Again, you're missing the point. Chrysler products suck. Enjoy your new Edge or whatever it is

 

Wow, you sure are great with sweeping statements after 9 whole days on FTE. Jeeps own the new vehicle rock crawler market, Chrysler or not. Jeeps use Dana axles and lots of generic parts although Chrysler does build their engines and transmissions. Ford is not gonna build a Wrangler replica and even if they did, my guess is that you would not be in the market for one.

Calm down, work on actually reading posts (I did say that the Edge was great--as fast as musclecars I was driving before you were born--but that the Edge is not my choice), and settle in if you want to hang for a few years. Work on having intelligent discussions and sharing your knowledge.

George

 

Based on the wrangler sales(which are expected to grow to 350,000 a year with the introduction of the jk replacement, the lj, which btw would put it in the top 10 best selling vehicles) there is a large market for people that don't want this "sophistication" you speak of. Go buy a wrangler if I want one? Well I say go buy a 4runner if you want one. (btw the wrangler vastly outsells the 4runner) I am sick of jeep being the only player in this market and I want at least one more competitor and the bronco is the perfect candidate. For the thing that you want, you already have a lot to pick from. For what we want, we have one to pick from.

 

I disagree....if I want a tough body/frame SUV that is not huge (Expedition, Tahoe, Suburban, etc are huge), there is the 4Runner and nothing else. Remind me if I'm missing anything. I do like real doors (not the Jeep doors that get stolen in Detroit daily) and don't need a top that comes off although a couple removable panels or a big sunroof are OK.

XTerra and FJ Cruiser are gone. Body/frame Durango and Explorer are gone. Hummers are gone (and were always huge and dumb). I want simple and tough also, but coming from the direction of an enclosed vehicle and with 2 usable rows of seats (back seat legroom of the 4Runner is also stupidly small). And I strongly lean UAW/American, especially from a Detroit area plant that employs my neighbors.

I maintain that Jeep Wrangler sales are what they are because it is a *Jeep* Wrangler--an American icon since World War II. Ford does not have that kind of iconic vibe with the Bronco name. They do have the OJ chase which I don't see as a positive

I believe that Ford will hit my target with the new Bronco closer than they'll hit yours, but time will tell...

"Projected" sales are meaningless....but I agree that Jeep Wranglers will continue to sell lots of units.

George

 

LOL so now it depends on how long a person has been a member on the forum, as to what they know in "real" life? That's awesome. First of all, I couldn't care less about FTE or how long I am "aloud" to post here according to people like you. I think you're just chapped because everyone here doesn't think like you do, another stinging portrayal of someone your age, since you're older than me and know more than I do because of it hahahaha. I never attacked you, I just said you were missing my point.

I'm quite capable of having any kind of intelligent conversation you want to, but not when you get all butt-hurt and reject everything everyone says, and then try to assume what I am or am not in the market for as to say that I couldn't afford a Bronco, right? That's even better. I hope this site isn't the only life you have, for real.

Chrysler products suck BECAUSE they build their own engines and transmissions, and that's always been the reason why

 

Ummm last time I checked the ZF8 automatic and the G370 manual in the Jeeps are built by companies that are not Chrysler, or did you conveniently forget that? Last I checked the G56 in the Ram Cummins was made by Mercedes.

 

You know what? I conveniently don't care at all who builds any of Chryslers garbage. Besides, your buddy YoGeorge is the one that said it to begin with, or did you conveniently just cherrypick what you want to read and not read?

 

I must be the exception. I prefer to get every option I want, and not pay for useless crap the dealer thought would sell it. I order almost every vehicle I buy. I've waited 6 months twice....

 

Sorry but I have a problem with the "legroom lacking" part. The 73-79's have plenty of it.

 

Wow man you just get more and more offensive as we go...

 

Wranglers sell well because they are well known and have kept the basic design since WWII, just got larger over time. I was hoping this new Bronco would be like the T4 they sell in Brazil, which would be a Wrangler competitor. Looks like a retro Bronco. The Wranglers some prefer are ones with the old 4.0 straight six, which was the last remenant of AMC. It had more torque than their Penstar 3.6 VVT they have now, kind of surprised me. Saying that Chrysler sucks because they build their own engines, is really pointless. They seem to be doing fine anyway.

If I was in the market for brand new off road SUV, I would heavily look at a new Wrangler, since there isn't anything on the market that comes closer in the US. The Bronco is just a BOF Explorer with beefy features. So many vehicle choices for the same thing it seems. With this new Bronco only being limited production like the Raptor, it'll probably be so they can charge more for a "icon". It might end up being capable off road, but only for those with deep wallets, nothing the average worker could afford reasonably, but that's majority of all vehicles now.

 

Thanks for the realistic POV, Frdtrkul.

I had a 1970 Gremlin in 1975-78 with the old AMC 232, the early version of the 4.0 (POS car, great motor)...they also made the 258 inch six which saw use in the Jeep and those motors and the 4.0 were quite decent and gutsy. I also put about 100k on a Ford 300 inch six so I'm a believer in the oldies. It would be cool to see a straight six from Ford, but packaging it would be tough altho BMW can do it.

The only disagreement is that I looked up the 4.0 torque and it ranged from 224-235 lb ft at 3000-4000 rpm for the higher torque versions. The Wrangler 3.6 has 260 lb ft at a higher 4800 rpm. (And hp for the 4.0 was 190, where the 3.6 puts out 285.) But there are more gears in transmissions these days to keep a motor in the right rpm range.

Anyone who wants to deny the iconic legacy of the Jeep CJ/Wrangler is not rooted in reality. My son knew the word "Jeep" when he was under 2 years old and pointed them out.

And especially with Ford's recent management shakeup and lower profit/stock value, I actually have my doubts that we will see the Bronco...and if we do, it will be a high dollar vehicle to try to help Ford's bottom line. A loaded ESCAPE is 38 grand on the sticker, while used off-lease Escapes are flooding the market.

There are not enough mudders and rock crawling enthusiasts to make a blip on Ford's profit numbers. If the Bronco is gonna make money for Ford, it will have to hit the same demographic that the Wrangler does, and that includes a LOT of posers which will be needed to hit any sales numbers.

George

 

I might have been thinking power numbers for different engines I think the 300 I6 numbers instead. Would not mind a Pentstar version since mpg are decent now compared to what they were years ago.

 

I don't know why I didn't see this thread earlier!

The two door configuration sounds great to me, but the limited production and possible luxury-truck image make me worried.

I hope it's 'limited production' in the way the Raptor use daily to be, in that it's special, and a certain quota planned to be filled each year; and not in the way the GT is, around for one year only.

Don't look at 'limited-production' as automatically meaning 'so-luxurious-that-you-can't-take-it-on-a-dusty-road'. Everyone sort of pounced on those two words, and 'IFS' and 'luxury SUV' started getting thrown around. The limited production may actually be a good thing. It could be a rugged off-road truck that's geared towards the likes of many guys here. It could be limited production only because it's such a niche vehicle. If that's the case, and if it sells well, it may become less limited production in future years. Sound familiar? (Raptor, anyone?)

 

I can't be limited production. It has to sell in some volume. I could see a limited SVT version though.

As far as a direct Wrangler competitor, that would be tough. There is a huge Wrangler aftermarket and those companies would be slow to respond to the new Bronco if the sales numbers weren't there.

There is also the "It's a Jeep thing, you wouldn't understand" thing to get pat when trying to lure new customers .

The best comparison I can think of is Harley Davidson vs any other similar looking bike. No matter who makes it or how good it is. The aftermarket, support, brand loyalty attitude, etc all wrapped up in it

Bronco has been gone too long. I stated in another thread my thoughts on what it should be. Bare bones, utilitarian, boxy, inexpensive but rugged. That would be the base on which to build. Ford can make fancy ones for people with deep pockets and plain ones for utility contractors.

Young people today have less money to spend the the 2 previous generations. They are not going to buy high end ones unless they have trust funds or mom and dad have deep pockets. The Millennial generation is as numerous as the Baby Boomers. There are fewer high paying jobs for them and automation is going to cut the lower paying jobs quite a bit. Manufacturers need to figure out how to market to them.

As for me, a 2 door Bronco with very few options would work out great. I had a 2 door Wrangler a few years ago and all it hard was a hard top and A/C. If I could have ordered it without a back seat I would have.