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  #1  
Old 01-15-2010, 10:09 PM
1912barry 1912barry is offline
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5w20 or 5w30????

my owners man says to use a 5w20 oil in the engine but the sticker under the hood says to use a 5w30. Whats the deal here? Its a 2000 5.4 F150.
Allso its got 105k on it now if that matters.
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  #2  
Old 01-16-2010, 09:51 AM
pawpaw pawpaw is online now
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You may be able to use either viscosity.

Don't know where you live, what your drive cycle is like, mostly short trip, around town, high speed highway, towing, carrying heavy loads up long grades, off road, ect, ect, so your drive cycle, local conditions & engine condition should be considered in your choice of crankcase lube, along with the info in this TSB.
02-1-9***ENGINE - ENGINE OIL - RECOMMENDED APPLICATIONS FOR SAE 5W-20 AND SAE 5W-30 MOTOR OILS - GASOLINE AND FLEXIBLE FUEL VEHICLES ONLY

Scroll down & see if your 5.4 is back specified to be able to use 5w-20 & if so, you can use 5W-20, or if your particular 5.4L engine configuration isn't listed, or you have an engine in another vehicle thats on the Exclusion list use 5W-30!!!!

For instance I have a 3.8L Taurus, that origonally had 5W-30 specified, but is now back specified to be able to use 5W-20, so I can use either viscosity.

I also have a 4.0L Ranger that origonally had 5W-30 specified & it IS on the EXCLUSION list, that is NOT to use 5W-20, because it's oil pump hasn't been upgraded to be able to supply the needed flow at operating temp, of the lower viscosity 5W-20, so I'm to continue using 5W-30 in it.

So if for instance you can use either viscosity oil & live where it's really cold, maybe consider using the 5W-20 in winter & in summer if you do a lot of towing, or hauling, or long high speed freeway runs with a load, or long hard mountain pulls, or it uses a little oil when using the 5W-20 in hot weather, maybe consider using 5W-30.

A bunch of thoughts to ponder.
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  #3  
Old 01-16-2010, 06:06 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 1912barry View Post
my owners man says to use a 5w20 oil in the engine but the sticker under the hood says to use a 5w30. Whats the deal here? Its a 2000 5.4 F150.
Allso its got 105k on it now if that matters.
You can use either. It will not matter.

Buy whatever is on sale/cheapest.
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Old 01-17-2010, 08:29 AM
1912barry 1912barry is offline
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Originally Posted by pawpaw View Post
You may be able to use either viscosity.

Don't know where you live, what your drive cycle is like, mostly short trip, around town, high speed highway, towing, carrying heavy loads up long grades, off road, ect, ect, so your drive cycle, local conditions & engine condition should be considered in your choice of crankcase lube, along with the info in this TSB.
02-1-9***ENGINE - ENGINE OIL - RECOMMENDED APPLICATIONS FOR SAE 5W-20 AND SAE 5W-30 MOTOR OILS - GASOLINE AND FLEXIBLE FUEL VEHICLES ONLY

Scroll down & see if your 5.4 is back specified to be able to use 5w-20 & if so, you can use 5W-20, or if your particular 5.4L engine configuration isn't listed, or you have an engine in another vehicle thats on the Exclusion list use 5W-30!!!!

For instance I have a 3.8L Taurus, that origonally had 5W-30 specified, but is now back specified to be able to use 5W-20, so I can use either viscosity.

I also have a 4.0L Ranger that origonally had 5W-30 specified & it IS on the EXCLUSION list, that is NOT to use 5W-20, because it's oil pump hasn't been upgraded to be able to supply the needed flow at operating temp, of the lower viscosity 5W-20, so I'm to continue using 5W-30 in it.

So if for instance you can use either viscosity oil & live where it's really cold, maybe consider using the 5W-20 in winter & in summer if you do a lot of towing, or hauling, or long high speed freeway runs with a load, or long hard mountain pulls, or it uses a little oil when using the 5W-20 in hot weather, maybe consider using 5W-30.

A bunch of thoughts to ponder.
I live down here in Texas but it has been very cold the last few weeks, I had just changed the oil when i had gotten the truck but befor i had down loaded the owners manual and seen that it says 5w20. The 5w20 seems like it would be kinda thin for a V8 truck even in winter. Most of my driving will be highway (43 miles one way to work) and only towing a trailer during hunting season. I put 5w30 in it cause that was what i saw on the sticker. Just didnt want to screw anything up.
I have driven Fords all my life but this is the first one with this new fandangled engine!!!!
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  #5  
Old 01-17-2010, 10:53 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 1912barry View Post
I have driven Fords all my life but this is the first one with this new fandangled engine!!!!
The engine is the same. It is the oil that is different. 5w-20 could give you better gas mileage. It took a while for Ford to develop a spec for 5w-20 that it was comfortable with long term. Once the oil was out, Ford started recommending it in all of its engines. You can use either one, your engine is not going to explode.

A 5w-30 is all that you need, as a 5w-20 does not provide any advantage in the "cold" weather we get in TX. 5w-30 is also generally cheaper because it is more widely available in generic form.

PS - It got 13* last week in the DFW area. Cold is relative. 13* is cold for TX, but not really cold.
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Old 01-17-2010, 10:56 AM
pawpaw pawpaw is online now
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5w-30 is fine for your service & is what I decided to remain with in my Taurus 3.8L, that was origionally specified to use 5w-30, even though Ford says in their 02-1-9 TSB that I could now use 5W-20 in it if I wanted too.

Motorcrafts 5W-20 has been tested in vehicles in the hot US SW, so it's capable of taking the heat & might offer up a little better on the road mpg for you, as it's pumping losses would likely be a little lower. So if you later decide to try it, do so with confidence.

If your still in doubt & concerned about the 5W-20 film strength producing wear in your V8, just visit Bob-Is-The-Oil-Guy site & have a read on Motorcraft 5W-20 in the UOA thread, in engines like yours, in various parts of the country, under all kinds of driving conditions.

The Motorcraft lubes produce very low wear numbers & are well thought of, so their recipe has produced good wear results in all kinds of engines, in all kinds of driving conditions.

If your still in doubt about the 5W-20 in your engine, maybe consider using one of our site sponsors, like Blackstone Labs, to do a $20 UOA (Used Oil Analisis), with the 5W-30, then switch to the 5W-20 under the same driving conditions & for the same length of time, then do another UOA & compare the two for wear numbers.

But you could save your UOA money to buy more oil, as Ford has already done all this, before they put the TSB out, that back specified the list of engines on the TSB that could use 5W-20, as well as the engines on the Exclusion list!!!!

More thoughts to ponder.
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  #7  
Old 01-17-2010, 12:13 PM
1912barry 1912barry is offline
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PAWPAW Your making my brain work too hard! lol
I wonder how much difference the MPG's would be using a 5w20?
I am getting about 16 right now on the highway with the 5w30.
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Old 01-17-2010, 01:35 PM
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Well our trucks have all the aerodynamics of a danged four wheeled brick & the 5W-30 engine lube is pretty good, so not knowing who's crankcase lube your now using, we're likely splitting hairs here, so I wouldn't expect more than .5-1.5 mpg better highway mpg changing to a 5W-20 & not likely any better around town mpg improvement.

If Ford could demonstrate a .5 mpg improvement in their fleet cafe numbers, just by changing most of it's fleet to a 5W-20 lube, that would be a BIG deal for them.

So developing a lower viscosity crankcase lube, that could be used across the fleet, in most of their engines, would likely be less costly to develope & be easier to implement, than all sorts of other changes to all of those engines, to prove the same mpg gain.

SO, they needed to develope a lighter weight engine lube, with enough film strength & other needed properties & to be able to hold up to the beating it would get in a number of different engines, from old slow turning push rod types, to high rpm, single & double over head cam type engines, that owners might choose to take out an extended warranty on, so the lube neeed to cause those engines to last at least that long, without undue extended warranty payout risk!!!!!

SO the 5w-20 recipe had to be pretty danged robust, to provide protection for at least the eight years of an extended warranty & how many of us, besides me, keep a vehicle longer than that!!!!????
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Old 01-17-2010, 02:59 PM
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First you make this statement:

Quote:
Originally Posted by pawpaw View Post
so I wouldn't expect more than .5-1.5 mpg better highway mpg changing to a 5W-20 & not likely any better around town mpg improvement.
Then you make this statement:

Quote:
Originally Posted by pawpaw View Post
If Ford could demonstrate a .5 mpg improvement . . . .
So let's face it. You are making all this up. Unless you have hard data, please don't guess.

I say again. Buy what is on sale. Use the savings to take your wife to dinner. You will get better mileage from the dinner than you will sweating over the oil.
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Old 01-17-2010, 04:04 PM
pawpaw pawpaw is online now
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Well to switch most of the fleet over to a 5w-20, Ford had to demonstrate an "average" cafe number improvement, so some engines might not get any better mpg & some might get more than .5 mpg, so whatever they got, was averaged over the fleet.

SO, due to the switch to a lower viscosity engine lube to get improved averaged fleet mpg, they needed to be sure they wouldn't incur increased engine warranty claims over at least the eight years an extended warranty can run, so the 5W-20 needed to make an engine last at least that long, without impacting their warranty profits.

The type & condition of our engine, the way we drive, the local conditions, weather included, mandated fuel recipe, ect, ALL figure in on whether we in the real world will see any mpg improvement or not, by changing to a lower viscosity crankcase lube.

I've gotten 1.8-2.2 more mpg using Havoline synthetic 5W-30, over their dino 5W-30, in the same engine, traveling to the same destination (about 375 miles round tip), over the same road, at the same posted speed limits, running the same brand & octane gas, filling up before the trip & refilling from the same station & pump, facing the same way & having the pump fill at the same rate & cut off the same number of times.
In other words I tried to eliminate as many variables as possible, when I did the test.

So, for me it's been possible to demonstrate an ALL over the road mpg improvement, just by changing lube type, from dino to synthetic Havoline, in my 99 Rangers 4.0L pushrod engine.

Now while using the synthetic Havoline, I was Never able to measure an increase in city mpg!!!!

Since most of my driving is in the city, I choose not to use a synthetic engine oil, as to date I haven't been able to measure any improvement in city mpg while using the synthetic Havoline.

Never done a UOA, so I don't know if there is any difference in engine wear or not.

Right now I speculate the mpg impovement with the synthetic, may be mostly due to improved cylinder ring sealing, improved pumping losses & maybe better anti-friction ads in the oil.

BUT, if most of my driving were highway, I'd sure consider using a synthetic crank case lube in this vehicle & this engine type, as long as it continued to improve my highway mpg.

Will 1912barry get better mpg with a semi-synthetic 5W-20, over a 5W-30 in his engine type, I don't know, but Ford says he can use either viscosity, so it's up to him to do the test.
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Old 01-17-2010, 04:22 PM
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Well to switch most of the fleet over to a 5w-20, Ford had to demonstrate an "average" cafe number improvement, so some engines might not get any better mpg & some might get more than .5 mpg, so whatever they got, was averaged over the fleet.
In theory, the thinner oil should get better MPGs. Whether it does or does not, in a specific application, is pure speculation.

Now the extra money you pay at the cash register, in search of that speculative MPG increase, is hard and fast cash out of pocket. No speculation involved at all. It's real money.

So spending real money for a wish and a prayer that it maybe might result in an unquantifiable increase in MPGs is the petroleum equivalent of buying a lottery ticket.

You want an absolutely free, well-documented and certifiable way to increase your MPGs? Try slowing down. A mere 5 mph decrease in speed (65 vs. 70) gains me at least 1 MPG in both my Ram CTD and my 97 Expedition 4.6L.

But, spending hours fretting over oil is seen as a good use of time, whereas arriving at your destination 10 minutes later is seen as a waste of time.
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Old 01-17-2010, 05:17 PM
pawpaw pawpaw is online now
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Why not do both & double our pleasure!!!! lol

In my area Motorcraft 5W-20 & 5W-30 cost the same, so there is likely no cost impact for 1912 barry to do a test.

When I did my Havoline synthetic test, it was when Big Lots had the stuff on a clearance sale before their Deposit Shield recipe hit the market, so it didn't cost me any more per qt, to do my test with synthetic.

I agree, slowing down will surely yield better mpg & splitting hairs over which lube, or viscosity will yield the best mpg in our particular engine, while producing the lowest wear numbers, isn't likey the best use of time, or our money, as Ford has already done most of that work for us!!!!

Getting back to 1912barry's question, "I wonder how much difference the mpg's would be using 5W-20", over the 5W-30 he's using now???? The answer is still likely not much, maybe .5-1.5 mpg, but at todays & tomorrows fuel prices, maybe it's worth it for him over the long haul????

The more fuel costs & the greater our driving distance, the more an increase in mpg is worth!!!!

Ford says he can use the 5W-20 in his engine, so at his next OCI he could do a test, by changing viscosity, that wouldn't cost him any more money to do & he could safely answer his mpg question with a little record keeping.
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Old 01-17-2010, 07:33 PM
1912barry 1912barry is offline
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In theory, the thinner oil should get better MPGs. Whether it does or does not, in a specific application, is pure speculation.

Now the extra money you pay at the cash register, in search of that speculative MPG increase, is hard and fast cash out of pocket. No speculation involved at all. It's real money.

So spending real money for a wish and a prayer that it maybe might result in an unquantifiable increase in MPGs is the petroleum equivalent of buying a lottery ticket.

You want an absolutely free, well-documented and certifiable way to increase your MPGs? Try slowing down. A mere 5 mph decrease in speed (65 vs. 70) gains me at least 1 MPG in both my Ram CTD and my 97 Expedition 4.6L.

But, spending hours fretting over oil is seen as a good use of time, whereas arriving at your destination 10 minutes later is seen as a waste of time.
When i went to the store to get the oil last week there was no price difference between the two oils, unless it was a synthetic or a blend. I dont believe that a synthetic will make enough difference in MPG's to offset the higher cost so that will go out the window for me. My original question was about the recomendations by Ford and how there was a contridiction from the owners manual and the Factory sticker thats under the hood. I didnt have the origanal owners manual that came in the truck as i purchased the truck just a week ago and it wasnt there so i down loaded one off a link that some one had left me on this forum and thats when i decided to ask this question about the 5w20 in the manual and the 5w30 on the sticker. I am learning daily here with all this very good info, I am all ears.
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Old 01-17-2010, 10:09 PM
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Well lets think about this a little more.
The vehicle is a 2000 model, so when it was manufactured, 5W-30 was the specified crankcase lube & thats why the underhood sticker calls for it.

The oil TSB link I posted above, came out in Jan-9-02.
When you recently downloaded the owners guide, it had been updated to include the 5W-20 info in the Jan-9-02 TSB.

SO you can use either viscosity in your 5.4L.
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Old 01-18-2010, 06:12 AM
1912barry 1912barry is offline
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Sounds good to me.
I guess i will use the 5w20 in the winter and 5w30 in the Texas summer.
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