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-   -   Holley street dominator vs stock d5te 4bbr (https://www.ford-trucks.com/forums/1082662-holley-street-dominator-vs-stock-d5te-4bbr.html)

FossenRacing 07-12-2011 07:53 PM

Holley street dominator vs stock d5te 4bbr
 
I know the street dom is a better manifold for high rpm
does anyone have comparative graphs on these manifolds.
Its on a 390, with msd 7al, flowtech headers and street dom intake.
Its for my mud race truck and in stock class i can have 3 bolt ons.
If the manifolds are close up to 5800 rpm i will ditch the dominator in favor of another bolt on like electric waterpump
Running through a stock holley carb (570 i think)
Or should i run a edlebrock perf/rpm and sell both of my old manifolds?

Sleepy445FE 07-17-2011 07:13 PM

I would recommend Jay Browns Great FE Intake Comparo book. Everything you want to know about which intake is best for a given app. plus lots of other exhaust dyno, oiling, and compatability info.
In this case it's a no brainer though, the Holley SD is MUCH better than the factory "T" intake. The difference @5800 is almost 50hp.

You are pushing the limits of your 570? carb at those rpms though. A 600cfm autolite 4100 might do you a bit better. Still a stock piece.

If you're looking for a little more power you might consider an RV type cam with a smooth idle. No one will know if you keep it reasonable. The Lunati Voodoo lineup is pretty good at accomplishing this. Good idle quality for the lift and duration being that they use an asymmetrical cam lobe instead of the symmetrical lobe most others use.

Bear 45/70 07-17-2011 09:26 PM

The D5 intake is just the standard 390 "S" or "T" in your case intake. The stock 390s ran out of breathe by 5000 RPM.

FossenRacing 07-18-2011 08:51 AM


Originally Posted by Sleepy445FE (Post 10587696)
I would recommend Jay Browns Great FE Intake Comparo book. Everything you want to know about which intake is best for a given app. plus lots of other exhaust dyno, oiling, and compatability info.
In this case it's a no brainer though, the Holley SD is MUCH better than the factory "T" intake. The difference @5800 is almost 50hp.

You are pushing the limits of your 570? carb at those rpms though. A 600cfm autolite 4100 might do you a bit better. Still a stock piece.

If you're looking for a little more power you might consider an RV type cam with a smooth idle. No one will know if you keep it reasonable. The Lunati Voodoo lineup is pretty good at accomplishing this. Good idle quality for the lift and duration being that they use an asymmetrical cam lobe instead of the symmetrical lobe most others use.

I have thought of changing cam. But I've been running second for points all year and have a run on the leader. But can have a cam as long as it pulls 17 inches of vacuum and no more than 0.48 inch lift. But my truck is smoking the 460's, 454's, and 440's and I'm running the stock cam with .35 inch lift. They have tecked me in 4 times this year to see if I am cheating. Which I am not as I get more of a kick out of beating the cheaters by playin by the rules.

Rogue_Wulff 07-18-2011 09:11 AM

If you are winning the way it is, I wouldn't mess with it. In other words, it ain't broke, so don't try fixing it.....

The SD may not be the best intake for all purposes, but it seems to be working well for you. I suspect that it's a much better choice than a stocker, and the ~50 LBS weight difference also comes in handy...... Lifting it with one hand, or 2 men, the choice is yours. I know which route I'd choose.....

FossenRacing 07-18-2011 02:30 PM


Originally Posted by Rogue_Wulff (Post 10589781)
If you are winning the way it is, I wouldn't mess with it. In other words, it ain't broke, so don't try fixing it.....

The SD may not be the best intake for all purposes, but it seems to be working well for you. I suspect that it's a much better choice than a stocker, and the ~50 LBS weight difference also comes in handy...... Lifting it with one hand, or 2 men, the choice is yours. I know which route I'd choose.....

Exactly my thought. Will wait till the seasons over before I crank it up a notch. Unless some of the other trucks start preforming

Rogue_Wulff 07-18-2011 03:10 PM

Good plan. Just for kicks, I'll add this though. I have a performer sitting about 5 feet behind me. It's going on once I get up the nerve to tackle that ~80LB stocker. It's only a 2bbl, which is why I'm willing to tackle it in the first place. Of course, I do plan to use an engine hoist to lift that monster off.......
The heads will also be pulled using a hoist, if they have to come off. I value my back.....
The "new" intake is sitting on the box holding the new headers. Thank god I don't have a wife. I doubt one of those would approve of having parts in the middle of the living room. :-X04

Sleepy445FE 07-18-2011 04:17 PM


Originally Posted by FossenRacing (Post 10589680)
I have thought of changing cam. But I've been running second for points all year and have a run on the leader. But can have a cam as long as it pulls 17 inches of vacuum and no more than 0.48 inch lift. But my truck is smoking the 460's, 454's, and 440's and I'm running the stock cam with .35 inch lift. They have tecked me in 4 times this year to see if I am cheating. Which I am not as I get more of a kick out of beating the cheaters by playin by the rules.

I hear ya. If you're competing then I'd leave it for now. I prefer to do things by the rules as well, but in many cases it seems like everyone else is bending the rules a bit and the judges let it slide.
On another note, .350 lift is short of a stock cam. Maybe you were just guesstimating? I wasn't completely sure of the stock specs myself but a search turned up this thread https://www.ford-trucks.com/forums/5...cam-specs.html
check the link in post 7.
The .480 limit sucks. If it was just .005 more you would have a few more options and still be in the rules. As it stands, for future reference you could look at the
Crower #16238
Lunati # 06501
Compcams 252H
or you could call Ken at Oregon cams and have him custom grind one for you to just fit in the rules. If the other guys start to give you a run for, then I would say go the custom Oregon grind route and proceed to DOMINATE the class haha.

Way to represent the FE! :-headbang

FossenRacing 07-18-2011 05:55 PM


Originally Posted by Sleepy445FE (Post 10591809)
I hear ya. If you're competing then I'd leave it for now. I prefer to do things by the rules as well, but in many cases it seems like everyone else is bending the rules a bit and the judges let it slide.
On another note, .350 lift is short of a stock cam. Maybe you were just guesstimating? I wasn't completely sure of the stock specs myself but a search turned up this thread https://www.ford-trucks.com/forums/5...cam-specs.html
check the link in post 7.
The .480 limit sucks. If it was just .005 more you would have a few more options and still be in the rules. As it stands, for future reference you could look at the
Crower #16238
Lunati # 06501
Compcams 252H
or you could call Ken at Oregon cams and have him custom grind one for you to just fit in the rules. If the other guys start to give you a run for, then I would say go the custom Oregon grind route and proceed to DOMINATE the class haha.

Way to represent the FE! :-headbang

Yah I am the only one in the club with a fe block.
When I first started racing the announcer( big chev fan) made fun of my truck with a mustang motor and a 2 inch lift, 3.55 and 31 inch tires. But after I smoked a 454 with a 6 inch lift, 4.11gears and 37 inch tires that were to wide I gained his respect. And he always brags my truck up now.
When I heard say " truck with mustang motor" I called the truck Nightmare.

Sleepy445FE 07-18-2011 06:46 PM

A lot of Chevy guys don't even know what an FE is. lol At least he knew it was offered in mustangs. I guess a 428cj is just a little mustang motor too. The FE (SOHC 657hp) is the highest hp domestic engine ever offered, not to mention it's dominance at LeMans before the rule change limited cid. It should be talked about as a legend. We gets no respects, no respects I tells ya! lol

Reps for showing the crowd (and announcer) that the FE is still alive and winning!

Rogue_Wulff 07-18-2011 07:04 PM

A 390 was plenty enough for McQueen in "Bullitt", and that's good enough for me.

The guys with 460's and 454's think displacement is all they need, but they never consider the racing heritage of the FE.

Rogue_Wulff 07-18-2011 07:20 PM

One suggestion I will toss out for when it comes time to freshen up the lower end. Swap the 390 pistons for 360 pistons. Worth about a 1.5 bump in the CR.
The best part is, they're *technically* stock 390 pistons, from you guessed it, a mustang......
If they wanna call it a "mustang motor", why not make it more like a real mustang engine with a CR in the 9's.......
More static CR = higher pressure before combustion = higher pressure after combustion. Bigger "bang", more power. It all works to make more power, even with a stock or near stock cam.

FossenRacing 07-19-2011 12:49 PM


Originally Posted by Sleepy445FE (Post 10591809)
I hear ya. If you're competing then I'd leave it for now. I prefer to do things by the rules as well, but in many cases it seems like everyone else is bending the rules a bit and the judges let it slide.
On another note, .350 lift is short of a stock cam. Maybe you were just guesstimating? I wasn't completely sure of the stock specs myself but a search turned up this thread https://www.ford-trucks.com/forums/5...cam-specs.html
check the link in post 7.
The .480 limit sucks. If it was just .005 more you would have a few more options and still be in the rules. As it stands, for future reference you could look at the
Crower #16238
Lunati # 06501
Compcams 252H
or you could call Ken at Oregon cams and have him custom grind one for you to just fit in the rules. If the other guys start to give you a run for, then I would say go the custom Oregon grind route and proceed to DOMINATE the class haha.

Way to represent the FE! :-headbang

The measurement was done by a safety/tech and pro mod racer so it was kinda a guess. He had a pro tool but had to use a magnet to mount.
If I go over by 0.005 I can live with it.
I also found a lunati 10503 cam. It's a 3000 to 6000 rpm cam. But what would it take off from the line with a stock tc and no stall.
And what would a custom grind cost?

Sleepy445FE 07-19-2011 01:19 PM

The lunati 10503 is their version of the factory GT/CJ cam. A lot of people really like it that have mild street/strip cars. I'd say you'd need a tq converter to match your cams rpm range.
I'm not sure on exact pricing over at Oregon cams. Everybody always just says they're very reasonable and competitive. I know it was like 175 back in 2004. I haven't heard a complaint yet about them. The owner (Ken) is an FE guy too so he'll set you up right. I plan to use them on the next fe sitting in the garage.

FossenRacing 07-19-2011 03:02 PM


Originally Posted by Rogue_Wulff (Post 10592696)
One suggestion I will toss out for when it comes time to freshen up the lower end. Swap the 390 pistons for 360 pistons. Worth about a 1.5 bump in the CR.
The best part is, they're *technically* stock 390 pistons, from you guessed it, a mustang......
If they wanna call it a "mustang motor", why not make it more like a real mustang engine with a CR in the 9's.......
More static CR = higher pressure before combustion = higher pressure after combustion. Bigger "bang", more power. It all works to make more power, even with a stock or near stock cam.

My motor is a stock truck 4bbl so are they the same as car pistons. And there is a lot of confusion in that thread about what the actual comp height is.
Any of you actually used them and had them work

Rogue_Wulff 07-19-2011 03:21 PM

All the truck engines, particularly in the 70's, got the lower comp pistons.
Dad's truck has a factory GT/CJ cam and 360 pistons, running a stock converter in the C6, but the trans has been tweaked internally a bit.... I like it.....

FossenRacing 07-20-2011 01:17 PM


Originally Posted by Rogue_Wulff (Post 10596373)
All the truck engines, particularly in the 70's, got the lower comp pistons.
Dad's truck has a factory GT/CJ cam and 360 pistons, running a stock converter in the C6, but the trans has been tweaked internally a bit.... I like it.....

What does it pull like out of the hole.
I want to run this cam as it's a stock replacement.
Does the motor have decent power and torque in the under 3000 rpm?
Cause if I ran this cam I could use my Holley sd. Or maybe a dove 1x4 high-rise and mod my heads to fit( if possible)

Sleepy445FE 07-20-2011 02:42 PM

In the quest for more power...

If you are still running the stock 73 and later timing set the cam will be retarded like 4°. Get either a factory timing set for any fe prior to this (or an aftermarket one and set it straight up) and you'll see a noticeable gain.
You could also recurve your distributor to allow you to bump up the initial timing and improve it's running characteristics. You may or may not know this already but you can't just advance the initial timing without knowing what total advance you're at. If you are going to up the initial, you need to recurve. Check the link in the tech articles sticky at the top of the forum for an awesome detailed (w/pics) instruction of how to recurve the duraspark.

FossenRacing 07-20-2011 03:16 PM


Originally Posted by Sleepy445FE (Post 10600502)
In the quest for more power...

If you are still running the stock 73 and later timing set the cam will be retarded like 4°. Get either a factory timing set for any fe prior to this (or an aftermarket one and set it straight up) and you'll see a noticeable gain.
You could also recurve your distributor to allow you to bump up the initial timing and improve it's running characteristics. You may or may not know this already but you can't just advance the initial timing without knowing what total advance you're at. If you are going to up the initial, you need to recurve. Check the link in the tech articles sticky at the top of the forum for an awesome detailed (w/pics) instruction of how to recurve the duraspark.

I bought a reman distributor and It was set at 18L and I pulled apart a 351 dist and threw in a 10L but it seams there may be more to it than I thought. I have been on the road for last few week on the rigs. So will be giving some reports when I get home. But Your right. I need to learn my motors timing before trying to squeeze the thing for every extra horse.

Rogue_Wulff 07-20-2011 04:41 PM


Originally Posted by FossenRacing (Post 10600208)
What does it pull like out of the hole.
I want to run this cam as it's a stock replacement.
Does the motor have decent power and torque in the under 3000 rpm?
Cause if I ran this cam I could use my Holley sd. Or maybe a dove 1x4 high-rise and mod my heads to fit( if possible)

It used to pull pretty decent right off idle. Currently, not so great, thanks to the carb needing rebuilt and the 3.00 gears he swapped in, in a fruitless attempt at getting a bit better MPG. New plug wires, points, and condensor will also be needed to get it back to running it's best. However, I drove it a couple days ago, and when I stepped on the throttle, it hesitated like normal, then lit up the rear tires drawing LOTS of attention...

As for the under 3K part, I'd venture to guess it hasn't exceeded 3K by much, with that stock 2 bbl carb on it, along with the stock exhaust manifolds. It never had any issues showing taillights to those "454 SS" trucks that GM sold a few years back.
The current carb is still the factory 2 bbl, but I have a performer intake and performer 600 carb ready to go on. I also still have the factory 3.25 pumpkin, and have a 3.50 pumpkin held back for me by a freind. Just have to decide which pumpkin to swap in. The headers may wait a bit though.

Good luck finding a true stock CJ/GT cam though. It was "Obsolete" back in the 80's, when dad got ahold of one the last ones known to still exist, according to the Ford parts finder.... It helped that he worked at a dealer, and had a factory rep to assist in locating and getting it sent to him.
Perhaps there's an aftermarket company that offers one close to the same specs.... :-huh

FossenRacing 07-21-2011 08:31 AM


Originally Posted by Rogue_Wulff (Post 10600922)
It used to pull pretty decent right off idle. Currently, not so great, thanks to the carb needing rebuilt and the 3.00 gears he swapped in, in a fruitless attempt at getting a bit better MPG. New plug wires, points, and condensor will also be needed to get it back to running it's best. However, I drove it a couple days ago, and when I stepped on the throttle, it hesitated like normal, then lit up the rear tires drawing LOTS of attention...

As for the under 3K part, I'd venture to guess it hasn't exceeded 3K by much, with that stock 2 bbl carb on it, along with the stock exhaust manifolds. It never had any issues showing taillights to those "454 SS" trucks that GM sold a few years back.
The current carb is still the factory 2 bbl, but I have a performer intake and performer 600 carb ready to go on. I also still have the factory 3.25 pumpkin, and have a 3.50 pumpkin held back for me by a freind. Just have to decide which pumpkin to swap in. The headers may wait a bit though.

Good luck finding a true stock CJ/GT cam though. It was "Obsolete" back in the 80's, when dad got ahold of one the last ones known to still exist, according to the Ford parts finder.... It helped that he worked at a dealer, and had a factory rep to assist in locating and getting it sent to him.
Perhaps there's an aftermarket company that offers one close to the same specs.... :-huh

I found a lunati with the same specs. Since I run 4low I rev the truck pretty high.

Rogue_Wulff 07-21-2011 12:45 PM


Originally Posted by FossenRacing (Post 10603499)
I found a lunati with the same specs. Since I run 4low I rev the truck pretty high.

If it has the same specs as the factory GT/CJ cam, I bet you'll like it. That cam was tame enough to handle an auto trans and power brakes, but still made good power and torque. The lift is going to be just a bit more than what you listed as the maximum, but it sounds like they aren't using a very accurate way of measuring it.
Of course, there's always the "stock replacement" arguement that could be used, if the specs truely are the same as the stock GT390 bumpstick. Naturally, this cam, or nearly any other, will give much better results with the CR bumped into the 9's. I think the GT390 was actually closer to 10-10.5:1, but that's getting into premium fuel requirement range. (E85 anyone?)


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