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-   Small Block V8 (221, 260, 289, 5.0/302, 5.8/351W) (https://www.ford-trucks.com/forums/forum55/)
-   -   I gambled and maybe I (https://www.ford-trucks.com/forums/1503670-i-gambled-and-maybe-i.html)

schoo 08-16-2017 10:56 AM

I gambled and maybe I
 
I have a 49 f1 I got a 89 e250 302/efi for a donor it had a lot of miles so it's got low oil pressure 6-9 psi (15-50 oil)at idle and makes a little noise at start up rear main oil leak. So I'd like to know what your opinion is for replacing, rebuild or ?
I would like 200 plus hp should I do it myself with your help, just get a crate from who any ideas
https://cimg7.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.for...5ff5a91d59.jpg

Glaser67 08-16-2017 12:07 PM


Originally Posted by schoo (Post 17400343)
I have a 49 f1 I got a 89 e250 302/efi for a donor it had a lot of miles so it's got low oil pressure 6-9 psi (15-50 oil)at idle and makes a little noise at start up rear main oil leak. So I'd like to know what your opinion is for replacing, rebuild or ?
I would like 200 plus hp should I do it myself with your help, just get a crate from who any ideas
https://cimg7.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.for...5ff5a91d59.jpg

How many miles are on it? What's your budget and how deep are you willing to go inside the motor?

schoo 08-16-2017 12:59 PM

guessing 200k
budget is low but no junk that's why low hp 200+
I what to use this FI if I can and computer save $
stock + a little don't really need headers

Turd-250 08-16-2017 01:56 PM

didn't the early efi 302s make about 180hp stock? i bet a few bolt-ons will get you there.
sub'd! i'm very interested in this project! both because i'm going to restore a 49 f1 with my dad and i'm putting a 302 in my baby ranger lol

schoo 08-16-2017 02:38 PM

thinking aluminum heads for less weight on the front end not so much for power does that make any sense

Turd-250 08-16-2017 03:43 PM

hmmm i figure the weight savings would only be around 40 lbs for both heads. those are expensive i think, over $500 for a set maybe?

Conanski 08-16-2017 06:56 PM

You don't need heads to break 200hp just a cam. I say strip it down and send out the longblock to a machine shop, If you can find a decent shop that will work with you and just do the work that the parts need(these Ford blocks don't need line boring or decking), then you will just have to spend money on bearing surfaces, bores and valve guides. Then put it together with an aftermarket EFI friendly flat tappet cam like the 31-255-5, or convert it to a roller setup with valvetrain parts(cam. lifters, pushrods, spider) salvaged from a '94+ junkyard truck motor or 5.0HO, and you will have 250hp give or take as long as the exhaust system isn't a complete cork.

schoo 08-16-2017 07:27 PM

I was hoping you would say something Conan I would like a roller cam, I could get headers but I don't want noise in the front it's not very noisy now without carpet and want to keep it that way. As for aluminum heads it would be more for bringing the wieght down on the front and 40# is going to make up the ac I added although not mandatory

Conanski 08-16-2017 09:08 PM

With aftermarket heads and a cam you will have trouble not making 300+ hp. Terrible problem to have I know.. LOL. Oh.. stock exhaust manifolds will strangle it just enough perhaps.

schoo 08-16-2017 09:46 PM

Thanks for the directions something for this winter

Rusty96 08-23-2017 01:32 PM

Why not just find a good running 351 out of a fuel injected truck and drop it in? No rebuild and it's over 200hp. The 351 will typically swap right out with a 302.

schoo 08-28-2017 09:00 PM


Originally Posted by Rusty96 (Post 17417027)
Why not just find a good running 351 out of a fuel injected truck and drop it in? No rebuild and it's over 200hp. The 351 will typically swap right out with a 302.

I think the heads are a little bigger on the 351 and I have a tight fit now

xlt4wd90 08-29-2017 02:57 AM

The heads are the same size; the 351 block is about 1.5" wider on each side than the 302. So yes, if you had fitment issues with a 302, it would be worse with a 351.

Beanscoot 08-29-2017 10:47 AM

I think the 351W is an inch and a half wider total, not on each side. Still, this is enough to cause problems with smaller engine bays.


Plus, Schoo wants to keep the front end weight down.

schoo 09-17-2017 11:52 AM

Another question on this 302 my engine is from a 1989 Efi would like to keep the efi and the pcm so if I change to a roller cam change does that change the firing order to 137 From 154 and then do I change the pcm and the map and FI
By the way I probably dropping the aluminum heads to much $$

schoo 09-17-2017 03:52 PM

ok I found some answers I have read that I just change the firing order at the dizzy
and the injection wont care? is that true

xlt4wd90 09-17-2017 05:11 PM

Early trucks used bank-fired injectors so timing them is not needed but if you use the EEC from a later truck don't know what year they went sequential or a HO Mustang the injectors would be sequential and the injector order will be important for good driveability and efficiency

Conanski 09-17-2017 05:14 PM


Originally Posted by schoo (Post 17469331)
I have read that I just change the firing order at the dizzy and the injection wont care? is that true

Yes it is.

Conanski 09-17-2017 05:16 PM


Originally Posted by xlt4wd90 (Post 17469440)
if you use the EEC from a later truck

Don't do this unless you are prepared for involved wiring harness modifications.

schoo 09-17-2017 06:12 PM


Originally Posted by Conanski (Post 17469451)
Don't do this unless you are prepared for involved wiring harness modifications.

Yes I know now

schoo 09-17-2017 06:27 PM

Are these roller lifters
https://cimg2.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.for...2bc8877423.jpg

xlt4wd90 09-17-2017 08:11 PM

Yes they are the center spider is holding down the dogbones that keep the lifters aligned so their rollers can roll on the cam lobes

schoo 09-17-2017 09:24 PM

Thank you I thought it was it's on CL the guy wants $500 for it and all I need is the cam and parts

schoo 11-21-2018 04:20 PM

Bumping my old thread and getting started

schoo 11-22-2018 01:57 PM


https://cimg0.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.for...74f7adee2.jpeg
Getting started got the hood off looking at the radiator/AC more work than I remember

Beanscoot 11-22-2018 08:50 PM

Wow, that truck looks amazing. The modern aluminum radiator looks a little out of place, but then it won't show with the hood down.

fordman75 11-22-2018 09:37 PM

I don't think you can just throw a roller cam set up in the flat tappet block using the stock roller cam parts. If I remember correctly the lifter bores are different heights. If you just install the roller parts in the flat tappet block you could end up with a lifter that spins. That destroys the cam and spreads metal particles throughout the engine. Which then requires a complete rebuild.

I'm going thru this same deal right now on my 89 351W. I'm wanting to convert it to a roller cam. If you want to keep your current short block, I believe you will need to pick up a set of aftermarket link bar roller lifters. These have bars that connect the lifters into pairs to keep them from spinning. Instead of the stock spider and dog bones that are used on the stock roller set ups. The ones I was looking at for my 351W are going to run around $400.

The other choice is to pick up another short block that already has the roller cam set up. This could be out of Mustang, T-Bird, Crown vic or the 96-2000 or so Explorers. The Explorer engines are fairly easy & cheap to find. Plus they will also have the cast iron GT40 ( 3 bar, 96 to early 97 ) or GT40P ( 4 bar, mid 97+ ) heads which are better then your current heads. I picked up a pair of the GT40 heads for my 351W. The GT40P's have the spark plugs at a different angle. So if you want to run something besides the stock GT40P manifold/headers you may run into issues and need special headers. That is why if given a choice most people try to stick with the GT40's over the GT40P's. But the P's are easier to find.

If you get the explorer engine you can run your current EFI and distributor ( explorers 5.0L's don't run distributors ) but you will need to change your distributor drive gear.

With your current engine I would do a compression test and leak down test. That will give you an idea on the condition of your cylinders & rings in your current engine. Also hook up a vacuum gauge. Then decide how far you want to tear into the engine or just replace it.

xlt4wd90 11-23-2018 12:36 AM

Comp Cams makes a series of small base circle roller cams for flat tappet engines that do not have the taller lifter bores. They also have the retainer dog-bones and spider retainer for use with roller lifters with the alignment flats, like Ford's stock rollers.

Summit racing has lots of bad reviews of link bar roller lifters failing.

Scndsin 11-23-2018 07:19 AM

Every 5.0 block made since 85 is "roller" capable. Add a set of lifters, the spider & dog bones. Get the hold down bolts too.

5.8 blocks were not cast with tall lifter bores till '94.

Super nice truck.

schoo 11-23-2018 08:30 AM

Thanks for the info guys my research is that it should be a roller block(89) but won’t know for sure until I get it open

schoo 11-24-2018 07:20 PM

O
https://cimg6.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.for...b78f19a6c.jpeg
ok I got in a hurry and forgot to bleed the fuel pressure with the starter so ideas to relieve it without the starter I hate gas in the face

fordman75 11-24-2018 08:33 PM

It may not be the right way to do it. But I've always just used a rag & small screw driver. Pull the cap off the schrader valve on the fuel rail. Put the rag over the valve and push it in with the screw driver.

schoo 11-24-2018 08:59 PM


Originally Posted by fordman75 (Post 18324542)
It may not be the right way to do it. But I've always just used a rag & small screw driver. Pull the cap off the schrader valve on the fuel rail. Put the rag over the valve and push it in with the screw driver.

sounds reasonable to me and a big thank thank you

schoo 11-25-2018 03:50 PM

Are there just 4nuts on the flex plate to torque converter?

fordman75 11-25-2018 04:21 PM

The ford auto's I've dealt with have all had 4.

schoo 11-25-2018 05:05 PM


Originally Posted by fordman75 (Post 18325804)
The ford auto's I've dealt with have all had 4.

thanks I can only push the converter back maybe a 1/8 to 3/16” is that far enough

fordman75 11-25-2018 05:32 PM

Once the 4 nuts have been removed I don't worry about the convertor until I start pulling the engine. I haven't had them get to hung up on the flexplate while pulling the engine. They usually separate pretty easily.

baddad457 11-25-2018 07:49 PM


Originally Posted by Scndsin (Post 18321905)
Every 5.0 block made since 85 is "roller" capable. Add a set of lifters, the spider & dog bones. Get the hold down bolts too.

5.8 blocks were not cast with tall lifter bores till '94.

Super nice truck.

But some do not have the spider hold down bolt holes drilled and tapped. And at least one I ran across had half formed bosses for this which is why it was equipped with a flat tappet cam and installed in a pickup. When drilling these holes and tapping them, you have to be sure to not drill into the cam bearings doing it.

schoo 11-26-2018 06:34 PM

Going to have?
 

The converter was tight against the flex plate you can see the bolts rubbing is that the normal
https://cimg9.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.for...df8dc39cf.jpeg
It was a tight fit taking it out Tran dip stick was Just in the way

schoo 11-26-2018 06:41 PM

Another 1” wider and would have had to take out the AC compressor



https://cimg9.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.for...025414426.jpeg



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