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  #1  
Old 09-05-2010, 05:59 PM
sanike sanike is offline
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2000 5.4 replaced lifters - ticking again

I have a 2000 5.4 - the lifters were ticking bad on the front passenger side. After about 4 oil changes and every wonder cure in a bottle I could pour in - I replaced all the lifters and plugs. The motor has 178,000 miles. It was not a hard job to replace these. Got it all put back together and after about 35 miles - the ticking started back lightly at first and then by 70 miles it was a loud whacking sound. I let it sit over night and the next morning started it up and the whacking was still there - pulled it around the house to take the valve cover off and in just 40 yards of travel the ticking went away. Drove it around for another 15 miles or so and only after letting it sit ideling for 40 minutes it started whacking again from the same area as the original whack - front part of passenger side. Pulled the valve cover off - nothing obviously loose or broke or scarred anywhere. There was a small scratch on the second and third lobe of the cam but nothing that could be felt - just seen. Pulled the second and third lifter and rocker out - thank goodness for the 32.00 dollar tool - rolled them around and they seem fine. (when we replaced the lifters we did them one at a time making sure we did not mix up the rockers) Started it up with the valve cover off to see if we could see what was whacking and you guessed it - it was purring like a kitten - a kitten I'm ready to put a bullet in!!!!!!!!!!! Valve cover is still off - any suggestions as to what is causing the intermiten whacking sound like the lifter. I am running 5w20 in it but with all new lifters in it would it matter or even quieten it down going to a heavier oil - they are new lifters. HELP HELP HELP

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  #2  
Old 09-05-2010, 09:08 PM
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Moto Mel Moto Mel is offline
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I think you would be right in trying a premium 5W30 oil and see if it does the job. If not, use a mechanic's stethescope to pinpoint the actual location of the noise. Noises have a terrible habit of transmitting themselves to other areas in an engine.
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Old 09-05-2010, 10:56 PM
sanike sanike is offline
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I pulled out the first three lifters and one of them I could push the top of it down a little - the other two were solid as a rock. It would push down just a tad but would spring right back up. I checked all the old ones I had pulled out and all but one of them was solid. I'm guessing the one -the new one - that I could squish down the top of is my bad one. If that is so what would cause a new one to go out in just 30 miles and could it be related to why the old one went bad?
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  #4  
Old 09-06-2010, 02:15 AM
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Originally Posted by sanike View Post
I pulled out the first three lifters and one of them I could push the top of it down a little - the other two were solid as a rock. It would push down just a tad but would spring right back up. I checked all the old ones I had pulled out and all but one of them was solid. I'm guessing the one -the new one - that I could squish down the top of is my bad one. If that is so what would cause a new one to go out in just 30 miles and could it be related to why the old one went bad?
There might be something in the oil passage that is blocking the oil flow on an intermitant basis. Try taking the adjacent lifters out and apply air pressure in the oil galley and see if a chunk of something blows out.
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Old 09-08-2010, 07:35 PM
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I narrowed it down to the second lifter from the front on the passenger side. I used some 1/4 inch poly tubing hooked to a shop vac and ran it horizontally along the oil port. I alaso sucked out the bottom and that semicircle cut out in the bottom of the lifter hole in #'s 1, 2 and 3 lifter holes.
The poly tubing is clear and the oil in at the time only had 80 miles on it so it was pretty clear and I saw nothing obvious get sucked up.
I replaced that one lifter. The one I just put in came from Summitt and they were trick flows and the one I just put in was the same.
Put in new motorcraft 5w20 synthetic blend and a new motorcraft oil filter.
Let the thing idle for a while and after about 45 minutes it started ticking real low then after about 5 minutes of the ticking starting, it got up to that lifter whacking sound as original. I put my head down to the valve cover, and without taking it off, I would bet you it is the same lifter.
At this point I'm sure the lifter is not getting the oil it needs or I'm just fixing symptoms of some other problem causing the lifter to collapse.
Is it time for new heads or valves or springs or WHAT??!!??!! Do I have to pull the head to completely see that lifter oil port or holes that the oil is supposed to travel through.
One other question - if it is that (clogged port) why does it only initially start after the truck has run for about 40 minutes. If the port is clogged would it not do it from the start up instead of when the oil and motor has got warmed up.
I need some help on this - anybody else had this problem before - Like I said before - the colapessed lifter (now 3rd in a row) may only be the symptom.
I checked the rockers and they all seemed to be good and tight with no scratches on them. I checked the cam chain tensioner as well and there was not any play in the timeing chain.
Thanks in advance.
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  #6  
Old 09-09-2010, 03:01 AM
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It seems like it is time to install a direct reading mechanical oil pressure gage and pay close attention to it as your engine goes from a cold start up to normal operating temperature. To me, it sounds like you are losing oil pressure as the temperature rises. If that is the case you will need to first check your oil pan for debris and if it's clean there could be a problem with the oil pump. Possibly a broken outer ring that the gearotor runs in. You could use a borescope to check the inside of the pan as it is cheaper and faster.
This is only if there is a problem with the oil pressure.
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Old 09-12-2010, 10:37 PM
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If it was a oil pump problem wouldn't it affect all the lifters and not only this one - three times in a row. To check that oil passage in that one lifter hole I would need to pull the head wouldn't I to see if the cresent shaped hole in the bottom is clear.
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  #8  
Old 09-12-2010, 11:36 PM
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There is almost always a screw in plug in Ford engines at the ends of oil galleys. I would remove the plug at both ends of the head and use high pressure air to clear the galley. An oil pressure gage would help to eliminate at least one possible problem. Do what you want, it's only a suggestion.
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  #9  
Old 11-11-2010, 08:51 PM
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Update : Things still slapping around!!!!!! Recap - all new lifters and plugs on both sides. New rockers on passenger side. Ran it with valve cover off to make sure it was oiling good on passenger side. After about 30 minutes of running it will start to "whack" on the passenger side. Originally thought the noise was from the 3rd rocker so another new rocker, spring and lifter was put there. Still whacks after warm up. Can put your finger on the rockers - except for the new rocker spring lifter in #3 spot - and feel the "whack" - the #3 spot feels smooth as it is running. Took it to the ford dealer this morning to ask them and first thing they said was it is a oiling issue. They were talking about 1100 in parts and labor for changing the oil pump. I had them put a manual pressure gauge on it and oh wow - 40 lbs of pressure with it whacking away - not an oiling issue. I asked them what they would do then to fix it if I left with them. They just shook thier heads and said not sure - you have replaced the two things we would start with and since the oil pressure is good and the chain tensioners are good - had them check to make sure the timing chain was not slapping for giggles since you can actually feel the whack on the lifter end of all the rockers. The only suggestion they had was to replace the other seven springs on that side and see if it goes away since the #3 one that I did that on was the only rocker you could not feel the whack on. Is it common for all the springs on that side to go bad at once or should I look else where for the whack. It does not do it when cold - starts after about 30 minutes of running. HELP HELP HELP
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  #10  
Old 11-12-2010, 01:22 AM
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After all the work you have done with no real results I believe the best thing to do would be to change the oil again and use15W40 or 20W50 oil, just to see what that may do. Just give the engine a bit more time to warm up a little before putting a load on it. At this point what do you have to lose?
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Old 11-15-2010, 04:17 PM
great white whaler great white whaler is offline
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Smile

my lifters where noise poured a litre of ATF fluid in a year
ago noise went away
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  #12  
Old 11-22-2010, 06:02 PM
sanike sanike is offline
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I think it is a stuck valve. I ran it till it got hot and started making the whack sound again - all new lifter, rockers and springs on passenger side. Can see and feel the first rocker slapping around. All the others look smooth and when placing a small screwdriver on the tip of the rocker they all feel smooth expcept for the first one on the passenger side towards the front. Swapped out the rocker and lifter real quick and same thing again. Was about to change it again and as I was compressing the spring down I noticed that the valve did not slide down easily with the spring like all the others - the valve keepers almost came off - I had to push the valve stem down with a screwdriver as the spring was being compressed to put the rocker on. So- I'm assuming that is a stuck valve - now what - how do I unstick a valve without pulling the head and doing a valve job. Or is that the only way to unstick it? Thanks
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Old 11-22-2010, 09:28 PM
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The only safe and sure way is to pull the head.
The only other way that might work would be to get the tool to compress the valve spring and remove the keepers, retainer spring and seal. Then get a drill that will reach in far enough to attach to the valve stem and use the drill with a lot of WD40 on the valve stem and spin the valve slowly to try and free it up. Make sure the piston is all the way up just in case the valve gets free, so it won't fall into the cylinder too far.
If that works you got lucky and I'm a hero for suggesting it. If it don't work I never heard of ya.
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Old 11-22-2010, 09:39 PM
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I ran two bottles of sea foam and one bottle of chemtool through the vacuum line - each time I sucked some up a little bit at a time then towards the end of the bottle I stalled the motor sucking up the liquid. Waited about 30 minutes then started it back up. I'm sure I have killed every bug within 10 square miles of my house. Did this three times and after just a little bit it will start whacking. I can put a cold lifter in and it will be quiet for just a little while. I did notice that instead of the front of the rocker pivoting on the lifter - after it got hot the cam would push the rocker down and instead of the back of the rocker pushing down on the spring and the front of the rocker pivoting on the lifter - the rocker would push down "flat" and push down on the lifter as much as it would the spring - I think squishing all the oil out of the lifter and making all the whacking noise as it beat up and down. Since the back is not moving the spring down could that mean the valve is bent not allowing the back of the rocker to go down and making it push all the oil out of the lifter with the front of rocker since that is the easier part to move? Bent valve or look somewhere else???
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Old 11-23-2010, 02:15 PM
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Pull the head...have it rebuilt and be done with this mess. With that many miles I am betting you needs to replace your timing chains anyway....If your bottom end is still tight, then pull the heads, replace the chain and have the heads rebuilt and you will be good to go for another 100k
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Old 11-23-2010, 02:15 PM
 
 
 
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