Hello,

First the cliche' Long time reader, first time poster is now out of the way.

Back story. I own a 99 F150 SCAB 5.4 as my tow vehicle. My wife, yes you heard correctly, feels after our trip to Florida back in October we should get a larger vehicle to make our tows. We own a 30foot 6500# TT. She agreed it felt a little close to the limit of the truck. So I got the go ahead for a 3/4 or 1 ton Super Duty.

I am looking at V-10s with the 5R110 A/Ts So pretty much 05-10 CC SB models. I have found a few. One in particular is an 2005 F250 Lariat with approximately 80000 miles and a fairly loaded out. I figure not bad for an 8 year old vehicle. However, the price is another thing. The place wants well more than what I feel that is worth especially with a lack of service records. I am aware I would be getting someone's old headache or an unmaintained vehicle. A car fax showing it has been registered every year is pretty much useless. If purchased, I would do a full service knowing it was service.

I figure I would use the " USED V10 check list" floating around this site. Is there anything else should I worry about? I know MY 05 was the first year for this engine and trans combo. Something traditionally advise is not to buy the first model year. However, this engine/ trans combo seems to be pretty stout and reliable. From what I read, it makes excellent power for towing without the Diesel price tag.

Spending money on a new truck for us would be a waste since we would be using this truck to perform towing and weekend duty for the most part. It be comes a DD for me when the weather is bad and my wife has to go into work. She takes my explorer in. (Inside I would love to own a 2013 Super duty with the 6.2 6R140 but monetarily it doesn't make sense.)

Thanks for any comments and help on the matter.

 

Welcome to FTE.

The V10 is an excellent engine and will be an outstanding choice for you. I wouldn't worry about the 2005 being a "first model year". The majority of the changes were the replacement of the front leaf springs with coils which netted it a tighter turning radius, upgraded chassis which resulted in higher payload and trailer towing capacities, minor interior changes, and addition of several options such as the integrated brake controller and the upfitter switches.

I had an '05 and it was a fantastic truck. Quite honestly, there have been a few occasions since owning this '11 that I've wished I had it back.

The V10 changed over to the 3 valve heads in the '05 models and it changed the ratings on it to 362 HP and 457 TQ. This combined with the TorqShift 5R110W transmission make it an excellent all around platform for towing, hauling, or pretty much anything you could want to do with it.

Once you settle on a couple of trucks, take the VIN to your local dealer and see if he'll run you an OASIS report. This will contain the record of warranty work that has been performed on the truck since new.

 

I agree with John that it is an excelent choice and also that is the exact truck I will be looking for when I decide to upgrade...

 

There are a couple quirks, but otherwise as has been noted they're great trucks. The first and biggest is the spark plugs - if they haven't been changed they can be a real pain. Actually it was a problem from 05-early 08. The plugs were a two piece design and can sieze in the head. If you're mechanically inclined Lisle makes a tool that reportedly works very well to remove them - but for a new purchase I would make replacing the sparkplugs part of the deal. The new plugs are a better design and anti-sieze is used when installing them so it shouldn't be a problem again.

The next is a specific quirk to 2005's - the first few months of production used a bad snap ring in the transmission than can fail and exit through the side of the case. I don't remember the exact date it was fixed but it was anything with a build date before February or March 2005.

 

Absolutely loved my 05 6.8 3V! It really has the pulling power you'll need. I've since upgraded to a 6.0PS but that V10 was hands down best gas engine I ever have towed with. The torqshift trans is gonna be a huge upgrade for you too. The built in trailer brake

Agreed on getting those spark plugs changed right away. Then you won't ever have to worry about it.

 

I figured it would be either Krewkat or you for the first post congrats I have been doing alot of reading and research on the engine platform. I felt if I couldn't get a 6.2/ 6R140 combo, it would be the 6.8/5R110 combo. I never thought about the 5.4 since I already have one. I felt it has pretty descent power for the F150 and did in fact serve my F150 well. The bucket truck guys I use to work with had 5.4s in their 350 chassis and they all said the truck just wouldn't go. I use to tell them at least they had V8s our service vans were Chevy V6's and they didn't like to go at all either and they had no weight unlike my F350 counterparts. I was thinking about pulling the Oasis reports.

I am aware of the 3 valve plug issue. The infamous Lisle tool. It was one of the reasons why I went the 5.4 2v route. Also the F150s I was looking at the time we pretty overpriced dealer wise and 2 of the 3 dealers flat out refused to replace the plugs before signing over the ride. The third one said they would replace them if I paid the "breaking fee" if one or more broken. I knew the spark plug issue was an issue but that kind of dealer service just overall turned me off to the point I was looking at a few Chevy 1500HDs.

The dealer in which this particular truck was located appears not to be a Ford dealer. I highly doubt they would not perform any kind of service to the vehicle unless I paid full retail which I am not planning to do. My plan is to have my local Ford service department quote me on the full service. My family and them have a pretty good repour due to the whole Windstar thing awhile back. Interestingly, my local dealer tends to be cheaper than most of the hack jobs in my area for most repairs.

I was unaware of the the issue you bring up about the snap ring in the Pre 03/05 production. I plan on trying to get a door striker photo for reference and verification purposes.

I spoke with my BiL about his 6.0. He is an exChevy guy with that engine. Unfortunately he had the go around of the usual troubles. Since he is in the automotive business, he repair costs are less but he was advising against the 6.0 unless I found one that was bulletproofed. He said the repair costs were not worth it vs the gasser for my application. His trailer is a 35 footer, 9500 model! His ride is 2006 F350 DRW Lariat with only 35000 miles!

So far thank you for the information. Please keep it coming in.

 

Don't forget about the exhaust manifold studs.

 

hello,

I managed to get a few minutes to give the dealership a call about the truck. The sales rep took a picture of the door jamb sticker.

Date of manufacture: 02/05 (iffy for potential problems?)
Diff: 41 open diff
Tires: LT 275/70R18 (photos in the ad show 17 inch rims from have I researched)

The dealership reps Ford as well as 10 other brands so having a Ford tech doing the work is not a deal breaker. I asked about any other service records in regards to what has been done to the truck. The rep stated they only perform a vehicle inspection and oil and filter change. (I could do that. yup no scratches.) There are no known service records unless an Oasis report would state otherwise. The only other information you could speak of that was offered is the truck is "motor trend certified" and had a "nation wide MT backed warranty for 1 year". However, the rep didn't seem overly pushy and wanted to answer any questions I might have. The dealership is a fairly large one in Ohio and has a fairly decent rep/ reviews as far as dealerships go.

I am more concerned about driving or even flying out to the location (the dealership offers airport and hotel transportation service.) and finding out the truck is really not even worth what they are asking or willing to balk at lower price. I feel the lack of service records is a major drawback in my book. I would adjust my offer as leverage. If they are willing to perform a full service (plugs, wires, trans fluid, TC, Diffs, coolant, etc.), I could see it being worth it. I am probably being paranoid in the fact the sales rep could have a fake service record drawn up to show the service was done just to get the sale. Make a few extra bucks with no real shop time involved. Unfortunately, that trick has been unsuccessfully tried on me and I had no part of it. (This was the reason why I was turned off by the 3 valve 5.4 when I was shopping for the F150. I negotiated for a tune up only to hear 20 minutes later "oh that was done. See here is the report dated strangely enough the day before." )

As my boss put it, bring a stack of cash. Ask to speak in a private room. Place that stack on their table and say this is what I am going to offer you. As he put it, if the offer is reasonable, they are fools for not taking the offer. If you are wondering about the price, they are asking $20,000 which seems a tick higher than the books.

Any thoughts or insight in whether or not I should investigate this truck further? Thanks!

 

Well one thing you might consider would be posting a thread in the Ohio Chapter forum to see if there are any of the folks there close by who'd be willing to go check the truck out in person for you. It's worth asking and I've seen it done by folks on here before. They could take some detailed pics for you and e-mail them, etc.

The other thing is you could get the VIN and if you've got any local connections with a dealer in your area, get them to run an OASIS.

 

That is something to think about. That might be a route to explore. Tomorrow, during work, I will call my local dealership and ask my service adviser to run a report. It is on my checklist of things to do.

 

might want to check with all the people that arent having issues with their 6.0. Majority of them probably arent posting on here.

 

I am sure there are plenty 6.0s out there working hard and never had a lick of trouble. My BiL offered to give me a hand while looking for a truck if I were to pursue the diesel option. He has excellent experience with the 6.0. His advise was to be basically prepared for repair cost and known troubles and added the fact they are not meant to sit around and get groceries on the weekend.

I have some experience with the 6.0. When I worked in the construction equipment field, we had 3 6.0s and 2 of them were excellent except for our service truck. That was a 2005 with a 6.0. Plenty of power for towing but it probably spent just as much time in the shop for warranty work than it was working in the field. The road tech was a big Ford guy and myself would defend the truck. However, the head shop tech was just as big of a Dodge guy and would make a point to let the owner know to trade the truck in for a Dodge every time he would be at our location.

So I was able to pull the Oasis report on one of the trucks I was looking at. The report is clean. 2 records. One for a fuel line recall in 2005 and a Warranty claim in early 2006 for a small noise in the steering wheel. I spoke with service adviser I normally deal with. He said the mileage sounds low for that many years in service. He said they typically deal with well over 200K vehicles on that particular drive train in that particular age range. He and one of the mechanics standing at the counter getting a work order agreed the drive train is pretty reliable and trouble free. He also said for that price it worth a look as well. He gave me a service quote if I decided to purchase the truck. It was about what I was expecting for a complete service from axle to axle.

 

Quick question. Any thoughts on a V10 2V / 4R100 combo? I have found a few older ones in the 2003-2004 range. The distance and the price is also less. So I could drive a couple of hours instead of flying or driving literally 8 hours to look at a truck that might not like when I hit the lot.

 

Great motors also, transmissions are the weaker point. They do well with some upgrades like the 6.0 cooler and a shift kit.

Personally, id still jump for the newer truck. Be patient, it took me a few years to find my truck(2005 F250 CCSB Lariat 3v V10 with 4.10s)

 

Hello FTE!

My wife and I are back from Ohio... without a truck.

On Friday my wife looks over the truck again thinking it may be a good buy. Renting a car and a hotel room are cheap over the cost of an airplane ticket. She picked up a Lincoln MKZ from the local Enterprise using her corp discount code. Speaking of which, the MKZ is one nice ride. It was very roomy and comfortable for our trip. We also had the option to leave the car in Ohio if we decided to purchase a vehicle.

We got out to dealership at 1AM and stayed at a local Holiday Inn right down the road. The dealership knew we were coming in first thing in the morning. Literally rolled onto the lot at 9 on the dot. They brought the truck up from the back and we spoke with the salesman and his "supervisor" ie the "closer" as it turns out. The supervisor throws out some line about they need 60 cars sold today to break some record and they are willing to do what ever he can to make the sale. (usual sales BS)

I shut the truck off and took a look under the truck from the back to the front. It was missing the spare, had a 2 holes in the muffler (found during the test drive), the driveline looked good along with the T case and Trans. Nothing saying "look at my oil leaks" I head towards the engine and look for the Exhaust manifolds. There was at least 2 missing studs in the bottom. When looking from the top, I found 2 more. The truck had quite a bit of rust on the underside but I was expecting that since the only info I could find on the truck was registration of the vehicle in NY and OH.

I continued playing dumb and looked over the engine compartment. Now I pretty sure the sales guy was also playing stupid as well but I asked him where the jack was located. He starts looking for it but I had already found it under the back seat. I told him that was important since I had a blown tire from a previous sale and the seller didn't have the tools to install the spare on. I didn't tell him the spare was missing and the lowering cable appeared to be removed from the truck. The back bumper had some trailer backing up damaged.

So after checking the electrical systems out. I noticed the one window was not properly functioning correctly. My mind is keeping a tally of everything wrong. he asks if my wife and I want to take it for a drive. I handed over my license. he came back with a waiver stating I was taking it for a test drive.

My wife and I are now on the road. There is a high speed 4 lane road which was great for checking the high speed aspects like handling and power. The truck had the power for entrances and passing. It was very nice. The 4.10s did a nice job putting the rubber to the road. The front end was loose and had a ton of bounce. (Expecting shocks would need to be replaced) We found a shopping plaza for low speed driving. The truck was ok in there until I drive along the side of a store. I heard the muffler. I got out and had my wife tap the gas pedal a couple of times to see where the leak was coming from. The muffler had 2 holes in it. At which point, I seen enough.

We got back to the dealership. The sales guy asked if we were interested in the truck and like to talk numbers. We said sure why not. My wife and I had a set number in mind after researching price and condition. This is the part that ticked off my normally reserved wife. The sales guy knew nothing about the truck's options. He had 20 minutes while we were on our test drive to gather them from their write up. He starts with a speech about how the truck is Motor Trend certified. (woopee doo) It has to be inspected by a certified MT mechanic for this certification. All service has to be completed and parts are replaced as needed. (I am not a certified ASE mechanic but this "certified" guy should have been fired or even just had his eyes checked because I found blatant problems. I also know from speaking with another salesman at the same place when I originally called up about the truck and service records was the only had an oil change and post auction check.)

Now we are sitting at the desk waiting for him to come back in from the write up. Then he goes I need my supervisor to talk to us about the price. We were like Huh? The price hadn't even been mentioned yet since he was just filling out the paperwork.

Another 5 minutes goes by and the "supervisor" comes to the desk. Mind you we were sitting there for 20 minutes so far no price, no offer of snack or drink. Nothing. Not even a "be right with you" So he goes. "here is the KBB value of the truck is $25,000 and we can sell this truck at this price. However this truck has a special internet price of 18,957 and there would be a paperwork temp fee of $300. This would be $19,200. This is the no haggle price. This price is below wholesale." (Can't you smell the dung!) My wife turns to him before I could even open my mouth and says yeah we are not going to pay that price either since the value is based on mint condition which the truck is not. The supervisor/ closer goes well we cannot accept anything less. My wife and I get out of our chairs and said ok then. We are going back to Jersey and my wife turned to the salesman. She said nothing against you but we are not buying the truck. The salesman looked like he was going to cry. He was stunned we walked out. His supervisor abandoned him literally 30 seconds earlier. He was like but you drove 8 hours from NJ to see the truck! I turned to him "yeah but 8 hours back is no problem in the Lincoln either " We walked out the door.

Now my wife and I are in going home mode. We didn't care either about not taking the truck since my wife knew there was more costs associated in getting the truck up to date on service. We had to make the call our local Enterprise agent to let them know the car was coming back not being dropped off. She was repacking a bag for the trip getting a water. We were in the parking lot for about 5 minutes before pulling out. Not one attempt to come out and work with us.

We are about 40 minutes away from the dealership and my wife's phone rings and it turns out the dealership is calling to ask if we are coming back for another test drive and see if they can be more accommodating on the price. This call was from some general manager of the dealership in charge of the used car division. He apologized he could not personally attend to our matter and was upset we walked out of the dealership. He asked if he could reimburse us for the travel expenses if were able to come to a deal. He didn't want to lose the sale over a few hundred dollars and he would match and double to difference for the sale. (now the MKZ has to stink like dung. no thanks! ) I said well the price your closer offered was for a vehicle in excellent condition. The vehicle that was being discussed was not. This GM starts with the whole Motor Trend speech. I said already heard it. He goes what is problem with the truck and the price then. I said you have no service records on the vehicle and the truck is far from even good condition. He said there is a service record. I said my wife and I and the dealership will be too far off to make the sale. To add insult, I said your closer was not interested in counter offers so we walked and they way were treated we felt ignored. Now he is trying to save the deal, " well what if we could do 18,000 plus your travel expenses?" I said no we are on our way back to NJ and we are no longer interested in buying the truck. He asks how much were you going to offer I said and said yeah the truck would have been good for 15 5-16. He is like yeah we can't do that. (I knew that already after the way my wife were treated.)

On the ride home, my wife came to the realization maybe a brand new one is not such a bad idea. We are going to look at 2012 leftovers in the local area. There seem to be plenty to choose from. She now sees my point of an older truck and the want on my end for a warranty. Being willing to bite the bullet for that truck payment is another thing.

In the end, I got to spend 17 hours with my lovely wife in a wonderful MKZ that I do not want to give up. My wife does not want to give up the MKZ as well. My plan to get rid of her Pontiac Grand Am is working! LOL We made up a new rule of no more looking at vehicles over 90 minutes away. I offered to give my super duty dreams so we could look into buying a MKZ for her, I mean me. (Also give some Lincoln rep in her parking lot at work. She is one of a few people where she works that doesn't have a luxury vehicle in their parking space.) Looking at new now is not feeling like such a bad idea anymore especially at the price of some of these trucks used going for basically new price.