I tried this on the towing forum, and got no response, so I'll give it a try over here. I have a '99 F250, w/ V10 and 4.30 rear gears, 58k miles. I'm towing a 30' fifth wheel, and my GCVW is 16,300 (weighed on a CAT scale), so I'm safely below max.

After a long climb on a hot day, I got onto a final 12% grade up to a campground in Ruidoso NM, and my tranny overheated and pushed fluid out the front seal (maybe a quart?). I went to the Ford dealership in Ruidoso, and got the "never, ever, Ever, EVER tow in Overdrive" speech. I had been out of OD for the last 50 miles, and was in 2nd when the tranny dumped, but OK. Dealer also said that there was no way to tell if the seal would re-seal or not, or if the tranny was damged, so just drive it and see. I got back to Texas alright (600 miles, downhill!), but tranny always seemed to smell "hot". Couldn't say if it was the smell of the previously dumped fluid, and couldn't really tell if it was continuing to leak.

Questions:

I am still under a Ford Extended Service Plan (till 75k), so what can I expect from my local dealer; or, what should I "demand"? I don't want to wait until my next mountain tow (could be months) to figure out if it will happen again, or have it shell out after the warranty expires.

I have read of a TSB to add a radiator with a water/oil cooler to supplement the air/oil (only) cooler on the 1999. Does anyone have the specifc info on this TSB so that I can discuss with my dealer? Is it a good idea?

I will be adding a transmission temp gauge ASAP. Any other thoughts?

Thanks,

Mark McC

 

Mark

Search my name fredvon4 here and check out tow vs od or 4r100 threads.

In a nut shell, some of the 99 V10 4r100 combinations had an inferior radiator and trans cooler design. Fords fix in late 2000 was to retro fit the new design (external oil coolers) to the older trucks. There is a TSB but I don't know the number or date.

I will assume that at least you had the schorched Mercon fluid replaced (preferably by a competent mechanic who knows how to do a "total flush") if not get it done NOW!

The tow vs OD subject is full of opinions, but here is my take. The V10 and 4r100 are mated through a Lock up type Torque converter. The nature of torque converters (TC) is to generate rotational torque by forcing Mercon fluid to push against vanes of the input half. When both halves are close to the same rotational speed the COMPUTER locks the TC so there is no fluid slipage or heat generated. I tow heavy and only use OD untill the computer starts the lock unlock dance, then I turn off OD and even may manually down shift to 2nd. the V10 likes 3800-4400RPM and will do it all day long!

When you tow a load in OD the computer will LOCK and UNLOCK the TC frequently and may or may NOT shift into a lower gear. The TC unlocked under a heavy uphill load will super heat the mercon fluid very fast to over 230F where it breaks down, oxidises, and stops being a lubricant and starts letting other trany components heat up, expand, and causes bad things to happen to MANY of the internals.

If your trans puked a quart, the fluid is schorched and must be changed. I suspect the 4r100 will have internal damage that will ultimatly need rebuilding. If needed, pay a GOOD trany shop to test the 4R100 and use the radiator TSB and other evidence to get a good Ford dealer to put in the upgraded radiator and a rebuilt trans. Do not expect a NEW 4R100 as they always put in a rebuild.

 

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Fredvon4

Quote:

Originally posted by Fredvon4
Mark


In a nut shell, some of the 99 V10 4r100 combinations had an inferior radiator and trans cooler design. Fords fix in late 2000 was to retro fit the new design (external oil coolers) to the older trucks.

Hey Fredvon4, thanks for the info, this is why I like this site, lots of good info. I have a 2002 F-350 Dually, V-10. Auto and 4.30 LS. I am going to be towing a 27' TT that wieghs abot 8000lbs. wet. I'll be going to Seqouia Nat' Forest from So. Cal. So there will be alot of mountain driving. My truck is bone stock, do you think I'll have any problems ? Any mods that I should do before my trip ? Thanks a bunch.

 

Best insurance is to get a mid priced aux trans cooler Check out Summit, Jegs, or JC Whitney, even some auto zones have a good selection. Key is also a GOOD trans temp gage. If you have a factory gage and do not want an after market one I would do a crude calibration...

Borrow or buy a decent gun style IR temp probe/gage (Radio shack and other have good low cost ones). Run the engine on the road to full operating temp and stop shoot the temp on the trans pan, note the real temp and correlate to what the factory gage says. Tow a load up to operating temp then deliberatly climb a local hill that forces a down shift. Stop and shoot the trans again and compare the higher temp to the factory guage.

You are trying to see what the reality is between the real temp and the Factory guage. Once you see what the ratio to reality is then you will / should be able to know where 220F warning and 230F Danger are on the gage.

Never ever run 4R100 with scorched Mercon, it is no longer a lubricant. Not a linier relationship because of the effects of time but Between 220 and 230F the fluid is toast. Immediate change will fix and the only damage from scorched fluid come from continued driving.

The aux cooler w/fan, a good gauge, and knowledge to either down shift, or worst case slow down, will save the trans and I know many, many, many RVers who get well over 130,000 mile service out of the Super Duty ford Towing machine!

 

Mark,

I just returned from Sequoia in our 34' Bounder MH. Made it up with no problem at all. We tow a 4600# Jeep TJ and the GCW is 23,400#. I just keep it locked into 2nd and let it rev. I have never boiled Mercon out or even smelled an overheated trans.

I do have the Banks Power Pack.

Make sure you go in on Hwy. 180, not thru 3 Rivers.

Have a good time.

Rick

 

Thanks for the replies. FredVon4, I'm starting through your various posts. You sure have a bunch!

I've found while talking to a couple of different Ford Dealer Service Departments that they do not seem to be aware of the TSB regarding transmission overheating in the 1999 Superduty. I'll keep trying to get some info on the TSB, as I have an appointment with my local Ford dealer on Thursday to get the transmission evaluated.

 

I have located the TSB 00-24-4 for the 1999-2000 Superduty with the 6.8L of 7.3L engines. The title is "TRANSMISSION-4R100-FLUID OVERHEATS DURING SEVERD DUTY-AVAILABILITY OF UPDATED FLUID COOLER/FILTER KIT-VEHICLES PRODUCED BEFORE 2/6/2000" The TSB goes on to describe replacement of radiator, cooler lines, and hoses, and notes that the new radiator has an internal transmission fluid cooler.

We'll see what my dealer has to say!

 

I have a 2000 V 10 and I had my dealer do TSB 00-24-4 on my truck. This TSB removes the aux trans cooler (mounted in front of the radiator) and installs a new radiator with the trans cooler lines going into the new radiator. It also installs an in-line filter.
After looking at the installation I modified it by re-installing the aux trans cooler previously removed by the dealer. Now the hot trans fluid goes into the radiator (installed by TSB 00-24-4) comes out of the radiator and into the aux cooler, out of the aux cooler thru the added in-line filter and back to the trans.
This is a great set up. If you have your dealer install TSB 00-24-4 have him leave the aux cooler in place and hook it up as I have described.
A cool tranny is a happy tranny!!

 

DirtBiker!

Excellent suggestion, I intend to use this suggestion in future posts, no royalties will be forwarded

 

OK it's a silly question but, which vehicles does a TSB actually apply to ? Is it only under warranty vehicles ? Or as I've been lead to understand, it can be, at times, more like a recall to rigs that have gone out of warranty. Thanks.

 

I had this done to my truck when it had 39,000 miles on it. Warranty was out at 36,000. Ford agreed to give me some consideration since it was out of warranty. This would cost you about $800.00 to do the TSB 00-24-4. Ford split the cost with me.

 

Did you need it for one reason or another ? Or just hear about it and think it would be a positive edition ? I can't seem to get my V-10 warm when the trailer is behind it, even up and down the mountains here in Washington State. I don't have a tranny temp gauge but I know the trans fluid runs through the radiator so it seems as it the trans got hot, so would the water temp. And it never even goes above the 1/3 above cool mark. With 10-14 people in it, both a/c's blowing hard, the trailer on and all our gear on board. I was considering an aftermarket trans cooler, they're what, $60 or $70 ? And an afternoon with some hose and hose clamps. Would you suggest the factory fix over the aftermarket cooler ?

 

I do a lot of towing in the deserts here in Southern California. I had the TSB done because I know that heat is a trannys worst enemy. Putting the stock aux cooler back on in series with the radiator is just extra insurance for me. I installed a trans temp gauge and even when the trans temp was up at 220 degrees the coolant temp in the radiator never changed (this was prior to adding the aux cooler back on). I my opinion you should install a gauge to monitor trans temp. I bought a Banks Trans Gauge and it was about $50.00. Best thing I have done for the longevity of the truck. Once you can monitor what temps your trans is seeing you can make the call on an aux cooler.

 

Did I miss something? I had a 2000 SD V-10, it had the trans lines in the Rad, then a Large cooler between the Rad and Condenser(sp.), back to trans. My 2003 is the same way.

 

I was told by my dealer that the TSB was incorporated on the 2001 models. I was surprized when , after the TSB was installed, that they removed the aux cooler. It sounds like you are set.