Won my DSB.
#16
01-08-2005, 12:20 PM
Originally Posted by toypuller
My letter said that "upon notice of acceptance a dispute resolution specialist will contact you to make necessary arrangements. Ford will make every effort to complete the described action within 30 days of our receipt of the acceptance form." That is kind of a vague time frame for Ford.
I can only tell you what happened to me:
I accepted the decision imediately and had a replacement lined up and ready to transfer. I did the legwork to the dealer that had the truck I wanted and moved it forward to the point were they told me that all the original dealer had to do was call them up and get it.
I was contacted by the "Dispute Resolution Specialist" and found her to be less helpful than the Customer Care Hotline folks if that tells you anything. She imediately told me the dealer would handle everything. Her favorite line was "that's not my job" and "Ford leaves that to the local dealer" She was not motivated to return phone calls or follow through on anything she said.
The dealer maintained that he could not do anything until the Dispute Resolution Specialist sent the paperwork to the "Reaquired Vehicle Office", she in turn said that the dealer was responsible for this. I went back and forth and back and forth for more than 30 days.
Throughout the entire vibration, transmission, rear axle replacement, dampner kit, new tire and driveshaft replacement fiasco I have tried to maintain my composure. It finally came to a point that I was threating legal action and even recontacted a lemon law attorney about the refusal of the dealer and Ford to complete these transactions.
I received notice that I had won my case the first week of October. I have been driving the new F-250 for about a month and am still trying to get the dealer and Ford to send through the last paperwork on the new truck(substitution of collateral and the cash back from the differance in the price of the 2 vehicles)
I chose a replacement vehicle as I was probably going to get another Ford anyways and thought that would be easier-WRONG! I am happy with the new truck but this entire process has been like pulling teeth very slowly with rusty tools.
The Dispute Resolution Specialist currently has a voice mail saying her office will be closed until 3 January. My attorney told me in November that the Reaquired Vehicle Office was backed up past 60 days. (Take that for what it is worth)
You may have better luck since you are taking a refund rather than a replacement. I don't mean to tell you that your experience will be the same as mine, I was definately dealing with the slow boat to China crowd. Same as the mechanical process you have already been through-keep pushing and pushing until it gets done.
On the brighter side of things you will like the 250. After driving this one for a while I'm not looking back.
Congratulations on your success with the DSB, most of the hard stuff is now over. I know what it felt like to see the envelope in the mailbox, rip it open and read it right in the driveway that the months of service visits, TSBs, and vibration issues were almost done. That Ford Engineers and others that told you it was "a truck and its gonna vibrate" were not right and all those payments you made on a lemon were coming back to you.
Good luck to all the citizens of Vibration Nation-keep up the good fight.
I can only tell you what happened to me:
I accepted the decision imediately and had a replacement lined up and ready to transfer. I did the legwork to the dealer that had the truck I wanted and moved it forward to the point were they told me that all the original dealer had to do was call them up and get it.
I was contacted by the "Dispute Resolution Specialist" and found her to be less helpful than the Customer Care Hotline folks if that tells you anything. She imediately told me the dealer would handle everything. Her favorite line was "that's not my job" and "Ford leaves that to the local dealer" She was not motivated to return phone calls or follow through on anything she said.
The dealer maintained that he could not do anything until the Dispute Resolution Specialist sent the paperwork to the "Reaquired Vehicle Office", she in turn said that the dealer was responsible for this. I went back and forth and back and forth for more than 30 days.
Throughout the entire vibration, transmission, rear axle replacement, dampner kit, new tire and driveshaft replacement fiasco I have tried to maintain my composure. It finally came to a point that I was threating legal action and even recontacted a lemon law attorney about the refusal of the dealer and Ford to complete these transactions.
I received notice that I had won my case the first week of October. I have been driving the new F-250 for about a month and am still trying to get the dealer and Ford to send through the last paperwork on the new truck(substitution of collateral and the cash back from the differance in the price of the 2 vehicles)
I chose a replacement vehicle as I was probably going to get another Ford anyways and thought that would be easier-WRONG! I am happy with the new truck but this entire process has been like pulling teeth very slowly with rusty tools.
The Dispute Resolution Specialist currently has a voice mail saying her office will be closed until 3 January. My attorney told me in November that the Reaquired Vehicle Office was backed up past 60 days. (Take that for what it is worth)
You may have better luck since you are taking a refund rather than a replacement. I don't mean to tell you that your experience will be the same as mine, I was definately dealing with the slow boat to China crowd. Same as the mechanical process you have already been through-keep pushing and pushing until it gets done.
On the brighter side of things you will like the 250. After driving this one for a while I'm not looking back.
Congratulations on your success with the DSB, most of the hard stuff is now over. I know what it felt like to see the envelope in the mailbox, rip it open and read it right in the driveway that the months of service visits, TSBs, and vibration issues were almost done. That Ford Engineers and others that told you it was "a truck and its gonna vibrate" were not right and all those payments you made on a lemon were coming back to you.
Good luck to all the citizens of Vibration Nation-keep up the good fight.
My God!!!!! I won with the DSB as well and this is exactly what is currently happening to me! One exception.....I'm getting the refund as I owe very little on my truck and it makes more sense to get the refund and then buy the new 05 F250 at wholesale rates with my large down.
The specialist who is supposed to help with this process is less than helpful and complains of being over loaded. Next week will be 30 days from the time I sent my acceptance form of the award. It's encouraging to hear you like your F250 as I'm hoping I can put this nighmare behind me as well. I've never had such problems in my life with a new truck.
Bottom line....I won, the new truck I'm seeking is parked and waiting for me at the dealership, and I'm still driving "old shakey" till the paperwork is done. Guess if they want me to keep racking up the miles on my F150, no problem.
Besides, I'd just get my new F250 all dirty with the sand on the roads right now!
#17
02-01-2005, 06:37 PM
New ring and pinion solved my vibration...
Thanks for all your good advice. I took your advice and documented everything but they replaced my ring and pinion last friday and the vibration is gone. They had road force balanced the tires, no luck, replaced a cab mount and tranny mount, no luck and finally tried the ring and pinion. They had the truck for a little over 2 weeks (My reverse was messed up too... long delay before it would pop in to reverse. This was a scored seal on a pump in the tranny.) But I have it back and I'm loving it again. Thanks again for all your help!
Originally Posted by toypuller
Noolacam,
While I had other issues the vibration was the primary one. The DSB letter I got was specific that the vibration issue was a primary reason for the buy back.
The scope of the DSB's authority is:
1) Any condition that affects the value of the vehicle. (vibration does)
2) The noted condition must be covered by the manufacurers warranty. (vibration is)
3) The same condition must still be unresolved after the required number of repair attempts.
There is alot of good info here and other places- do your homework.
Remember- document, document, document and document.
Learn the differances between what "Lemon Law" and DSB will do for you. There are signifigant advantages and disadvantages with each.
Good luck, I hope you get it resolved before you need help!
While I had other issues the vibration was the primary one. The DSB letter I got was specific that the vibration issue was a primary reason for the buy back.
The scope of the DSB's authority is:
1) Any condition that affects the value of the vehicle. (vibration does)
2) The noted condition must be covered by the manufacurers warranty. (vibration is)
3) The same condition must still be unresolved after the required number of repair attempts.
There is alot of good info here and other places- do your homework.
Remember- document, document, document and document.
Learn the differances between what "Lemon Law" and DSB will do for you. There are signifigant advantages and disadvantages with each.
Good luck, I hope you get it resolved before you need help!
#18
02-02-2005, 05:58 AM
Noolacam,
No sweat, glad I could help. I'm happy you got yours fixed. It seems like more and more people are having luck actually getting the problem solved.
I have to admit that even if they were able to fix mine in the end I would not have wanted it anymore.
14 Tires, ended up with Michelin Pilot LTXs on an "off-road" truck-yea, right.
3 driveshafts
2 rear axles with the 2nd one bad when I turned the truck in.
New throttle body assembly
Dampner kit
Pcm reprogram x 3
Clutch packs x 2
16 visits to the shop by the time the truck had 12,000 miles on it.
Oh, yea! And the Ford Engineer said "could not duplicate any abnormal condition or concern"
I have had Ford vehicles my entire life and during this process we had 3 in the driveway. It is aggrevating to be treated like that by Ford and the dealer.
It's over now and I'm not that bitter as I ended up with a nice 05 250 that has behaved well so far. The service dept at the dealer has treated me very well throughout this entire situation and I wouldn't hesitate to send someone to them.
My wife is not so forgiving, It's time to replace her Grand Marquis and she won't even look at a Ford, Mercury or Lincon.
Good luck to everyone that has the vibe.
No sweat, glad I could help. I'm happy you got yours fixed. It seems like more and more people are having luck actually getting the problem solved.
I have to admit that even if they were able to fix mine in the end I would not have wanted it anymore.
14 Tires, ended up with Michelin Pilot LTXs on an "off-road" truck-yea, right.
3 driveshafts
2 rear axles with the 2nd one bad when I turned the truck in.
New throttle body assembly
Dampner kit
Pcm reprogram x 3
Clutch packs x 2
16 visits to the shop by the time the truck had 12,000 miles on it.
Oh, yea! And the Ford Engineer said "could not duplicate any abnormal condition or concern"
I have had Ford vehicles my entire life and during this process we had 3 in the driveway. It is aggrevating to be treated like that by Ford and the dealer.
It's over now and I'm not that bitter as I ended up with a nice 05 250 that has behaved well so far. The service dept at the dealer has treated me very well throughout this entire situation and I wouldn't hesitate to send someone to them.
My wife is not so forgiving, It's time to replace her Grand Marquis and she won't even look at a Ford, Mercury or Lincon.
Good luck to everyone that has the vibe.
#19
02-02-2005, 09:31 AM
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Louisiana
Posts: 89
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
#20
02-02-2005, 11:52 AM
Junior User
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Cumming,GA
Posts: 52
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
what to do?
hey guys/gals i have the same problems all of u are having. i have had one of the rims replaced... the front steering rack replaced... the whole rear axle replaced... the driveshaft replaced and it has been aligned and balanced a handful of times. i have the dsb paperwork at home and i am a little reluctant to send it in because i put a leveling kit on my truck and tinted the windows and put ventshades on it. it is an 04 scab4x4. would i get my money back for the windows and ventshades? i assume that i would have to take out the leveling kit if i sent in my paperwork to the dsb so that it could be replaced or money refunded. anyone have any ideas or suggestions as to what i should do?
#21
02-02-2005, 02:17 PM
db3812,
Part of a DSB forced buy back or an MSRP to MSRP swap includes all permently mounted, attatched or painted add-ons. If you get a buy back or exchange those things are included. The DSB panel never asked for specifics about what add-ons I had, it was just included in the form letter I received.
If you meet the criteria for the DSB-Send it in. The worst thing that can happen is they say no and you are no worse off than what you are now. Remember, you are not the first to add something to a truck. Mine included a drop-in bed liner, ventshades, running boards and the cross over truck box. (The box was a special circumstance).
For all the hassle the dealer included a spray-in liner and a sliding rear window on the new one. It came with steps already mounted.
Part of a DSB forced buy back or an MSRP to MSRP swap includes all permently mounted, attatched or painted add-ons. If you get a buy back or exchange those things are included. The DSB panel never asked for specifics about what add-ons I had, it was just included in the form letter I received.
If you meet the criteria for the DSB-Send it in. The worst thing that can happen is they say no and you are no worse off than what you are now. Remember, you are not the first to add something to a truck. Mine included a drop-in bed liner, ventshades, running boards and the cross over truck box. (The box was a special circumstance).
For all the hassle the dealer included a spray-in liner and a sliding rear window on the new one. It came with steps already mounted.
#23
02-02-2005, 02:43 PM
Junior User
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Cumming,GA
Posts: 52
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
don't know what to do...
thanks for the info... i am just having a hrd time deciding what to do. i really don't want to have to go thru the trouble with the dsb and ford and how long it will take to get this all accomplished. i don't want to put up with the truck shaking and vibrating for the next 6 years that i pay it off... it only has 8300 miles on it and ifi have had this many problems with it this early how many will i have in the future? The only reason i am hesitant to go thru with it is because i don't want to have to wait 2-3 months to get my truck swapped out or get my money back...to aggravating u know. i do know that i don't want to "deal with it" because i have never had a new or used vehicle drive this bad. i am skeptical to go back to a ford product but i grew up on a farm and the only truck that was worth a damn was a ford. I am disappointed in ford because of what i have been thruand very scared to go back to them. IF i do get my money back i know that i would not go back to an f150.... i would probably get an f250 if i could afford it. i do have faith in ford but i do NOT have faith in this new f150. Does anyone have any suggestions or advice?
#24
02-02-2005, 02:58 PM
I am in the same situation. I am thinking about going to a different dealer and trading or maybe even a different brand. I do not feel like going through a 2-4 month process of service visits and arguing with dealerships and Ford. If they dont fix it soon, I am going to either sell it, trade it for an F250 or get a different brand. My opinion that there is a design problem with certain models of this truck which is causing problems.
#25
02-02-2005, 04:58 PM
db3812 and rcm800,
It is a painful process, however, if you have the correct paperwork and truly have had no resulotion to your issues, the DSB is a fair process. Long, painful, but fair. I won and opted for the refund instead of the replacement. Of course the refund took longer. I too was jaded and honestly looked at changing to a different manufacturer after owning 6 different Fords. I have to say, hands down, the Super Duty is the only way to go and beats the competition. I decided to take my refund and get an F250 Lariat with a 6.0L diesel and love it! I'm once again excited about owning a new truck. I've never wanted to get rid of a truck so badly as the F150. I've owned several and wish I would have kept my 02 F150 SuperCrew...great truck. I'm sure there are others who are not having problems with theirs, but I didn't want to take a chance. I think the F250 rides better, gets better mileage, tows more, etc. Heard there were some issues with the earlier 03 Super Duty and some 04 Super Duties, but not many issues so far with the 05. The new coil spring front end rides better and turns sharper. You can check out my pics. Once again, I think Ford got it right and didn't make too many changes on a good thing. The Super Duty is the truck for me!
It is a painful process, however, if you have the correct paperwork and truly have had no resulotion to your issues, the DSB is a fair process. Long, painful, but fair. I won and opted for the refund instead of the replacement. Of course the refund took longer. I too was jaded and honestly looked at changing to a different manufacturer after owning 6 different Fords. I have to say, hands down, the Super Duty is the only way to go and beats the competition. I decided to take my refund and get an F250 Lariat with a 6.0L diesel and love it! I'm once again excited about owning a new truck. I've never wanted to get rid of a truck so badly as the F150. I've owned several and wish I would have kept my 02 F150 SuperCrew...great truck. I'm sure there are others who are not having problems with theirs, but I didn't want to take a chance. I think the F250 rides better, gets better mileage, tows more, etc. Heard there were some issues with the earlier 03 Super Duty and some 04 Super Duties, but not many issues so far with the 05. The new coil spring front end rides better and turns sharper. You can check out my pics. Once again, I think Ford got it right and didn't make too many changes on a good thing. The Super Duty is the truck for me!
#26
02-02-2005, 06:01 PM
Hoping Someone Can Help Answer My Question, I To Have The Vibration Problem On My 04 Scab Fx4 And I Have About 15000 Miles On It Know And I Been Round And Round And Was Finally Told By A Ford Rep, That There Is Nothing They Can Do And That It Is Within Tolerance. I Am Thinking About Doing The Dsb But What I Am Afraid Of Is On A Refund Situation The Money I Rolled Over Into The New Truck From My Old One I Would Have To Come Up With, Is This Correct.
#27
02-03-2005, 07:58 AM
Vibration "Within" Tolerance.
Like JRFx4, I would be interested if anyone had to battle a Ford rep stating that the vibration is within tolerance. Taking my new style 04 Screw Lariat back in for the third time for test driving after two unsuccessful rounds of fixes (Dampner Kit, New Body and Transmission Mounts, and New Drive Shaft). They are using some sort of electronic vibration testing device that plugs into a connection under the steering wheel and has a sensor that you hold to the steering wheel or some other part of the interior cab. Based on the TSB anything over .4 Gz (I think this is correct way to state it, but I do not have access to the TSB this morning) is something that is deemed excessive and anything below is deemed acceptable by Ford. Anyone have experience dealing with this side of the vibration problem when the Ford dealer or rep says it is below .4 and "acceptable"? I take mine back in on 2/14 for a final test drive with the regional Ford Engineer/Company Rep.
Thanks.
Thanks.
#28
02-03-2005, 09:16 AM
comes and goes
part of the other problem I have is that the shimmy in the steering wheel will come and go. I can be driving @ highway speeds and the wheel will shimmy and then stop and then may start again, completely random. Makes it very tough to fight w/ ford when it is not constant. anyone else seem to have it come and go?
#29
02-03-2005, 09:18 AM
Bieszczat,
I don't know how many people had to go up against the exact specifications you are talking about. I do know that almost every person that has posted about their vibration and Ford engineer experience was told that the problem was "within tolerance" or "could not be duplicated. Keep in mind that it is difficult for the dealer,engineer or Ford to replace multiple parts, perform multiple repairs and get paid for multiple warranty claims and then say that the problem is "within tolerance"
It seems as though the engineer is a professional "NO" man.
I kinda look at it like this: say 100 trucks have a problem.
Some people think it's normal truck behavior -10 trucks
Some people just don't care -10 trucks
Some people just trade it or sell it outright -10 trucks
The service dept. tells you it's normal -10 trucks
Some people get tired of multiple service visits -10 trucks
Ford Engineer says it is within tolerance -10 trucks
Some people don't know about DSB or Lemon Law -10 trucks
Some people think DSB or Lemon law is too much of a hassle -10 trucks
Some trucks get modified by owners and warranty hassle follows -5 truck
Some trucks get destroyed in accidents proir to a solution -5 trucks
# of trucks left from the original 100 = 10. My experience was that the whole process is in part designed to wear you down and seek an alternate solution. Do not give up, it is you that decides what is within tolerance not their vibration analizer.
Jrfx4,
I don't understand your question, if you can explain a little more I'll try to answer.
Any equity you have in your truck will be refunded to you as part of a DSB buyback. This includes taxes, tags, title, add-ons, down payments, and monthly payments. If awarded a buy back you should not have to come up with anything out of pocket.
There is an exception: If you are awarded a buy back, but are charged a milage/useage charge and that charge is more than the equity you have in the truck it could cost you. You would have to decide wether or not to accept the award based on your own personal situation. This seems to be a rare exception rather than the rule.
From what I have seen it is either no mileage charge or the amount of accrued milage prior to the 1st complaint about the condition you are going to the DSB about.
If I didn't answer your question-sorry, If you can reword it I'll try again. The older I get the more simple things need to be.
I don't know how many people had to go up against the exact specifications you are talking about. I do know that almost every person that has posted about their vibration and Ford engineer experience was told that the problem was "within tolerance" or "could not be duplicated. Keep in mind that it is difficult for the dealer,engineer or Ford to replace multiple parts, perform multiple repairs and get paid for multiple warranty claims and then say that the problem is "within tolerance"
It seems as though the engineer is a professional "NO" man.
I kinda look at it like this: say 100 trucks have a problem.
Some people think it's normal truck behavior -10 trucks
Some people just don't care -10 trucks
Some people just trade it or sell it outright -10 trucks
The service dept. tells you it's normal -10 trucks
Some people get tired of multiple service visits -10 trucks
Ford Engineer says it is within tolerance -10 trucks
Some people don't know about DSB or Lemon Law -10 trucks
Some people think DSB or Lemon law is too much of a hassle -10 trucks
Some trucks get modified by owners and warranty hassle follows -5 truck
Some trucks get destroyed in accidents proir to a solution -5 trucks
# of trucks left from the original 100 = 10. My experience was that the whole process is in part designed to wear you down and seek an alternate solution. Do not give up, it is you that decides what is within tolerance not their vibration analizer.
Jrfx4,
I don't understand your question, if you can explain a little more I'll try to answer.
Any equity you have in your truck will be refunded to you as part of a DSB buyback. This includes taxes, tags, title, add-ons, down payments, and monthly payments. If awarded a buy back you should not have to come up with anything out of pocket.
There is an exception: If you are awarded a buy back, but are charged a milage/useage charge and that charge is more than the equity you have in the truck it could cost you. You would have to decide wether or not to accept the award based on your own personal situation. This seems to be a rare exception rather than the rule.
From what I have seen it is either no mileage charge or the amount of accrued milage prior to the 1st complaint about the condition you are going to the DSB about.
If I didn't answer your question-sorry, If you can reword it I'll try again. The older I get the more simple things need to be.
#30
02-03-2005, 10:05 AM
Toypuller,
Thanks For Your Help,
The Shimmy In My Steering Wheel Will Start When I Reach About 70 And Then Sometimes The Steering Wheel Will Stop Shaking And Be Smooth, And Then Sometimes It Will Start Shaking Again. The Dealer Has Roadforced Many Times, Matched Tires To Wheels And Wheels To Hubs Per All The Bulletins, No Change Noticed. I Will Say This, It Does Not Shake Near As Bad Now As It Did When I First Got The Truck. I Asked About The Dampner And I Was Told They Can Not Install It On My Truck B/c Of My Towing Package.
Thanks For Your Help,
The Shimmy In My Steering Wheel Will Start When I Reach About 70 And Then Sometimes The Steering Wheel Will Stop Shaking And Be Smooth, And Then Sometimes It Will Start Shaking Again. The Dealer Has Roadforced Many Times, Matched Tires To Wheels And Wheels To Hubs Per All The Bulletins, No Change Noticed. I Will Say This, It Does Not Shake Near As Bad Now As It Did When I First Got The Truck. I Asked About The Dampner And I Was Told They Can Not Install It On My Truck B/c Of My Towing Package.