F1 Rear end width...to axle...to housing?
 

I have a 51 F1 which I have installed TCI's parabolic leaf spring kit and now I am looking for a rear end....might go junkyard crawling for an 8.8 or order up a new 9" from who knows yet but after some searching here i'm still puzzled as to the optimal width AND if that measurements is from outside axle flange to outside axle flange or outside housing flange?
I've picked up from searches here the 95 and up Explorer 8.8 or 57-72 9" thing but what width I need is still a mystery, admittedly rear end talk is a bit foreign to me as I don't pay much attention till it breaks and off to the Ring and Pinion shop it goes.

Thanks in advance for any infohttps://cimg2.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.for...817291dabf.jpg
https://cimg6.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.for...5984e6aff.jpeg
https://cimg4.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.for...7b120bb34.jpeg

There is an article on here (somewhat corrupted, lots of strange symbols) with all the info needed: https://www.ford-trucks.com/articles...rential-swaps/

I bought my 9 inch custom housing and 31 spline axles from this guy: John?s Industries - Ford 9 inch Rear Ends Housing Axles Caspian, M

Housing width was 61 inches axle flange to axle flange. The width from housing flange to housing flange will depend on whose brake package you choose and the required brake offset needed for that particular kit. I installed this Wilwood kit: Wilwood High Performance Disc Brakes - Rear Brake Kit Product Number: 140-12209-D
So my housing flange to housing flange width was 56 inches.

There is a lot of info needed and choices to be make if you go with a custom 9 inch housing I did not have the housing supplier install the spring pads as I wanted that done by the shop I used to install some other work on my housing. That way the housing was straightened once after all the welding was done. Yes, the housing will have to be straightened after welding is done on it.

More questions are welcome.

Philip

Ford 9"
 

I am so joining this thread, I am bound and determined to loose this almost 5to1 in my M3, because of my 1st gear being almost ,what6 to 1, I will be able to get away with a 3.25 maybe even a 2.75
final drive ratio, that article or story of the history of rear gear boxes is of much interest here,THANKS!!
Greg

So after researching some more and seeing that the Explorer 8.8 is actually a tad narrower than stock and needs wheel spacers I am wondering has anyone gone with a bit narrower rear so they could fit the max tire in the rear fender? and what did your axle face to axle face width & wheel/backspace/tire combo end up as?

Also if anyone wants to chime in on their gear ratio/tire height combo and how much they like it that would be welcome.

I am thinking of going with a T5 trans 2.95 first gear and a 3.50 rear end ratio

https://cimg8.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.for...7c5f79091.jpeg
If anyone is interested this has been a helpful site in trying to find the best rear end/tire combo for my truck..... unfortunately I'm still hem-hawing around whether to order a 59"(explorer width) or 61"(stock width) wheel mounting surface rear end as I want to maximize the wheel width

https://tiresize.com/tiresizes/255-60R15.htm

Also if you bring up a T5 trans on Summit's website it has a calculator where you plug in 3 of the 4 (gear/tire size/rpm/MPH ) and it calculates the missing figure, keep in mind T5's 4th gear is the 1:1 final ratio the calculator runs on not the .63 to 1 5th gear so you will get an idea but highway RPM will be lower which is a plus in my book.

Hey Ratty,
We put a 2001 salvage yard Explorer 8.8 in our 1950 F1. It was $125 & came with 3.73 gears, disc brakes, & limited slip diff.
It's a very nice set up for our 351W/AOD ... cruises all day long at 65/70 mph. We did go with 1 inch spacers to get the
wheels to look right in the fender but it hasn't been a big deal.

Good luck up there north of Detroit! (That sounds cold just typing that).

Ben in Austin
1950 F1

I used a 1975 Chevelle 8.5 inch 10 bolt rear end under my 49 Ford F-1. It is 60 inches wide from wheel mounting surface to wheel mounting surface, so it is within one inch of the stock F-1 width. I believe that 73-77 Chevelles all have the same rear end. The only drawback to using this rear end is that you have to remove all the coil spring bracketry and weld on a pair of leaf spring pads. It was not a hard job and the 3.08 gear was perfect for my truck. :)

When you guys say you had to use 1" spacers to make the wheels to look right are you using stock wheel/tires and they look too sunk in?

My plan is getting as much tire in there as possible without having issues so my thought is to go with a 59" wheel to wheel mounting surface like the explorer rear end, Although reading RIMROCK F1 thread on his "BELLE" build it seems he has 10" worth of tire in there with a 61.5" rear end....Hmmmm

Uhg I over think Everything! :-banghead

https://www.ford-trucks.com/forums/1...thread-16.html

??? I don’t quite get that ?
 

Help me out . You say your Housing width is 61 ? You have got to mean your “overall axel width “? From axel flange on axel tube end to axel tube end flange ?
the axel flange face to axel flange face measurements to be totally specific .
I guess you mean that . Because I know the face to face measurements are 61-61 1/4 inches .To say the “housing “ , to me is very confusing?
Its further complicated by the fact that your go on to refer to your “housing flange to housing flange measurements “. I surmise the housing flange your referring to now, is the “brake housing “ flange ?
still doesn’t make sense cause as far as I can tell the “ brake housing/backing plate - or brake clearance measurement would typically be longer than the “axel flange to axel flange” measurements ?
I do understand your brake offset point, but it would seem to work some thing like this.

overall axel measurement axel tube flange face to axel tube flange face- there’s no errors or room for confusion in that measurement description .

the brake system width/offset would typically “add” to the “overall axel tube flange to flange face measurement, no ?

so you would theoretically have say a 58 inch overall flange to flange width - PLUS. Say 2 inches or so for brakes on each side.
adding up to a 61 inch overall with including brakes.
some brake back plates are set back slightly .
The real measurements a “hotrodder” needs is overall axel width flange to flange
AND the width wheel surface mount face to wheel surface mount face.
and a level of awareness related to brake systems width.
im not trying to bust your chops. However I just went through a rear replacement project .
and there was so much misinformation and bad advice and descriptions and different measurements and advice.
honestly I never found ANY. Real accurate info at all.
even on this Forum is a detailed article, and when it refers to measurements , the typing and numbers are all jumbled ?
Its the article on rear ends everybody refers you to ? And it’s been a mess since the start of time . Ha
and it’s important info is all screwed up ?
gotta laugh. Like I’m going to spec and buy a 3,000$ rear end based on stuff /info like that ? Not.
anyway . I literally figured it all out myself.
thats why I noticed your comments were kinda sort of off and at a minimum confusing confusing. Ha thanks

To clear up any issues this is what I have ordered and installed. Axle flange to axle flange is 61 inches. This is the flange on the axle to which the brake disk and wheel bolt. Housing flange to housing flange is the flange to which the disk brake bolts and to which the bearing retainer bolts to hold the axle to the housing. The Wilwood disk brake kit I ordered and installed is P/N 140-12209-D which specifies a 2.5 inch "axle offset". This one:

https://www.wilwood.com/brakekits/Br...no=140-12209-D

I ordered from John's Industries, on their order sheet, a 61 inch axle flange to axle flange with a 56 inch housing flange to housing flange. John's Industries calls the "axle flange to axle flange" the "wheel to wheel width". The "housing flange to housing flange: is pretty easy to understand. With a 2.5 in axle offset required for the brake kit (2 x 2.5") equals 5.0". 61" - 5" = 56".

Everything is the right width and the brake kit and wheels fit just like they are supposed to fit. If you have any confusion, I suggest you talk to the people at John's Industries and get their order sheet. Any other questions?

Philip

Thanks Phillip !
 

Thanks, your on the ball, and thanks for clarifying it. I’m looking into a Spraker rear end , but based on your kind advice will contact “”your supplier”.
you gotta laugh my very first post on here asked -“what’s the best overal lug bolt pattern to use on my 48 F1? “
I got all sort of reply’s on wheel diameter , width, rear ends, gear ratios , etc
kinda bizarre.
I had to post three times my bolt pattern question.... them one guy simply answered it . 5. X 4.5.
Thanks again
my rear end width adventure worked out similar to what you kindly presented and kindly clarified.
keep on wrenching . Silman

With John's Industries, they will supply just about any lug bolt pattern. Stock early Ford is 5 x 5.5 inch, which is what I chose for my 31 spline axles on the rear. I did this to match the Dodge D150 disk rotors I installed on the front of my Dodge Dakota IFS.

You can find John's Industries here: John?s Industries - Ford 9 inch Rear Ends Housing Axles Caspian, M

They are a little shop in Upper Michigan and their product is excellent. I found them easy and honest with which to deal. My internet searches for Ford 9 inch suppliers were extensive and I selected John's because their product was, IMHO, better than many of the others out there, including Currie out of California.

If you want to see my order sheet to John's Industries for my housing and axle order, send me a PM and I will send it to you. There is too much personal info on it to post for the general public to see.

If you are interested my build thread is here: https://www.ford-trucks.com/forums/1...ld-thread.html

I am still catching up on the work I have already completed and the next post will be on the rear end work.

Good luck.
Philip

I’m looking at Johns
 

Thanks , I’m looking at Johns lead. Very good lead. The rear I was looking at was nice 9 “ 31 spline . But added up to like 3,000$ . All said and done. Had 3” axel tubes - I need 3 “ tubes for my chassis engineering rear suspension kit. And had brake set up with drilled rotors. Steel calipers, all greasy paint and my leaf pads installed plus shipping.
I looked all over web, thought it was costly but not over the top ? Didn’t want to go the junk yard explorer route, only the ford ranger rears use 3 “ tube.
looked at you build. Similar to mine .
But one of mine is a “real high performance hot rod. No Limit custom frame and stroker crate motor.
the other is n my “kinda donor title truck”, but I decided to build it too. But stock frame and motor , etc.
I had a choice to pick a fresh new lug bolt pattern with the No Limit custom frame. So that’s why I had the question last year about , what’s best overall lug pattern.
good luck.
Silman
https://cimg2.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.for...7bb978388.jpeg
No limit f1 1948
https://cimg6.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.for...43d04246f.jpeg
No limit f1
https://cimg8.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.for...fa896209d2.png
Original f1 build
https://cimg9.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.for...343a9a689b.png
Original f1 build
https://cimg0.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.for...fe49ec48c9.png
F1 1948 rear restoration New Chassis engineering kit, w shocks, new leafs , new leaf brackets (black powder coat - I do my own. 3” drop New 3/16 steel powder coated angle iron cross member. All fresh grade 8 hardware. Powder coat bumper, shorty bumper brackets new rubber axel bumpers Powder coated leaf shackles, all stainless bumper hardware, custom farm red powder coat tow eyes (2) All emergency brake mechanical hardware powder coated . Fresh frame mount rear cab brackets Etc
https://cimg1.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.for...ebc94e962.jpeg
No limit f1

More pics of rear coming together
 

https://cimg8.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.for...21d7d0ebe.jpeg
Pretty cool! Removing old leaf mounts , was a job!
https://cimg3.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.for...caafe938b.jpeg
https://cimg5.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.for...301cb7d60.jpeg
Ignore the wood that’s just my tarp frame
https://cimg9.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.for...1255030f6.jpeg
New shock cross bar, and beefier angle iron cross support. My old one was bent.