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Thinking About An Official Petition To Bring Back The Manual Transmission...

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Thinking About An Official Petition To Bring Back The Manual Transmission...

 
  #31  
Old 05-05-2010, 11:51 AM
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Originally Posted by Ak Ronnie View Post
I am still on the fence waiting to hear more positive comments about the new Auto Transmission. I like having a Manual for safety reasons in tricky driving situations ie keeping the lower gear going down or up a slippery hill without shifting or shifting when I want to avoid breaking traction and loosing it. Will the new Auto hold up to shifting manually on the fly or is it a copy of existing Auto Trannies, which I despise.
The torqueshift auto does everything you just described in tow haul mode
 
  #32  
Old 07-27-2010, 05:04 AM
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Originally Posted by EpicCowlick View Post
Sorry John, I wouldn't sign it. I think Ford is doing the right thing by phasing out obsolete technology.
How do you figure its obsolete? They make the Mustang with a stick still...
Originally Posted by EpicCowlick View Post
The new auto trans's are so superior to what they used to be, it's no wonder that 99% of buyers prefer them.
I don't care how great and fancy the new auto is. There are two obvious issues here: 1. It costs more to maintain. 2. It cost more to repair.
Originally Posted by EpicCowlick View Post
It would be costly for Ford to maintain a manual trans option and the related design, build, support, parts, expertise, and everything else when the market simply doesn't want it anymore (well, 99% of the market anyway). It's just a good business decision and strengthens Ford overall as a company to cut off the old, unwanted programs. Let's face it, John, the 1% take rate means you're a rare bird.
I am a mad bird . I want a manual to come back... How do you think they went about bringing it back mid-year in '08? I'd like to know what went on there.
 
  #33  
Old 07-28-2010, 07:46 PM
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Originally Posted by F350JOHN View Post
I am a mad bird . I want a manual to come back...
I'm with you.



No it doesn't get old. I like complaining about not having the option to buy what I want. I'd even be willing to pay extra for it.
 
  #34  
Old 07-28-2010, 08:10 PM
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Originally Posted by F350JOHN View Post
I don't care how great and fancy the new auto is. There are two obvious issues here: 1. It costs more to maintain. 2. It cost more to repair.

...
yes, for YOU.. but for FORD it costs MILLIONS less dollars to NOT provide a transmission choice that few selected. Everybody had to pay THAT cost.

they spent a lot of work to try to mitigate as many of the complaints that customers like you might express, but at the end of the day, its a business decision.. with an EXPECTED loss of customers, offset by a huge reduction in costs..

fleet customers (clearly the largest volume) asked for auto trannys, cause their employee pool (youngens) didn't know how to drive sticks..

Sam
 
  #35  
Old 07-28-2010, 08:27 PM
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Originally Posted by sdetweil View Post
(youngens) didn't know how to drive sticks..
And many of them don't know how to pull their pants up either. That doesn't mean I'll just accept the fact that everyone should wear their pants that way. I sure won't.
 
  #36  
Old 07-28-2010, 08:47 PM
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Originally Posted by F350-6 View Post
And many of them don't know how to pull their pants up either. That doesn't mean I'll just accept the fact that everyone should wear their pants that way. I sure won't.
I understand.. You may be one of the customers Ford calculated they would lose... unfortunately..

As I recall, about 2% selected manual trans.. if they made 250,000 over the lifetime, that would be 5,000. If 10% of THOSE customers walked away.. we are talking about 500 sales over 250,000 vehicles. If profit was 10,000/sale, then they gave up 5 mil in profit, but cost was probably 100-150 mil over the lifetime (sales +7 yrs for parts), development, test, parts design, servicability, manufacturing training, sales system feature code, order mgmt, supply chain,

only 5000 of some part is pretty low on any suppliers list..
plus cab fitment, pedals, carpet, you name it.. probably 500 parts are different in the cab and engine mgmt.. so the ripple gets big fast..

and there is the positive offset.. those customers that WANTED auto, but wanted more control.. before Ford wasn't a choice.. now they are..

Sam
 
  #37  
Old 07-28-2010, 08:57 PM
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That's a better argument Sam. One I can accept, but will still complain about every chance I get.

I've also heard rumors that it was done to help meet emissions regulations since the shift patterns could be controlled. I doubt that's true, but I'll take a conspiracy theory over the thought that Ford has just written me off.
 
  #38  
Old 07-28-2010, 09:08 PM
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I don't think they 'wrote you off', I think they are disappointed that their hard work on the manual features of the new auto couldn't hold you as a customer.. they anticipated a small amount of rejection.. so.. YOU rejected them.. they didn't reject you..!..

I'm sure there were lots of 'costs' calculated into the decision, maybe emissions was involved too.. certainly testing lots of different configurations adds to the cost.

Sam
 
  #39  
Old 07-28-2010, 10:18 PM
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Personally, leave the manuals for somthing sporty, such as a Miata, personally I will thank FORD if it never offers a manual again in these trucks. What a waste of knee and arm* joints performing a mindless task better served by a machine. Of course I live close to a big city and after 2-3 hours of inching along in bumper to bumper traffic I am just plain sore from a manual. If I lived in the midwest things might be a little different!

*Bad shoulder from years of shifting trucks - one surgery down, nothing more to be done, the joint is just flat wore out from over use.

Besides, a modern auto will do everything a manual can do, and do it smoother and better (including returing superior MPG in many cases) except for one thing, if your battery is charged and your starter just decides to take a dump, then you can't roll/push start the truck, but then I have yet have a total starter failure without warning signs, and I am 51 years old.

And this from a guy who carries a CDL - and yes, I HATE to shift big rigs as well. Thank the gods that we are finally coming out of the model T age and autos / auto shifts are becoming more widespread.

My very last FORD with a manual was a 1983 F250 6.9 4 spd, with gear gaps (the gaps were so wide that you could drive a Fiesta between the gears!) that you could not get past pulling a load and the four speed was missing at least 3 gears to be a progressive clutchless box (reads - minimum of a 7 speed) After that POS of a transmission, I swore NEVER again for a manual in any FORD truck.

Ford, please make mine a automatic only - don't waste any R&D or time engineering a manual setup! IMO - David! - OTHERS to there own opinion!
 
  #40  
Old 07-29-2010, 10:44 AM
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Good points. I understand that it is a business decision. However, I diasgree that adding a manual would be a major burden, its just a pedal cage, a hole in the floor board and a different pigtail on the wireing harness to allow for a neutral safety switch and back up lights. Of corse the colsole that goes to the seats would be a little different... Minor things in my eyes, but I understand that they would incur a bit of R&D cost to make it work.

I also understand that as a culture fewer and fewer people have ever drivin a stick. I'm 27 and 1 out of approx. 30 of my friends have ever tried, no one knows how...kinda scary I think...but on the other side of the token people will be less likely to steal your truck if its a manual.

I suppose theres more to it than meets the eye also when you consider that Ford doesn't have faith in their new 6.7L enough to offer it in the heavy line of commercial trucks. If you click on this link and hit the "powertrain" tab once your there you will see that the Cummins is the only thing offered... (very pathetic of Ford ) But hey at least with the Cummins theres 3 different manual transmissions offered and 2 different autos.

LINK:
Vehicle Specifications and Options - Ford Commercial Trucks

But then again thats treading into a whole different debate of: "If Ford offered a Cummins in the F-250 to F-550..."

They would sell very few 6.7L PSD engines...
 
  #41  
Old 07-29-2010, 10:51 AM
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Ah, the Mighty Cummins myth. Over-rated and under-powered in my book. I had a '09 Dodge with a Cummins start to pass me in the fast lane going up a long mountain pass on I-80 east of Evanston, Wyoming. He was rolling coal pulling about a 5,000 lb trailer and I could hear the engine through my rolled-up window. Just for fun, I stepped into the go pedal and pulled away like no one's business. I was pulling 11K lbs. No smoke, no noise, just incredible acceleration up a steep road. He finally passed me a couple of minutes later when I allowed him to. So much for the Mighty Cummins...
 
  #42  
Old 07-29-2010, 10:58 AM
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Originally Posted by EpicCowlick View Post
Ah, the Mighty Cummins myth. Over-rated and under-powered in my book. I had a '09 Dodge with a Cummins start to pass me in the fast lane going up a long mountain pass on I-80 east of Evanston, Wyoming. He was rolling coal pulling about a 5,000 lb trailer and I could hear the engine through my rolled-up window. Just for fun, I stepped into the go pedal and pulled away like no one's business. I was pulling 11K lbs. No smoke, no noise, just incredible acceleration up a steep road. He finally passed me a couple of minutes later when I allowed him to. So much for the Mighty Cummins...
Honestly it would be a tough decision for me:

A fully loaded 6.7L PSD 6-speed crew cab 4x4 or a 6.7L Cummins crew cab...

I would most likely still take the PSD in all honesty.

Why does Ford mention their "commercial type bellhousing" on the new 6.7L if they only offer an auto?
 
  #43  
Old 07-29-2010, 11:10 AM
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Quote from pickuptrucks.com:

"Ford officially says the standard manual transmission is gone as of the 2011 model year. The take rate was too low to justify continuing production of the ZF-source 6-speed handshaker. The rear cover of the new engine follows an SAE 12 bolt standard that allows Ford to mate almost any HD transmission to the back of the mill."

 
  #44  
Old 07-31-2010, 12:02 AM
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Whew, I thought I was having a nightmare and this great site had turned into RVNET.
 
  #45  
Old 07-31-2010, 06:31 AM
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Originally Posted by rickatic View Post
Whew, I thought I was having a nightmare and this great site had turned into RVNET.
Which part are you in reference to?
 

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