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-   -   Bw 1356, np205, clocking, and strength questions (https://www.ford-trucks.com/forums/1131600-bw-1356-np205-clocking-and-strength-questions.html)

rollinblackcloud 01-17-2012 12:56 PM

Bw 1356, np205, clocking, and strength questions
 
Hey guys, i got a 94 f250 4x4, 7.3, factory zf5 and 1356. 4.10 gears. I did the dana 60 swap in the front, and lincoln locked it. Im running 38in xml's. 7.3 is putting 400ft lbs at idle. I do a lot of low speed crawling, but tough stuff. My front driveline is eating ujoints like crazy, shaft to case is way over angled. So i have to clock it, but im wondering if i should swap in a np205? So my questions are, is the 1356 really a weak link? Will the np205 meet straight to my zf5? I dont wanna do any divorced crap.. I already read about supporting the np205 with crossmembers. And what has to be done for hooking up the orig 4x4 in the cab? Its a manual shifter.

Has anyone broke the 1356? What can it withstand?

Thanks

tjc transport 01-17-2012 04:40 PM

well, i broke a 1356 t-case, but it had a little over 300,000 miles of abuse on it when the chain snapped and split the case open.

mando jake 01-19-2012 09:06 AM

I deal with both cases a lot. The chain cases should really get a new chain at about 125K-150K, and they have a pump that rides the shaft, and has a steel stop that rides in the aluminum/magnesium, and is famous for breaking loose and spinning instead of pumping and also destroying internal parts. I have repaired a few of those also. If maintained, the 1356 is a beast of a chain case with a nice and low gear ratio (2.7:1) that you would find useful whether you think so or not. And contrary to what some may think, it can be modded for 2wd low.:-X06 The 1356 is much longer than the NP205, and usually slip yoke rear output, unless you get one from a Big Bronco. Watch out for problematic electric shift versions.

NP205 is famous for being bomb-proof, partially due to its chainless helical gear setup, and partially because it has a somewhat protective low gear ratio (1.96:1). Unlike the BW, it can easily be modified to give you front wheel drive only, Hi and Lo, and 2wd Low.
In your truck, you would install the NP205 and find that the front driveshaft is too long, and would mount a few inches closer to the center of driveline. This may or may not be a crossmember/exhaust problem for you. You also have to knotch out your transmission 4x4 tailhousing for the rear axle's shift rail, and its about 250 LBS. vs. about 80 LBS. BW, so adding another support at the NP205 is a must.

With either case, it is possible, and sounds needed, to clock the front output location downward to help with angles. Clocking it downward would also help any crossmember/exhaust/driveshaft clearance issues.

Hope that helps.

swamper29 01-28-2012 06:46 AM

What's wrong with the electric shift versions? Just curious cause I have one


Originally Posted by mando jake (Post 11307543)
I deal with both cases a lot. The chain cases should really get a new chain at about 125K-150K, and they have a pump that rides the shaft, and has a steel stop that rides in the aluminum/magnesium, and is famous for breaking loose and spinning instead of pumping and also destroying internal parts. I have repaired a few of those also. If maintained, the 1356 is a beast of a chain case with a nice and low gear ratio (2.7:1) that you would find useful whether you think so or not. And contrary to what some may think, it can be modded for 2wd low.:-X06 The 1356 is much longer than the NP205, and usually slip yoke rear output, unless you get one from a Big Bronco. Watch out for problematic electric shift versions.

NP205 is famous for being bomb-proof, partially due to its chainless helical gear setup, and partially because it has a somewhat protective low gear ratio (1.96:1). Unlike the BW, it can easily be modified to give you front wheel drive only, Hi and Lo, and 2wd Low.
In your truck, you would install the NP205 and find that the front driveshaft is too long, and would mount a few inches closer to the center of driveline. This may or may not be a crossmember/exhaust problem for you. You also have to knotch out your transmission 4x4 tailhousing for the rear axle's shift rail, and its about 250 LBS. vs. about 80 LBS. BW, so adding another support at the NP205 is a must.

With either case, it is possible, and sounds needed, to clock the front output location downward to help with angles. Clocking it downward would also help any crossmember/exhaust/driveshaft clearance issues.

Hope that helps.


tjc transport 01-28-2012 06:55 AM

from my experience with friends and neighbors vehicles, the biggest problem with electric shift transfer cases is that they do not work when needed most.
without exaggerating i can honestly say i have replaced the shift motors at least 15 times on 6 vehicles.

swamper29 01-28-2012 09:43 AM

Agreed , I replaced mine once haven't had a problem with engagement yet , although currently the 2 lights for the push button do not work , and the plastic brackets that holds it to the dash snapped a few weeks ago, I tried to post on the parts section here to see if anyone has the full assembly but is says i am not allowed to

tjc transport 01-28-2012 10:40 AM

you need at least 25 posts to be able to post in the classifieds.

mando jake 01-30-2012 11:45 AM

The encoder motor is a definite weak point. Under the vehicle they are exposed to the elements. They also have small internal parts that are plastic and eventually wear, causing the encoder to basically "lose home position".

swamper29 01-30-2012 12:13 PM

Well mine is fixing to be put to the test , clocking it as low as possible , sticking a set of 5 ton rocks underneath and running a set of 66-43-25 Terra's until she blows

mando jake 01-30-2012 03:25 PM


Originally Posted by swamper29 (Post 11360302)
Well mine is fixing to be put to the test , clocking it as low as possible , sticking a set of 5 ton rocks underneath and running a set of 66-43-25 Terra's until she blows

You should really consider a doubler for a build like that.:-X06

alpha/omega 01-30-2012 06:55 PM

203/205 or 200 is the only way to go in that application...

fatdan460 01-30-2012 07:08 PM


Originally Posted by mando jake (Post 11360900)
You should really consider a doubler for a build like that.:-X06

:-down which you conveniently sell......did you ever get the "prototype doublers" out to the guys on pirate that paid you? :stirspot:

Originally Posted by alpha/omega (Post 11361825)
203/205 or 200 is the only way to go in that application...

truf! if it were my junk i'd go cheap and tough. married 205 to a divorced 200 clocked down.

swamper29 01-30-2012 07:22 PM

The problem with a doubler is I already have little space to work with being a single cab short bed. I am going to put a SCS 23" drop transfer case once I have the nerve to spend 4grand for it. But currently the tc works and when it breaks I will more than likely try a junkyard 205 first I should just do it right the first time but I have a wife that constantly nags about spending my hard earned $ on my toys so when we break down in the middle of a pond and she gets to get her new shoes all muddy then ill get my way : D

swamper29 01-30-2012 07:29 PM

Oh and my apologies to rollinblackcloud kinda jacked your thread

fatdan460 01-30-2012 07:30 PM

damn, didn't even notice your truck was a shorty in your avatar. 4k is crazy dumb money for one simple part. i'd look into a 2x trans with a divorced np200. should be somewhere pretty close in length compared to a married 205, and the 200 has a little more drop and can be clocked as much as you want. hell a divorced 205 would probably work just as good.


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