new oil cooler AGAIN, 24 degree deltas??
 

Just had my oil cooler replaced AGAIN. Had it done the first time with head gaskets, studs and EGR delete a thousands or so miles ago, and it turned into a nightmare with an injector hold-down letting go and hydrolocking a cylinder. Mechanic fixed it all up again. When I recently I brought it back with a significant oil leak, he reported that the oil cooler gasket was disintegrated, causing the leak. So he replaced the oil cooler again, on warranty. Great. I promptly hooked it up to the camper and headed over the mountains on a hot day. No choice. Deltas were steady at 24 degrees when I was climbing for 45 minutes or so. Oil got as hot as 248. Water pretty steady at 224. Mechanic says this is ok, though he didn't sound sure. 20 miles later around town, truck starts running rough so I bring it back again. Apparently #3 injector is completely dead.

I'd thoroughly flushed the coolant before the first oil cooler and studs etc and installed a sinister coolant filter between the oil cooler changes.

Are these deltas and high temps ok? Just checked the Tech folder and Bismic reported 230+ as the 'alarm' temp for oil, 215+ for coolant. That was in 2010. Is this still current? I'm way over 15* on the delta, but was operating under a pretty heavy load. Could this injector be related to the hot fluids? Are they too hot? Why would this delta be so big? Any input here is appreciated. Thanks as always.

EOT is Way Hot

that truck Defuels and Goes into Limp Mode at 253* EOT

Did they Flush the Cooling System Out when they changed all these oil coolers

That Is the MAIN Cause for Repeat OIL Cooler failure

hows the FICM Volts

is the FAN TURNING ON???It should sound like a Jet Engine on a 747 at those temps

It Also Defuels/goes into limp mode at ECT of 221*f

So you broke 1 Threshold and are Really close to breaking another one with EOT*

I see an EGR delete. Is the Valve still plugged in ?

Sean :-drink

when you're doing an engine flush its very tempting not to pUll the engine plugs at least the one under the starter, I would make sure that both engine plugs are being pulled during the flush. I would think in the case of the bad fuel injector more fuel more heat less fuel less heat I don't know if it would have anything to do with the high deltas. But here's what I can say my truck was also seeing some really deltas ECT,I did thermostat oil cooler and was about to do the radiatorit turned out that it was a combination of two parts serpentine Belt tension pulley & water pump.

Somewhere around the 250* EOT mark the oil filter standpipe has a bad characteristic of melting into the oil cooler housing. No fun there. It then blocks the oil passageways. I have seen this first hand. If that happens you're pretty much screwed.

Thanks for ideas.
-FICM is solid 48v.
-EGR was deleted (or "capped" according to mech) back when I had the studs and oil cooler done the first time. I believe that the valve is still plugged in.
-I thoroughly flushed the coolant myself before the studs/cooler/egr and installed a fumoto valve on passenger side. Used VC-9. Backflushed oil cooler, rad and heater core too. Replaced Tstat and degas cap at same time. I've since dumped the coolant from the fumoto a couple times just to see what's in there - and to make my sinister coolant filters last a little longer. Good amount of sand the first time combined with some tiny metal chips. Not much. Dumped a second time a few days ago, and just a miniscule amount of metal again.

Maybe water pump going?

No, the standpipe doesn't melt until 350 degrees.

there is a cure for the oil cooler problem!!!!!!!!
it is Bulletproofdiesel.com.
it replaces the oil cooler.
After I found 1 head warped and it was about 50,000 on my oil cooler I started looking.
I replaced both heads and got the bullet proof oil cooler kit.
with ARP head bolt kit.
Go to this web page and watch the video's that will explain why the oil cooler fails and what their kit will do to fix
My oil temp went down to 190
I have put about 30,000 on my 2006 F350 6.0 with no problems

Correct, my bad.

do you know or can you find out if the truck was ever ran on straight water for any length of time?

There is a new and improved water pump For The 6.0 . does anyone know who makes it?

glad standpipe not melted.

no idea if its been on straight water. Not since I've owned it anyway - which hasn't been long.

Bulletproof diesel sounds interesting and expensive. Maybe my problems run deeper here...
With another new cooler, and a thorough coolant flush, (and filter) this thing SHOULD be running better than it is.

Maybe!! its on the List

you have any Old Oil Coolers you could cut open for a Peak



You need to Buy A gauge we need to check sensors Although I think they are OK


and Maybe just change the Water pump to a Metal IMPELLAR design


Haa it ever been checked to see if the Oil Coolers Helped after a Change


I think you need a New mechanic

talking about a man's mechanic is like talking about his wife but I was starting to think the same thing it might be time for a change!

SEAN Got a Good One with EGR Valve if its not working right or Plugged in


At your Temps you should remember the Fan it would have been noticeable


SO you just bought this truck and had to Pour Money into it



If it was me New Mechanic Time Im sorrey if its a Family friend

Im shure we don't hear the Whole storey on FTE until its ASKED Up FRONT


I guess he could have just bought someone else Problem


I see a Ton of Parts getting changed though LOL

Not ready to give up on my mechanic yet.

Will check egr valve. I think that I did hear the fan when I had those high temps although there is doubt because it was not nearly as loud as the fan on my old 7.3 which really did sound like a jet engine starting up. Is there a way to test that fan & clutch?

I'm on my second oil cooler due to a faulty seal, and have a thoroughly flushed cooling system, with coolant filter installed - and engine is still running very hot. Apparently the water pump on this engine is very solid but is this something I should consider changing anyway? They aren't that expensive.

I had back flushed the radiator (and oil cooler and heater core) sometime ago with a garden hose but perhaps I should take the radiator out and have it professionally tested?

Even if I can find something wrong with the water cooling/circulating system, could that account for the high deltas?

Too many questions here, I know. Thanks for any input.

the Impellar on the OEM water pumps Slip there Plastic

the upgrade is a Metal Impellar water pump

I know first hand, if you have ruptured an oil cooler, you need to pull thermostat, and pull both block plugs (might as well install fumoto valves to make it easier) to get it clean. I don't think most mechanics understand this.

VC9 is a rust remover, not a degreaser. Use internationals Restore for a degreaser. Restore plus is the same as vc9 but cheaper. Degrease once or twice. Pull thermostat and plugs. Use a hose pipe run into the degas bottle, open the block plugs, and rev the engine after the radiator is full. Thus will gush water out the plugs and get as much debris out as possible.

Then BACKWASH the heater core with a garden hose. I washed mine into a 5 gallon bucket just to see what was still in there. You will be amazed by what was lodged in there after being flushed. I did not have to BACKFLUSH my oil cooler because I knew it was being replaced. So, I didn't figure out how to-do that. I'm curious how you backwashed yours and what it looked like.

I know everyone who backwashed their oil cooler and didn't get the crude out of the coolant system, got great improvement in their deltas for less than 1000 miles ..... Then the deltas returned to where they were before the backflush.

05+ had the updated water pump in them. Bulletproof diesel is who sells the metal impeller pump.

While we a re talking water pumps. If you have time you may want to
pull it and check the housing behind it for any cavitation evidence on
the back side. If you find a lot that that could be one of the reasons.
Also it was said before I think but pull the host coming from the intake
to the degas and but in a clean bucket and see how the flow looks. That
can give you an idea on how well the pump is moving fluid.

Sean :-drink

Does the updated Water pump have Metal Impellar?? I thinking all the Auto Zone and Oreillys pep boy all there Water [pumps are metal impellar and might be alittle cheaper then BPD

Althought the BPD may have a Sweet Bearing in it IDK


I thought it was still plastic just a Little bit bigger with 1 more Fin


IMO the Updated WP was a BUST cause it really needed a Metal impellar


IMO the Cooling system in these Shed Heat EXCELLENT in these trucks REGAURDLESS of Water Pump Size:-X22 Waist of time to change Front cover and Water Pump

Just a few catches the Thermostat and Fan even the EGR Valve needs to ALL be Working

Iirc the 05+ water pumps are just bigger and are still a plastic impeller.

Enduro, can you tell me how you backflushed the oil cooler? I've never done it and want to know how others do it.

When my first oil cooler failed, I put the Bulletproof EGR cooler and stock Ford oil cooler in. I took it to a shop to do the swap, and instructed them to do the complete flush. I also installed an Atlas 40 FICM from Ed at that time, and installed my Insight CTS.

After a short while, the EOT/ECT delta started to grow. In talking with Ed, he pointed me in the right direction for a proper flush, and I did it myself. It seems the shop probably didn't do a thorough enough job, or certainly not as thorough as I did, since I had to fork over the $1300 in parts and $1200 labor the first time...

Doing Ed's flush bought me some time, and about 18 months later the next oil cooler was starting to fail with 20-30* deltas. I bit the bullet and got the HD Bulletproof Oil Cooler and most of the time EOT is lower than ECT now. Very rarely is ECT above EOT and if so, not by much.

Don't have many miles on the Bulletproof setup, but it seems to be working well. Even though it was expensive, I did it myself so I "saved" the $1200 in labor that I paid the first time...

I back-flushed my cooling system by hooking the garden hose to the vent line coming from the egr cooler to the degas bottle.
I disconnected the line at the degas bottle and let her flow with the block drains open and lower radiator hose disconnected.

In my opinion my cooling system was "clean" as I had deltas of 5-7 f at 65mph, I had flushed with FleetGuard Restore due to a failed thermostat at approx 90,000 mi. I was quite amazed to see the debris come out during the reverse flush.

I currently have over 185,000 mi. with original coolers, I also installed a coolant filter at approx 105,000 mi.

Good stuff!

how do you know that the water pump is in good shape?my Whole inpemlar was completely off of the spindle not turning at all and I didn't know it from looking good.

Good stuff!

This is true. The impeller design was changed as well. I think someone did mention there was an aftermarket metal impeller pump besides the BPD one. Also, the 05+ has been shown to very rarely fail. Anthony (run6.0run) had like 500k+ miles on his original I believe.

What would be Ideal is a OEM with Metal Impellar

or are they All Metal Now??

Apparently NAPA is metal impeller.

http://napaautotech-classsupport.com...MPTEST1WEB.pdf

Bryanstein, I printed off a pdf that I found here and followed it to a T. I only installed the Fumoto valve on the passenger side though.

Google this: Ford Powerstroke 6.0L Turbo Diesel Cooling System Overview and Flush

and the PDF is in the top couple.

I also used a couple YouTube videos - one where the guy left the driver-side block plug out and revved the engine to blow out the gunk.
I ended up buying a little cooling system flush kit and modifying it to fit into the oil cooler, and the heater core hose. I'll try to find a couple pics of the tools I used/made.

Used a piece of neoprene to cap off one side of each of these adapters. Worked very well, although I might not be the best guy to give advice here ... because I still have cooling system problems.

http://i393.photobucket.com/albums/p...ps70165497.jpg

A little electrical tape to hold the Torx bit in the wrench saved a ton of time removing the cap on the oil cooler coolant outlet.

http://i393.photobucket.com/albums/p...psfa0802e4.jpg

3/4 inch hose from Home depot was a perfect fit.


http://i393.photobucket.com/albums/p...ps5e0eb8b7.jpg

Now back to my question...

How can I test if the fan and clutch are working properly?

What might explain the metal coming out the passenger side block drain?

http://i393.photobucket.com/albums/p...ps60fe81f9.jpg

Can a poorly functioning coolant system account for the high delta, given that the oil cooler is new?

well If you are not shy about doing a tap into a wire I know
on the 2006 if you apply ground to the control wire it will
take the fan to 100%. The PCM controls it by a PWM signal
pulling the 12V on the wire to ground. But be careful there is
a 12 V and a 5V signal on that plug also along with a speed
sensor output. You need to look at a diagram for you truck year.
By grounding the control line you after a minute or so give or
take a bit have full on if the fan and clutch are working right.

This is my prototyping tool
http://imageshack.us/a/img826/7555/f24b.jpg
This is the speed sensor output on a scope
http://imageshack.us/a/img268/768/x5uw.jpg

Sean :-drink

What are your delta's when the truck is unloaded? If I read your post right the 24* delta was when pulling the camper.

I will say this n it will go out... Lol. But I'm at 740k now and still on the plastic impeller. Original pump. I have a couple extras, but mine still works.

If the flush is done properly,, and the coolant is changed at least every 100k, the oem oil cooler could last indefinitely. The bpd setup is not economical at all. It's a cool idea, and it works, but I think its just a compensation for lags in maintenance. Running old coolant in a sand free system will cause cavitation also.

Just for the record Anthony ...

Are you are still using the Ford Gold coolant?
Have you ever had an oil cooler fail?

I know you have probably posted it before (or maybe you even answered the question in a PM from me - lol), but I was curious about your trucks history on this particular component.

thanks!