Grand Design is having a heck of a time with frame failure (they like to call it flex) on their larger Solitudes and Momentums. I understand other brands are too.

Anyone on here dealing with this?

My 2019 Momentum didn't show any signs, but I sold it anyways as we are ready to down size.

 

https://www.ford-trucks.com/forums/1...caused-it.html

Maybe, waiting to find out from the service department. Forest River already denied the claim, so waiting to see if the extended insurance will cover it. Had floor separation from the curb wall on the upper landing by the bathroom.

 

My 2021 has a bent frame. I noticed one of my auto leveling jack legs was kicked slightly outwards and I inspected the welds and the bracket and nothing looks out of the ordinary so I held a speed square up to the I beam and the I beam has a slight twist to it. I checked the other I-beam and it also has a slight twist. The corner of one of my slides developed a crack in the fiberglass at some point on my 1400 mile trip last week. I havent ever removed the coroplast to see whats going on under there but I imagine it is hiding some damage somewhere.

My pinbox area doesn't flex like some videos show but warranty would deny my claim anyways since I have airbags on my truck and an aftermarket pinbox. People with a factory pinbox and no add-ons to their tow vehicles have had warranty claims denied. LCI is trying to absolve themselves of all liability and the manufacturers are trying to blame everything besides themselves. Waiting for the lawsuits to fly.

 

There's a really good FaceBook group by Pete West, called "Grand Design RV Major Issues" I highly recommend if you use FaceBook.

There's a lot of Grand Design Cheerleaders who had YouTube channels who are now completely pissed.

I don't see the brand surviving this, the GD reputation is shot!

 

I heard back on my Arctic Wolf, The frame is made by Norco and they say all measurements are within specs. Going to retrieve it this weekend. So do I attribute the floor separation to poor construction, lack of enough securing hardware, or what?

 

I checked out that FB group on my wife's account and it seems like the majority of the people in there are just in there to be part of yet another RV FB group and don't have actual issues. I'd rather be a part of a private FB group that is "How we are going to bring Lippert to it's knees and have them begging for forgiveness" than some group trying to play nice with a manufacturer who isn't taking any blame and quietly trying to sweep this under the rug.

The only thing I got was that there may be some lag bolts that are too small or never installed at all and the dealership might install larger ones. People with "Frame flex" have a long tough road ahead of them.

 

Not to defend LCI but they only make frames to specs provided by whatever OEM is ordering them. The OEM holds as much if not more responsibility then LCI for design flaw. LCI line quality is of another conversation.

Was talking to some RV folks and we were rambling about how complicated and large campers are. One guy brought up self levelers twisting the frame in ways old school methods did not. maybe something there? THe long overhangs on these monster rigs have to impact that.

What it looks like is RVIA is going to have to adjust like they did axles and tires a few years back to give something like 25% headroom. I think that was a positive. But maybe on frame RVIA may need to step it up. Maybe a 10 inch I beam needs to be 12? Engineers are goofy, they always try to build everything barely enough and as cheap as possible. Give me an factory full of Amish over a corporate disaster like the industry is now. Look at the old Shasta, Jayco or Globestar operations were in the 70s and 80s. Overbuilt monsters that lasted decades.

And there really is some flat out junk coming out of EVERY and ALL makers now. It is a hobby or lifestyle not for the faint of heart. It is an expensive brutal way to go.

 

RVIA is a lobby group for the manufacturers not for the consumers. They aren't lobbying to make things better for us but make things easier for people like Lippert. There are 4 companies that own 40+ "brands". That is where the problem lies. There is no push from competition to innovate because they all use the same exact LCI owned parts. There isn't another option or a company driving any other to be better. Bottom lines is all they care about. A .250" thick 10" tall I-beam is stronger than a .125" 12" tall I-beam. They use some THIN recycled steel on these frames and braces.

 

Lobbying is only a portion of what RVIA does. I am referring to the standards the industry uses, not saying it is perfect but it sure beats nothing and beats gobberment involvement. RVIA also does training sponsorship and stuff. They are the BICSI of the RV world, every industry has one of them money collectors.

The frames are so much thinner than when they were in house built for sure. However the modern RV buyer wants a wireless everything, 4 baths and 3 kids rooms and lets not forget 1 million watts of scare lights. They would not know a frame from a tranny dipstick. We have bad consumers to blame too.

EDIT-I am with you not fighting. I have had a bad deal with an expensive higher end unit and lost my tail on it.

 

I went from an 87 Class C on a Ford E350 chassis to a 2021 5th wheel that was supposed to be the epitome of quality. The 1987 had less issues. The E350 chassis tag said it was rated to 11,500lbs GVWR and the Class C weighed 13k lbs empty. It had a 15k lb combined axle rating so I wasn't worried but I did gross 19k lbs with it for 4 years hooked up to my trailer with my 4 seat Rzr. I never drove it more than 400 miles from home but in Alaska that meant 7-8% grades, winding mountain roads and hellacious frost heaves. I've had a conversation with my wife about finding a one-owner 90s E350 based class C and tow a small trailer but we don't have a clue what we're going to do. I already called insurance about my frame since my warranty expired but they (Grand Design) wouldn't help me out anyways if I tried. The factory is scheduling for September right now and they would expect me to keep making payments on it.

I had a platoon sergeant that purchased an old Airstream that was gutted and he filled it with his household goods when he left Alaska. It was loaded over 10k lbs and he made it all the way from Alaska to North Carolina without having any issues. Just surviving the Alcan would have been a feat. They definitely don't make anything like they used to.

 

Been a long time since I've walked an rv lot. Don't remember seeing an Arctic Fox before - liked the layout, but seems that being built outside of Elkhart doesnt help.

Now the Alliances I saw did seem to be ever so slightly better built than some of the others I'd seen. Anyone have experiences w/ them? Liked the Valor we looked at.

 

Most long term rv owner has the same story. I have the same story at about a $27k loss. Them high end “quality “ rigs are just entry level rigs crammed with China made fancy stuff.

I get it. I am into my 10th camper in 5 decades. Back to simple and frankly it is the best camper I’ve owned.

I’d say if you like camping suck it up and ditch the junk and move on. If you’re not a big fan get out. It is a painful hobby as you see.

 

If the Alliance has a cable driven slide system avoid it at all costs. If the cable is too tight it will snap. If the cable is too loose it will snap. I've seen an Alliance with a bedroom slide that had the cable ran under the bed virtually inaccessible instead of through the wall because there was no space.

The Schwintek slide system isn't much better but it is serviceable. The motor is the worst failure point and can be replaced and working in under 30 minutes. The biggest issue causing motor failure is either pinched wires or misalignment from the factory causing the motor to overwork.

 

We have been fiver shopping for the past year or so and have always visited shows and lots just to what’s out there. We narrowed our search down to floorplans with the large rear basement storage and after looking at everything available in the East we placed an order for an Alliance Paradigm 385FL. From what we saw it was a little better in nearly every aspect over the others and their quality of fit and finish seems to be steadily improving, not every manufacturer is moving in that same direction.
Ours will have 2 front living room sofa bed slides that are cable driven that I will be keeping a wary eye on, but so far the online owners groups aren’t reporting any serious issues with them, maybe BAL has made some improvements to the system.

 

Cable slides aren't the scary tiger they are made out to be. If properly installed and tensioned they last for years. They use a wiper motor to power them, and we all know that they last a LONG time. Before purchase, inspect the cables for slack and wear. Draw the slides in halfway and check the pulley alignment. As long as it is all straight and tensioned, they should be problem free. There really is no best slide system. Schwintech is made for small slides, cable for larger, heavier slides, and hydraulic for the really big slides. Hydraulics can have their own issues, like cylinders out of sync that skew the slide and can cause it to crack or bind.

When I got my Arctic wolf, 4 cables had to be replaced because they were frayed. The slides move very smoothly in and out, and there are 4 of them.