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2000 Ranger - "typical" clutch, slave, MC issues

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Old 01-22-2009, 07:18 PM
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2000 Ranger - "typical" clutch, slave, MC issues

Okay, where to start....

15 months ago or so, I began having difficulty shifting gears on my 2000 Ranger 2.5, to the point that it was basically not drivable. I suspected the clutch at that time was getting long in the tooth, as well as potentially the normal related parts, IE, the MC and the Slave.

So, fresh off of getting all the parts including a pilot bearing, new throwout bearing, I went ahead and did the job. Upon removing the parts it was apparent, that my clutch still had a little life left to it and so I now suspected that the Master or Slave was the root cause of the shifting issues. I want to say that my Master Cylinder did not come with any particular instructions so far as "bench bleeding" (I blame that one on NAPA). SO, I assembled and torqued everything down correctly to spec..

Having bled many sports cars and other trucks through the years, my father and I had a time of it getting that clutch to feel stiff at all. At some point it was good enough that it would shift gears, though looking back, even then, it was not perfect. The truck was driven for a year thereafter and was never so bad that I paid it much mind.

This was until it got very cold this December. At this point, the truck would not shift gears into first or reverse, unless I pumped the hell out of it repeatedly to "build the pressure up". I checked the reservoir, and yes, it appeared to be low - but not what you would call "dry" whatsoever.

I limped the truck to Louisiana from Tennessee, put it in the family barn, and resolved to fix the problem. My father and I again tried to bleed the old fashioned hose and glass baby food jar method that has worked countless times. Again - no luck and now - the clutch pedal is lighter than even before. Now, no matter of pumping the pedal even builds any pressure at all.

I become convinced that being not fully bled to begin with combined with the incessant pumping, I was certain that I had likely destroyed the Master Cylinder or had a bad one to begin with. So, I went and exchanged this lifetime guarantee MC for a new one. This time, the box has some nice little instructions about the MC not being able to be bled on the vehicle - and that it must be "bench bled". WT_, was my original reaction and I am "not" amused, that this was missing from the original MC I had bought at the same store, not to mention the Haynes last resort manual, made no mention of this either.

So we bench bled this - per the instructions, I installed and low and behold it shifted perfectly.....for about 2 weeks.

Upon getting back to Tennessee, all of a sudden and without warning, I am now again with a paper light clutch pedal which is so bad I must start the car in 1st gear and shove the lever into the other gears. I don't bother even with trying reverse.

It does not appear I have lost any fluid at all - or very little. I do notice some grayish rubber residue from what might be some remnant of a seal that has cycled through the system up into the reservoir. I don't really want to pull the trans again, and I have read what many have said. The Hank guy made mention of taking the piston from the body by removing a circlip, but I an unsure of just how far to pull this back and just how I will know about any "air" releasing or how much fluid to let out. I am also wondering if a leaky slave cylinder has been an issue with this particular system. I am also wondering how can you really bench bleed the master cylinder correctly, and expect the system to work, if the slave is also in need of bleeding.

Most of all, I'd like to know if anyone has any ideas about what is going on here before I nurse it to Louisiana and drop the trans., perhaps needlessly so, in 70 degree weather rather than 15 degrees here in Nashville.

Thanks in advance
 
  #2  
Old 01-23-2009, 08:30 AM
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bleed it again and if no improvement may have to R&R the master and or the slave. A lot of problems with the slave but I also had problems with the master so I would go that way 1st as it is easier and cheaper than trying to drop the trans to get to the slave. I did have a slave go out within 2 years of install however so you never can tell. I have in the tech section how to release the air from the master when its installed. Easy but you need to be able to fit under the dash. I think its in the tech section, basically you pull the push rod plug out of the master to release the air and then gravity drain the slave if so inclined. works for me and some others that have tried it.
 
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Old 01-23-2009, 10:13 AM
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check pipes and hoses too. they may let air come inside.
 
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Old 01-23-2009, 11:57 AM
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Its a tight fit under the dash - I've installed the master cylinder twice so I know this well - lol. That said, any idea what this rubber residue might be that has cycled into the reservoir? I get the idea I'm looking at what used to be some seal of some sort.

When you say - drain the slave - what exactly do you mean there? Is there a way to bleed the slave with the QD connection off, and then you just install the MC after being bench bled. Do you have a link to the tech page where you posted the process? Thanks in advance there!

WHy hasn't Ford done a recall on this - its clear that its a major design flaw that FAR TOO many have had a problem with. If I've ever seen a situation where a recall was justified, this is certainly one of those situations.
 
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Old 01-23-2009, 01:03 PM
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does fluid dissapeare? any leaks?
 
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Old 01-23-2009, 01:30 PM
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try to change MC first and bleed. this is the cheappest stuff. and not so much work. no leaks, but no pressure to depress plate fully.... No leaks becouse some MCs have addtional seal and channel to let fluid back to reservour, but they may leak inside cabine ore on firewall in engine compartment
 
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Old 01-23-2009, 02:46 PM
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I dont know which tech it is so I keep this just in case: Bear in mind this was from my 94, but I think it will apply to yours, I have not worked on anything newer. Just be sure the resevoir is full when you begin. As to the black stuff I think its just normal wear and tear on the components over time particularly in the master. Hope this helps resolve the issue.
================================================== =======================
inside the cab, pull the starter interlock from the clutch rod, disconnect the rod from the pedal arm. You will see a circlip in the master over the piston. Pull the circlip, pull the piston till just the air and a little fluid escapes, reinstall, pump the master a couple of strokes repeat the above, reasemble than bleed per the manual, open the bleeder and let gravity bleed. Might have to bleed the bleeder a couple of times, biggest thing is the air in the master.
 
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Old 01-23-2009, 02:49 PM
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i do not remember is MC inside cabine in Ranger like in MB trucks ore under hood like on my aero....
 
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Old 01-23-2009, 02:54 PM
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Pablo it is located out under the brake booster, there is a hole in the firewall in which some of the master sticks into the cab per the above.
 
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Old 01-23-2009, 03:02 PM
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so if it leaks you may get fluid on firewall ore under carpet... not so easy to find....

Aero MC is near brake booster too. if leaks, leaks on fender under battery and no drop spilled on pavement ... just dissapearing fluid...
 
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Old 01-23-2009, 05:12 PM
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Continued problems

The Master Cylinder is brand new - two weeks old - can't imagine it being bad. I am not having much fluid loss - when i left Louisiana it was perfect - no grinding into gear at all. Since then, its become a nightmare. The system just does not stay under pressure. When I go out to mess with it now - I'll find that one finger can bring the peddle to the floor.
 
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Old 01-24-2009, 08:54 AM
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I was having problems with erratic pedal engagement after replacing clutch, and pressure plate-didn't have to go as far as Hanks post, but you might very well have to give it a try-with mine I had sufficent pedal, just that the engagement was sometimes near the the top, and sometimes I just barely had enough to get into gear, so I tried a tip off this forum-I pumped the clutch a couple of times, and had a helper hold it to the floor, while I opened the bleed screw-man, the fluid SHOT out of there, almost got nailed with it-anyway, closed the bleeder, checked master fluid level, pumped a couple of times, held it to the floor, opened bleeder, fluid came out, but nowhere near the force it had on the first shot-I also let it gravity bleed a couple of times-gotta keep an eye on fluid level-clutch pedal is now firm, and release is consistent... Good Luck!!!!
 
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Old 01-24-2009, 10:50 AM
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check all clutch lines. bad fittings, pipes, hoses may leak too.
 
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Old 01-26-2009, 01:50 PM
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Well no leaks I can see

I talked to a local trans guy I had do some work on an Auto 300ZX, I have. He tells me he bleeds the Ranger system all the time, and ON the vehicle. I'm going to cop out here and bring to him to see what he thinks. I have had many manual trainsmission and two Ford Bronco IIs in the past - they were never an issue to deal with - only this Ford Ranger have I experience this with.

Without removing the whole MC again, there is no way I can fit and get close enough to remove that circlip and then draw the piston out, as Hank suggested.

Clearly I have air in the system - and it just doesn't maintain pressure whatsover.
 
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Old 01-26-2009, 01:59 PM
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Help a friend change his Clutch Master Cylinder and had a hard time bleeding it. Had to take it out the second time to get it bled right. Here's a like that helped alot. 99 ford ranger clutch problem
 


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