorces. Do you have to put a electric pick up pump on the diesel so you can kill it? Man it seems endless.
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Old 03-23-2013, 11:35 PM
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Quote:
I plan on running a piece of pipe threw the tank so I can use my coolant to help get the oil moving. What size nipple will I need to connect to the heater hoses so I can make a heat exchanger? 5/8? I plan on running the tube right over the outlet on the tank so it just warms that area. Also what size nipple will I need for the fuel line outlet to make it easier to connect with what ever heated hose everyone is using?

Sorry for all the questions but my wife is going to leave me if I spend any more time on the computer. I have spent like 3 hours a night for 2 weeks lol

I have the funds so now I need to get a parts list together so if any one has any recomendation then let me know. Oh yea , I want to do a seperate system for the wvo an start it on diesel and turn it off ont it. I Think I am going to use the 2 in 1 hose with the fuel line in it. I know I need some check valves an a way to T tap the wvo return back t0 the supply line . What is a good way to switch between the fuel sorces. Do you have to put a electric pick up pump on the diesel so you can kill it? Man it seems endless.


You are doing yourself a big favor by planning ahead. Too many people enter into this conversion without doing research.

5/8" bibs are what i used to tie into my coolant lines. It all depends on what size coolant hose you use.

If you want, you can coil some aluminum hose in your tank to heat up your oil, as you stated. If you want to do it simpler, buy a hotfox or WVO Design Hotstick. i mounted mine horizontally in both of my WVO vehicles, but vertical is OK.

Your questions about bib and nipple size are kind of irrelevant, because you will inevitably need all sorts of bib sizes, reducers, elbows, etc. You won't know until you actually start placing your components, to see how much room you have. My suggestion, go to McMaster carr's website and buy a big package of aluminum fittings, with various threads and radii. then return what you don't use.

Oh yeah, and I'm sure from your research, you know not to use copper/brass/steel fittings, hoses, and components. Aluminum and some stainless steel will react the least with WVO, thus reducing your polymerization issues.

I absolutely agree, the best way is to have complete different fuel systems between the diesel and veg sides. Great to hear you are already planning that.

HIH is a great plan.

selector valves..... do NOT go with pollack. Try hydroforce or WVO Design valves. i use the Hydraforce valves numbered: SV10-31-6ORB You can find them all over the country, at hydraulic supply stores.

You should have a dedicated fuel pump for your veg. there's a guy on this forum that sells duralift pumps for a good deal. I have one. it's great. You'll have to search for him because I don't remember his handle.

Other components, not mentioned in your post....

Heated filter head. You will need a dedicated filter for your veg system. You could theoretically go with a standard filter, but it might have slower flow than a heated one. i've always used a heated filter head. Something like this:

Heat exchangers. Nickel plated FPHE's are good and affordable. Don't go with copper or brass, as stated before. I'm using a 30 plate on my van, and it's more than enough and I'm just running HOH. With your HIH, you should be fine.

Tanks: You should be looking for aluminum tanks. You can find lots of boat tanks that are aluminum or plastic. There are black plastic tanks that I've seen other greaser install, but i'd never trust my cars with plastic if they melted due to the coolant hoses. Or you can have a custom tank fabbed in aluminum, if you know someone that can weld.

Gauges: I'd at the very least recommend a temp gauge with a probe up by your first selector valve. You should be maintaining 150deg to 180deg with your WVO. The gauge also acts as a fail safe...if you see your temps dramatically falling, you know there is a problem with your system and you are running on diesel.

This is a good place to start.
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1988 Ford E250 Club Wagon | 7.3 IDI + RD2-90cc IP + Hypermax Van Turbo Kit | C6+GVOD w/ MaxOD Deep Sump & Electric Temp Probe | Wrapped Pipes & Turbo w/ Auber Instrument EGT/Boost Gauge | 4" Dia. Alum Driveshaft | 4.10 Gears | 32-gal Custom Alum fuel tank w/ Centroid sending unit | NAPA Coolant Filter | Michelin LRR 16" treads | Chrome Warn Winch Bumper | 115W PV Array | Brass Heatercore shutoff valves | Aftermarket Steering Stabilizer | Synthetic Lube all-around.
1998 Jetta TDI.
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Old 03-24-2013, 01:58 PM
whalebus2112 whalebus2112 is offline
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Thanks for alot of answers. After reading all day about how bad metal tanks are I have decided to go with a plastic tank, probably will order it today.
I dont see why I would need to heat the tank since I am going to have heated line from the tank an a heated filter then a plate right at the pump. Does that sound like it will work? I just dont want to deal with a hot tube in a plastic tank an I am cheap.lol

So where does the pump for the Vo go. Can I mount it buy the pump or does it need to have warm Vo in it to work properly? Also do you have to put an electric pump on the diesel side? I would think it would damage the stock lift pump to keep pumping but nut moving any thing.
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Old 03-25-2013, 12:49 AM
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Quote:
Thanks for alot of answers. After reading all day about how bad metal tanks are I have decided to go with a plastic tank, probably will order it today.
I dont see why I would need to heat the tank since I am going to have heated line from the tank an a heated filter then a plate right at the pump. Does that sound like it will work? I just dont want to deal with a hot tube in a plastic tank an I am cheap.lol

So where does the pump for the Vo go. Can I mount it buy the pump or does it need to have warm Vo in it to work properly? Also do you have to put an electric pump on the diesel side? I would think it would damage the stock lift pump to keep pumping but nut moving any thing.
Plastic is a good option for your tank. I've seen it done, so I know it works. I just always stick with aluminum.

You don't have to heat the tank. Lots of people don't heat their tanks. But the benefit of heated tanks are if you run thick oil or if you are running in really cold temps. Also, I imagine it just makes your veg flow easier at the fuel pickup.

yeah, a hot tube in a plastic tank is always a wildcard. A friend of mine has a plastic tank, and he installed a vertically mounted Hotfox for the fuel pickup. It hasn't melted his tank. I think he has some sort of cork gasket though, that might resist the transfer of heat.

You can put your pump after your filter if you want. I know lots of people do that so that the pump has clean fuel. However, when your filter slowly clogs, the pump will create a vacuum in your hoses. I've seen rubber hoses that suck flat by the vacuum created by a veg transfer pump. Ever since, I've always run my pumps before the filter, so they are always pushing rather than pulling. To ensure my pump life, I've always made sure my filtration process is down to 1 micron, so that I don't let crappy oil go thru my fuel pump.

As for your sequence of components, you want to put your hottest coolant order closest to the front of the veg circuit. So, you might want to put your FPHE in line closest to the first selector valve. Then your filterhead, then your pump, then your tank fuel pickup. That way, your tank (if it's heated) has the lowest heat from your coolant circuit. But you can change it up as you see fit. I know some guys like to have their veg hot as s*** when it hits the pump, so they put that after the FPHE. I don't like this personally, because I've been in cars where the fuel pump overheated, as most of these pumps are rated to have 180deg fuel flowing thru them. It's all kind of irrelevant though, because on a long enough trip, the coolant circuit will be ultra hot, regardless of the sequence of components.

As for the stock lift pump, that was something that I had to figure out on my own, because all vehicles are different. Your IDI has a turbo, so it might be different, but my lift pump taps into the top of the diesel filter head. Then the diesel flows thru the filter, then to the center steel line to the IP. I tapped into the diesel system in this line between the filterhead to the IP, by cutting it in half, then tying the output-flow line to the first selector valve, then the input-line from the first selector valve to the IP. The default setting on the selector valve was set to the diesel side, so that if anything bad happened, it just ran on diesel. While in the process of doing this on my IDI, I noticed i was pumping diesel into my veg tank. I looked everything over, and found a bleeder nub that connects into the rubber-braided hose on the passenger-side injector return hoses. I thought this flow was to recycle hot diesel back into the diesel filter head, but after finding all the diesel in my veg tank, it's obvious this hose serves as return functionality. At first, i thought like you did, and considered capping that off, but that would mean my stock lift pump would be pumping against a closed off selector valve and overpressurize the diesle filter. So instead, i ran a dedicated return bypass hose from the bleeder bib on the diesel filter head to a tee after the second selector valve that returns to the stock diesel return line. So instead of the stock configuration where this bleeder bib connects to the injector return lines, it just returns to the diesel return line. I think this resolves the issue of the stock lift pump just pumping away at a brick wall. Granted its a small bib hole, but it does act as a pressure release and is working for me. Another solution is like you said, just put in a new electric diesel pump and have it shut down with a relay once you flip your first selector valve on.

here's a picture of the stock IDI fuel system hose for your information. It might help a little about what I explained.

Click the image to open in full size.
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1998 Jetta TDI.
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Old 03-25-2013, 06:45 PM
whalebus2112 whalebus2112 is offline
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Thanks alot for your help! I think I will go with an electric pump for the diesel also since they are so cheap, I think like $40 for a holley red or the advance or napa one.

Do you have a pic of your set up an at your pump? I was looking at the pump supply line today an was wondering how did you split your hard line or did you make it with soft line an a Tee? Any recomendations for veggi pump and heaters and valves an filter housing. Thanks for being my sponsor LOL
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Old 03-25-2013, 10:51 PM
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I wouldn't go with a cheapo diesel-side pump. I haven't personally installed an electric diesel pump on my IDI, but I've read enough posts on FTE to know that everyone swears by the duralift pump. It's up to you though.

I have pics of my veg system, but I've been waiting to make a page on my website showcasing the install. I'm kind of busy for the next few weeks, so I don't anticipate having anything up for a few months. But to answer your question, i split the hardline from the diesel filter head output to the IP. If I were you, I'd use two duralift pumps, one for grease, and the other for the diesel side. FPHE's are everywhere, just don't get copper. and valves.... i mentioned that in a previous post.

If you plan ahead and wait for sales/ebay/amazon/etc, you can pick up lots of good components for 10%/20%/50% off regular price.
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1988 Ford E250 Club Wagon | 7.3 IDI + RD2-90cc IP + Hypermax Van Turbo Kit | C6+GVOD w/ MaxOD Deep Sump & Electric Temp Probe | Wrapped Pipes & Turbo w/ Auber Instrument EGT/Boost Gauge | 4" Dia. Alum Driveshaft | 4.10 Gears | 32-gal Custom Alum fuel tank w/ Centroid sending unit | NAPA Coolant Filter | Michelin LRR 16" treads | Chrome Warn Winch Bumper | 115W PV Array | Brass Heatercore shutoff valves | Aftermarket Steering Stabilizer | Synthetic Lube all-around.
1998 Jetta TDI.
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Old 03-25-2013, 10:51 PM
 
 
 
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