f650 Loud knock white smoke
So in order to scan this truck i need a 9 pin heavy truck connector. Which i dont have. Any how it aint throwin codes. Just a loud tap tap tap in the top of the motor. I pulled all push rods and rockers of course and none are bent. I turned the motor by hand and watched the valve train do its thing and all seems fine. Before i tear the heads off i figure id get some input from the experts. Broke inj tip? Broke valve layin on top the piston? Btw this is a buddies roll back.wrecker. his son was involved in a wreck and not expected to make it. He had another fella runnin his rollback while he tended to his son. So now on top of the crap that happen to his son his wrecker goes down. Im going to fix this truck for free. Hes a good guy and has always helped when i was in need. Just hope i can get parts during xmass.
So any thoughts before i take the heads off? I beleive i have checked what i can but dont know. Anything i missing? |
EGR cooler?
Coolant can MIX with the fuel in the cylinders, and well, coolant doesn't mix well with diesel, and can cause an "injector" knock.... Pull EGR valve and see if its wet or dry. |
Originally Posted by 2006powerstroke90
(Post 12630745)
EGR cooler?
Coolant can MIX with the fuel in the cylinders, and well, coolant doesn't mix well with diesel, and can cause an "injector" knock.... Pull EGR valve and see if its wet or dry. |
Fuel KNOCK from bad injector
Do a Bubble test |
Does the knock sound like the first few seconds of this video?
This was from a few years ago, with a couple bad injectors... http://s298.photobucket.com/albums/m...=videos003.mp4 |
Originally Posted by BLADE35
(Post 12630874)
Fuel KNOCK from bad injector
Do a Bubble test |
I'm not going to be of much help to be quite honest with you, but I'll do my best. First off, the tests described above apply only to F-Series trucks F-250 to F-550. These engines use a Navistar ECM if I'm not mistaken so the only way you'll be able to read DTCs is to possibly get your hands on a scanner from Navistar. But you knew that already.
I was going to suggest you remove all eight glow plugs and do what I call a "mist test". Meaning to crank the engine over with all eight glow plugs removed and check for fluid (fuel or coolant) exiting the cylinder(s) through the glow plug hole(s) to pinpoint your problem cylinder(s). But since you've already jumped the gun and removed all the valvetrain, I would suggest removing all eight injectors for a look/see. |
Is this a Navistar or a Sterling? Also there is relatively low cost scanner that has HD function and adapter cables. Its called autoXray a hand held model. Not really a great scanner but does the job for basic codes. Used one for 5 years, before I could get a decent scanner.
Just for general info there is a laptob based software for Heavy duty thats compareable to A&E called PF-Diagnose several different versions and lately came out with a OBDII version as well. Draw back is to work best you use a Nexiq interface that costs over twice what the software pacage does. Base package last I looked was about $300.00 |
Didnt hit me at the time but cant do Bubble test with Valve train apart either
But if all valves are In and Closed and Injectors still in there Bores with Fuel system hooked up then yes you can do a Bubble test I am thinking Not shure how the Valves not opening and Closeing will affect things Usually the Bubble test and Mist test is done before Teardown Basicaly a Bubble test is done to see if Combustion gas is making its way back into the fuel rail from Bad Injector or Bad inject oring You would Disable FICM and Fuel Pump pull UPPER Fuel filter lid off and Crank engine over and watch for Bubbles at the Upper fuel filter housing |
Originally Posted by m-chan68
(Post 12631370)
I'm not going to be of much help to be quite honest with you, but I'll do my best. First off, the tests described above apply only to F-Series trucks F-250 to F-550. These engines use a Navistar ECM if I'm not mistaken so the only way you'll be able to read DTCs is to possibly get your hands on a scanner from Navistar. But you knew that already.
I was going to suggest you remove all eight glow plugs and do what I call a "mist test". Meaning to crank the engine over with all eight glow plugs removed and check for fluid (fuel or coolant) exiting the cylinder(s) through the glow plug hole(s) to pinpoint your problem cylinder(s). But since you've already jumped the gun and removed all the valvetrain, I would suggest removing all eight injectors for a look/see. |
Originally Posted by 6.0techwannabe
(Post 12631711)
Funny thing. I kno there tty head bolts. But i removed 1 at a time and put new 1s back that i had layin around. So yes i can start the truck. The reason i had new tty headbolts is becuz wen i buy multi layered steel hg's the bolts come with it. Arp headstuds go in there place. And i throw the tty's in the scrap bin
Are these ^^^Specific Steel HG for 6.0L??????? |
Originally Posted by BLADE35
(Post 12632382)
Are these ^^^Specific Steel HG for 6.0L???????
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Originally Posted by 6.0techwannabe
(Post 12631711)
Funny thing. I kno there tty head bolts. But i removed 1 at a time and put new 1s back that i had layin around. So yes i can start the truck. The reason i had new tty headbolts is becuz wen i buy multi layered steel hg's the bolts come with it. Arp headstuds go in there place. And i throw the tty's in the scrap bin
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You can do a bubble test or a balloon test. The purpose of the test is to see if you have a cylinder pushing compression back into the fuel rail/head past an injector, indicating a failed crush washer and/or o-ring. The test might be more difficult on a mechanical fuel pump truck because you need to disable the fuel flow to the heads, but it's basically the same. If you attach a balloon to the fuel line to the head and crank the truck it's "supposed" to inflate IF the leak is bad enough. A bubble test is more sensative as it will show a much smaller leak.
I hope my description of the test procedure at least gives you an idea of what you're trying to achieve. It's not injector specific but it will at least give you a starting point. |
mike is the man here. listen to him. white smoke/knock is fuel issues. you can test the ficm with a dvom as well.
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Originally Posted by cheezit
(Post 12633352)
mike is the man here. listen to him. white smoke/knock is fuel issues. you can test the ficm with a dvom as well.
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yup. I need to do more test on the ficm........im workin on a 6.0 during xmass....my wife is pissed....
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Originally Posted by 6.0techwannabe
(Post 12632885)
I dont think there is an electric fuel system on this thing. The pump works off the cam....i think.....i kno its not electric. But this thing is full on 6.0....just a diff ecu and tranny,fuel bowl and intake are diff as well. With it being a tandem lift pump,would the bubble test still be of use?
That doesn't mean to say it don't exist. The VT engines weren't produced very long and became branded MAXXFORCE 7 and then phazed out for the DT 360 and 466 engines. Inline 6's with more ummphh. |
the fuel pump is part of the ps pump as well. iirc there is a screen that can be removed from the pump and cleaned
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Originally Posted by cheezit
(Post 12634152)
the fuel pump is part of the ps pump as well. iirc there is a screen that can be removed from the pump and cleaned
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its been awhile but yes in the pump, assuming it has the combo unit ps and fp.
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Originally Posted by cheezit
(Post 12634565)
its been awhile but yes in the pump, assuming it has the combo unit ps and fp.
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restriction do some strange stuff
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2006 f350 6.0 psd
Originally Posted by 2006powerstroke90
(Post 12630983)
Does the knock sound like the first few seconds of this video?
This was from a few years ago, with a couple bad injectors... videos003.mp4 Video by lilpimpinkkidd_2008 | Photobucket |
Originally Posted by sthrninhp
(Post 13199757)
my 2006 is doing the same thing, we tore down the passenger side cause that was the side the tapping was coming from, #7 injector was completely saturated in fuel, and there was a lot of fuel on top of the cylinder, mechanic tested all injectors and said it was best to replace #3 and #5, so we did and put it back together, smoke isn't near as bad but knock is still there and is constant doesn't go away, but the knock is coming from the drivers side now, unfortunately the mechanic doesn't have a snapon scanner to do a buzz test so I hate to have him tear it apart and it not fix the problem, the truck is over 400 miles from home and I am trying not to have it towed
It ended up being a bolt slipped through the intake, landed on top the piston. I replaced that piston and shes fine now. Dont let that scare ya tho. Let me kno were your located. I have a snap on verus. It will more than do the job |
the truck is located in Covington Va, he has a nexiq scanner, which nexiq was recently bought by snapon, he has been getting the run around from the snapon guy about trading the nexiq in on a snapon verus, I told him not to do anymore till a full diagnostic has been ran on the truck, right now I am looking at $600 to have it towed home so my mechanic can work on it
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