You had me there for a second when you showed the Ram dually parked behind your 17 F350. Congrats and thanks for all of the detailed, informative videos.

 

To further Troverman's point, even the Spring rate for the leafs in the pack are identical on both trucks

 

Thank you. That all makes sense. I appreciate the response.

 

The F450 weighs almost exactly 500# more than the equivalent F350 DRW. This results in 500# less payload on paper, but a greater real world payload. My fully loaded F450 KR has a 4753# payload with its 14k GVWR. My tires are rated for over 22500 lbs for a.point of reference.

I've driven both the F350 and F450, and IMO, the F450 is a VERY superior truck. 4.30 feels and tows great, tight turning, long lasting tires, 50% larger brake pads, bigger rotors, wide stance is a little more stable and looks great...

 

Yes I too watch your channel on YT. I have ordered my truck and will get it any day now. I found your advice very good, but found I was on the border of gas/diesel in your advice. And liked your advice on TT vs 5th wheel. I decided on a gas f350 with a dry weight 5th wheel at 8000lbs (GVW 10000). I will tow south in the fall and north in the spring. With minor moves during the winter. Liked the gas better and was within all towing specs. Keep your vids coming.

 

Owning a '17 F450 for one of my work trucks (also), just forget about any 'very superior' comments, totally ridiculous. It depends what you want more, I chose the 3.55 for my personal truck as I wanted lower RPM's on the Interstates. Absolutely love the F350!

 

Well let me ask this loaded question... If I'm towing a 42ft7" 5th wheel with 17,000 lb GVWR,. That puts about 3400 pound pin fully loaded. (20% of 17000) I have 4 people that weigh say 800 pounds with all their junk in the cab and a B&W companion hitch and tonneau cover. Is a 450 going to handle appreciably better/safer. than a 350?

I promise not to hijack the thread anymore

--Jim

 

I have not seen any of your video's, sounds like I should.
My 2017 is a 250 Lariat Ultimate and after 12K miles I am still in love with this truck. She is a daily driver for me and on weekends tows a 21 foot bass boat, effortlessly I might add.

The adaptive cruise is so dam useful that I can't imagine not having had this peice of tech until now.
Like you, she is a bear to turn and wish I could improve the turning radius!

 

Love your videos man! I watch all of them. I was so scared and let out a really loud noise when you showed the ram and then the Ford when you revealed your truck. Got really scared and then really happy. I honestly thought you were going to get another f450, it's main advantages are higher rated wheels and tires, turning radius, significantly better brakes than any other pickup, better looks (could be subjective), and the half shafts which granted is not a big difference. But I do understand why you went for the f350. I've never owned a truck with those type of tires but I can imagine how much of a pain it it looking for them.

 

The F350 DRW will handle it very well. The F450 will make it easier to maneuver, including backing the trailer into a spot, and will have the tires last longer. The engine brake can hold my 26k# rig at 65 MPH on long 6% grades, so I don't notice the bigger brakes so much. They would work better in a panic stop, but thankfully, I haven't experienced that.
By far, the biggest benefit for the F450 to me is the tight turning. I daily drive mine, and love how easy it is to back into a spot.

 

You and me both, Top_Speed1...as you know, I have a 3.55 dually as well. I like the lower revs on the highway just like you.

The 450 / 4.30 combination actually has no more pulling power than a 350 / 4.10 combo because the tires on the 350 dually are slightly smaller in diameter (0.4" smaller).

So yes, the 3.55 loses out on 4k lbs of max towing...but 27,300lbs is still perfectly adequate for me.

And as Justin says, yes...springs and rates are identical. I'm not sure about 2009kr's comment about "real world" payload...the springs are the same and the GVWR are the same. The HSR's do provide a lot more tire loading, but more payload will push the springs down the same way. An interesting point about the rear axle exists, as well. The difference between the M300 in a 350DRW and a 450 comes down to the halfshafts...thicker and more splines in the 450...but the rest is the same. When it comes to weight, since these are "full-float" axles, that means all of the truck's weight is borne by the axle tube, and none is carried by the half-shafts. So yes, the 450 has more capable tires...but they are only for looks. (And the tires and rims do look better!)

And now a word about the tires...the HSRs are a great highway tire with a very long tread life. However, they are a 12-ply sidewall and run even higher pressures. Now consider the 450's heavier weight...ALL of the 450's extra weight is unsprung: the wider front axle, the larger brakes, the heavier tires, and the heavier rear axle. This combines to produce an even worse ride quality than the 350 dually.

So, choose very carefully if you want a 450. The sharper turning circle is absolutely very nice, but considering I drive my 350 dually every day even through the city...the huge turning circle has yet to be a real issue.

 

If you truly want better and safer let's flip flop the circumstances, make sure you upgrade your 5th wheel to disc brakes. I did this when ordering-in my new coach. My theory is and has always been, let the truck stop the truck, let the trailer stop the trailer.

Almost all of my towing friends have the truck doing much more than it's fair share, and when I say that, I mean it's braking sometimes up to 50% (or more) of the coach.

So without the flip-flop mentioned^, the 450 does have slightly larger brakes. I do wish I could of got this feature, but I much more wanted the lower RPM's on the Interstates. This engine is such a low RPM / high torque monster (like most diesels) so why get it up and out of it's sweet-spot, and also have it drink more fuel?

Our 450 work truck is an AWESOME machine, but when I go on the Interstates spinning 75-85mph with it? It really sucks! . I always think it's got one more gear to grab.

The F350 w the 3.55 is near perfect for my personal TV, at least for what I do (45', 21K TV/haul'n) on mostly Interstates. Would I want the sharper turning radius and larger brakes? For sure!... and why wouldn't ya?

 

A 350 dually can be converted to a 450 quite easily. Just purchase both front and rear axles complete with the wheels and brakes. Purchase the front fenders from the 450; paint if necessary. Install everything...instant 450.

 

One thing I've learned about my new truck is that by using the 360 Cam when making tight turns, I generally have the room I need. The issue with my 2016 F450 (even though it had an outstanding turning radius) was that the hood was so tall I couldn't see how much room I actually had to make a turn and often there was at least an additional 3-4' of clearance that was invisible to me. The front camera lets you hug a turn and often make turns you wouldn't try in the previous generation. Best of both worlds if you have a 2017 F450, but possibly a great alternative if you are going from a 2016 F450 to a 2017 F350. There's roughly a 7.8' difference between the F450 and the F350's outer turning limits. That 7.8' can easily be the buffer zone I had with my previous truck. Now, in terms of maneuvering an RV, yeah, the F450's tighter steering is amazing.

 

If you see a 4.10 equipped Wide track Dana S60, please let me know