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2007+ Expedition & Navigator 2007, 2008, 2009 and 2010 Ford Expedition and Lincoln Navigator

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Old 03-15-2013, 09:42 AM
bdorin bdorin is offline
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Engine tick to blown motor?

My 2008 Ford Expedition developed a tick in the engine. I had the oil changed and that didn't fix the issue so I called my Ford dealership and setup an appointment to have it diagnosed. My truck was running fine but just thought I should have it checked out. I drove the truck in there and dropped it off.

Two days later, they called to say that my Cam Phasers were bad and needed to be replaced and if they were going to replace them I should also do the timing chain. My truck has 162,000 miles on it. The price they quoted me was $3,045. I decided I'd take the truck for a second opinion and felt the $3,045 was high. I called the dealership and told them I was just coming to pick up the vehicle and I'd pay the $99 dianosis charge. They said they needed to "put it back together" and I could get it the next day.

When I picked the truck up, they brought it around and my husband and I got in. The truck would not accelerate and the engine light was on. Pressing the gas pedal to the floor the truck would only go 2 mph. Remember, I drove it in there and the performance was fine and no engine light was on. My husband turned the truck off and restarted it and we could accelerate. Meanwhile, I'm back in the service department getting my Team Leader and explaining to him my truck was not running. We went outside and he saw my husband driving it so he said it would be fine.

We left the dealership and got about 800 yards away when there was this awful noise in the engine like something was flying around and the truck shut down. We had to push it off the road. We called the dealership back and they sent a mechanic out to help us get it started. His computer, a little gadget he plugged in under my steering wheel, indicated that the accelerator was stuck. He got the truck started again and heard the new noise and said we should not drive it. Our son came and picked us up and they towed my truck back to the dealership. The next day they called us to say that the truck broke a rocker arm and dropped a piston. I asked the service manager "how can that happen?" My truck was running fine and it hadn't been driven really while in their care! He said that it was probably because I hadn't taken care of my vehicle in changing the oil and I explained that I had just done it a week ago and the time before that the dealership did it, and I change it every time the message comes up that it's time. Then he said, "Well maybe it didn't have enough oil." So I asked him if it had an oil leak??? He didn't respond...just told me that my air filter was really dirty and that was what caused my engine to blow!! Well, I know better than that. I had the truck towed from their lot and it's sitting at my office waiting for a car hauler to take it to my dad in Ohio. He's a very good mechanic and will look at it for me.

My reason for posting all of this is he's asked me to gather as much information from folks on this forum that will help him look at all options and what others have done to fix the numerous issues posted here about cam phasers, tensioners seals, and the oil pressure issues these motors have.

Thanking you in advance for your help!
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Old 03-15-2013, 11:30 AM
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Do you know if they removed the valve covers? These engines are bad for the roller rocker failing. The bearing for the roller fails so the roller can't turn anymore causing a ticking noise and eventual cam lobe failure. Maybe that is what your ticking noise was. Cam phasers don't really make a tick, they make more of a knock plus they were updated in 2006 so your engine has the latest parts. Its possible the rocker got pushed off the valve from a seized roller and when that happens, the valve stem gets bent so it hangs open then the piston hits it. There is no warning other than the ticking noise.
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Old 03-15-2013, 12:28 PM
bdorin bdorin is offline
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I don't know if they removed the valve covers. The documentation I got does not explain anything that they did to the truck; only what my initial complaint was and that I declined the service. I will see if I can get more detailed records from the dealership.

The ticking noise started off and on in early February, then went away and subsequently came back. My oil pressure and temp gauges were all good and normal during this time. Then we noticed the ticking/knocking got louder. My husband checked the oil and it was a quart low, which had never ever happend with this truck. He got a quart and put it in then took it straight to have the oil changed. Again, we were driving it fine and drove it into the dealership. We dropped the truck off on March 1 and picked it up on March 5th and that's when the engine blew. So from February 1 to March 1 we drove it with the ticking noise.

I hope this helps.
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Old 03-15-2013, 01:24 PM
pgonza2723 pgonza2723 is offline
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I'm not one to push using the law to get things taken care of but to me based on what you said and the timing of events the dealership is at fault. If they took it apart then chances are they weren't careful with putting things back together. They for sure didn't do any diligent troubleshooting considering they released the truck to you with the check engine light on in limp home mode. A stuck accelerator doesn't cause the damage that is being implied so there was something else wrong with the truck from when they released it to you in which lead to the engine failure. Just something isn't adding up at all and if you have someone else dive into it to fix it you might lose any leverage you might have to get them to fix it. Again I hate the sue this and that thing, but I've known 4.6 & 5.4L's to run tens of thousands of miles with the "tick" and no failures.
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Old 03-15-2013, 01:31 PM
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could have been a lose spark plug too
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Old 03-15-2013, 01:43 PM
bdorin bdorin is offline
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Well, let me ask you all this...they diagnosed bad cam phasers. Would a bad cam phaser(s) blow my engine eventually? That's one thing on this forum I've not been able to figure out. I've seen plenty of posts that they go bad and some fixed them and some I'm not sure if they did get them fixed or keep driving with the tick.

If bad cam phasers are not detrimental to my engine, then I'm guessing they either did something to my truck while it was there putting it back togther...but what? OR they just misdiagnosed the ticking noise?
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Old 03-15-2013, 01:49 PM
jdm5630 jdm5630 is offline
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My07 expy has had a fast paced tick when I first start it.in the mornings but I've always been told it was normal. What is this tick supposed to sound like?
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Old 03-15-2013, 05:09 PM
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They prob. slapped all the things back together which caused the failure.
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Old 03-15-2013, 08:00 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jdm5630 View Post
My07 expy has had a fast paced tick when I first start it.in the mornings but I've always been told it was normal. What is this tick supposed to sound like?
I had the same tick till it warmed up. Turned out to be a cracked manifold luckily replaced under ext warranty. Could just be a manifold gasket also.
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Old 03-15-2013, 09:14 PM
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My wife and I bought an 08 EB back in July with 58,000 miles. While looking it over, I noticed a little more wear and tear than I expected, but the price was very good. I lifted the hood and noticed the motor was absolutely spotless. Not the typical dealership silicone treatment, but the valve covers looked brand new and the engine block was shiny black. I inquired about it and the salesman left to ask the service manager. Upon his return, he told me I was lucky as it had a brand new Ford motor. Evidently the original owner brought it in under warranty due to engine noise and it was diagnosed to be sludged up. He ended up trading it in for a new one and the dealership replaced the motor. We have had great luck out of it since then. That said, I run Mobil 1 in it and keep an eye on the oil level (doesn't use any). As far as the cam phasers go, I do not believe they can cause catastrophic engine failure on their own. Sounds to me like the dealership threw it back together and it either jumped time or it was out of time. I personally think they are liable for at least some of the repair. My buddy has an 05 F150 and the cam phasers have ticked for 70,000 miles (now has almost 150K on it). Runs and drives fine. Just a little noisy. Good luck on this.
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Old 03-16-2013, 09:07 AM
bdorin bdorin is offline
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Thanks, everyone! So the consensus is that the dealership should either replace my motor or at least help with the cost of the repairs. How do I go about making that happen? What's my best line of defense? Currently, I have the truck scheduled to be picked up Tuesday/Wednesday of next week and hauled from Virginia to Ohio where my dad lives (he's a mechanic I trust ) to have it repaired. I'm just not sure how to go about this and what steps I should take.

Thanks for your advice!
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Old 03-16-2013, 09:59 AM
bdorin bdorin is offline
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I just got off the phone with Ford. I logged a complaint against the dealership. I have a case number. Unfortunately, my dealership is privately owned so Ford cannot make them do anything about my truck but the complaint will affect their incentives, bonuses, etc. and be a black mark against them with Ford. I just have to wait and see if the dealership calls me and wants to help...
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Old 03-16-2013, 11:01 AM
jdm5630 jdm5630 is offline
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My expy just ran out of extended warranty last year. Maybe it would be a good investment to get it again. What company do you guys recommend?
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Old 03-16-2013, 11:29 AM
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go to the dealership on a saturday and make noise. They want to sell cars and you making noise about them blowing up your car while in for service does wonders. Do not let them push you into a out of the way place. Be the squeaky wheel. And let FORD know that to you, they are ford, not an independant company.
Worked for me when they blew a transmission in my truck while they had it.
The also should have given you a written estimate of the repair required. Even if you did not have the repair completed. Sounds like a bad place to do business with.
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Old 03-16-2013, 07:49 PM
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Blackestate, that's a really good idea LOL. If the dealership doesn't call me in the next couple of business days, I will definitely do it!
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Old 03-16-2013, 07:49 PM
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