Well, I've been reading this and kind of shaking my head a little. And I'm confused as well.

So please pardon me if I ask a few questions that have already been asked and see if the answer that come back is a little clearer.

First, you have a FORD 460 V8 motor with a Mustang (Ford Product) alternator on it and a Mini Starter with a GM type Starter Solenoid.

Well there's one thing I notice in all the posts I need to clarify with you...I notice absolutely no mention of a voltage regulator for the alternator. Do you have one and is it externally mounted or is your alternator converted to carry an internal regulator like the "one wire type" or the "GM type?"

Next, on the Ford Product cars and trucks the starter solenoid not only functions to energize the starter but is the focal point of the power distribution and charging systems connections. Do you have a starter solenoid external to the starter, and does your power being produced by the alternator flow to that solenoid where the positive battery cable is also connected or not? If not, where is it going?

Are you certain that the pulley system on the engine is sized properly and turning the alternator at the correct speed to produce electricity?

Silly question: how do yo know the alternator is not producing any electricity on the truck?

I'm going to post (for the sake of all concerned) a wiring schematic of a traditional Ford ignition and charging system with an external alternator regulator. This is generic and there are variations - especially with Mercury. Take a look and write back and maybe we can figure this out.



Good Luck,
Julie

PS. Electricity is VOODOO (I think that's the fourth time I've said that this week - and its only monday!)

 

On the mustang 3G alternators, the regulator is internal (well, screw on the back) see this pic, the three wire connector is shown plugged into the regulator


I can't draw worth a darn, but using straight lines (fl = fusible link)

battery ------------------------------------>solenoid big lug
reg y/b & alternator output --200amp fuse--->
alternator power --fl------------------------>
battery power --fl------------------------>

harness start --------> solenoid start lug

volt meter is across battery + and -, reads 12 or a little under,
drops big time as the starter draw comes on, and the fans kick in.
recovers, but only to around 12 volts.

this same setup worked before the paint and the EZWire harness install,
same pulleys, same belt. The alternator was putting out 14.5 volts at idle. The wiring was different, by a tiny bit.

The excite wire was run all the way back to the ignition switch run side.
otherwise it was wired the same..
With Ezwire the Alt Excite is run to the fuse block somewhere, but same concept.

oh, except for the ezwire 'alt power' lead, which wasn't present in test.

here is the Ezwire diagram for Ford as well.

Sam

 

and measurements of the voltage, (or ohm resistance from battery+ to alt excite) show identical readings.. thus the regulator would call for no more power.

Sam

 

Looking at these diagrams, there is not one that shows the output of the alternator connected to the battery lead.. (bypass wire its called I think)

I wonder if the fact that we have TWO leads from the main power source to the fuse box has things unbalanced.. we have the Battery Power AND the Alternator Power leads.

but because the alternator is feeding directly into the battery lead at the solenoid, I can'd see a purpose for the alternator power lead.

I'll disconnect it in the morning when I have some more work time.

Sam

 

Well you might be on to something there.

My first new question was going to be "where is the power wire, the one carrying the generated electricity (from the "BAT" post on the alternator) hooked up to on the other end.

It should be connected to the "Battery Post" of the starter solenoid (which by default is also to the positive battery post). That wire should be spliced or co connected at the Battery Post of the Starter Solenoid by the "A" wire coming off the regulator. In other words as I look at your latest drawing, the "ALT PWR=RED" wire coming off the alternator, and the "SOLENOID PWR=RED" should be connected to each other.

The "ALT EXCITER=WHITE" wire should be going from the regulator, to the volt guage or charge indicator light, then to the ACC terminal of the ignition switch. Neither of these wires should be going to the fuse block. The fuse block should be powered off the "B" post on the ignition switch for the "hot" side of the fuse block and the I side of the ignition switch for the "switched" side of the fuse block.

Ok and just FYI, on the plug on the alternator that connects to the internal regulator: the Yellow wire is the "A" wire in my drawing; the white with the black stripe is the "S" or Stator wire; the solid white wire is the "F" or Field wire; and the "I" wire should be green with red stripe if your Alternator is a 66.

J!

 

Here's alink to trouble shooting guide put out by power master.

http://www.powermastermotorsports.co...lternators.pdf

Good Luck

T900

 

Stupid site..I went over my one hour edit time.....Disregard the last paragraph in my last post above.

I copied my edit, here it is:

Well you might be on to something there.

My first new question was going to be "where is the power wire, the one carrying the generated electricity (from the "BAT" post on the alternator) hooked up to on the other end.

It should be connected to the "Battery Post" of the starter solenoid (which by default is also to the positive battery post). That wire should be spliced or co connected at the Battery Post of the Starter Solenoid by the "A" wire coming off the regulator. In other words as I look at your latest drawing, the "ALT PWR=RED" wire coming off the alternator, and the "SOLENOID PWR=RED" should be connected to each other.

The "ALT EXCITER=WHITE" wire should be going from the regulator plug, to the volt guage or charge indicator light, then to the ACC terminal of the ignition switch. Neither of these wires should be going directly to the fuse block. The fuse block should be powered off the "B" post on the Starter solenoid for the "hot" side of the fuse block and the I side of the ignition switch for the "switched" side of the fuse block.

OK Caveat: That is for the wiring diagram you just posted above. That is for a traditional Ford system with an external regulator. However, for the newer charging systems like yours, there is one wire that feeds the alternator off the fuse block. In this set up, the main power wire coming off the "Bat" post on the Alternator still goes to the Batt Lug on the Starter Solenoid. One wire still feeds through the charge light to the ignition switch, one feeds the volt meter, and the last is drawing power off the fuse panel through a 15 amp fuse. In my diagram that is a yellow/white wire.

I think your problem is you are using an alternator that needs wired differently than the ezwire diagram you posted above is telling you (which is for traditional external regulator) and you need to wire it as a modern Internal regulated alternator.

So, question now is, how many wires do you have coming off the back of the alternator and what colors are they. ALSO, was ther a wire in your easy wire set up that came off the fuse block that was flagged "alternator power?" If so, we know what to do. I'll go back into the posts and see if I can pull that info out of them.
J!

 

Oh oh, I'm wondering if Bobby is fibbing again!

Ok I went back and looked at the first drawing and I think I found the problem, maybe not.

Your light green/red wire should flow back through the alternator light (not necessary) to the ignition switch.

Your large red wire with the fusable link should go from the "Batt" post on the alternator to the Batt Lug on the starter solenoid.

The yellow/white wire off the alternator needs be run to the fuse block to supply power through a 15 amp fuse.

So I believe your EZwire "Alternator Power" wire (which should be coming off the fuse block) and the White/yellow wire coming off the alternator plug should be hooked together but not connected to the Batt Lug on the Starter Solenoid.

As you have it now, if you connect the yellow/white "Alternator Power" "in" wire using the same post as a source that the alternator puts "out" from ("BATT"); the alternator will shut itself off any time it starts to charge because the regulator is sensing the full output voltage coming off the alternator, and saying "System is charged, shut off." In other words it is self contained and only sensing itself (I've dated guys like that)

When the yellow/white "Alternator Power" is run off the fuse block it senses the difference in SYSTEM voltage (ie use) and turns on to supply a regulated flow of amperage to maintain the correct charge to replace what is being used.

I tried for about an hour to make this sound right. I hope you can understand my verbage!

Move the wires around as I described above and it should work. Let me know either way.

Thanks and good luck!
J!

 

Thanks Julie.. here is an updated drawing of the current wiring.

and so you are saying connect the alt power to the yellow/blk on the regulator, and nothing else.
I am going to disconnect the alt power lead altogether first, and then connect it only to the yellow/blk wire

the original diagram is how I had it working, charging, BEFORE the EZwire harness

You'll note that in the Ford diagram above, the Alternator Battery output and the regulator A terminal are connected AND Alt Power is there too.. which is how I have it wired, EXCEPT
that I ALSO have these tied to the actual battery lead.
Alt Power in the EZWire harness is only a 12ga wire (battery power is 10ga), so that can't carry a lot of amperage.

Sam

 

well, I was able to test this morning, but alas, no change

1. remove alt-power from starter, no reconnect
2. connect alt-power to yellow/blk (no connect to alternator)
3. same as 2, but connect to alternator output

net, no charge.

Sam

 

One final thing to consider; AutoZone's machines test the ability of the alternator to produce current (and I think they look for a dead phase). I am 90% sure that to do this, they bypass the regulator functions. I may be that your regulator is simply no good?

 

two different alternators,. both of which worked before?

I am about to run my own wire from the ignition switch to test.

Sam

 

Julie,

here is another picture with a 3G alt and an external solenoid.

Sam

 

Sam. I had a similiar problem with my EZ Wire set up. For some reason there was a wire required that was not in the kit. This has been a few years ago and I don't remember last year real clearly, so I can't identify it off the top of my head. I will go back tonite and look at my notes. It seems to me that a friend who later used one of their kits told me that they had added a sheet of instructions that dealt with this. Did your kit come with such a sheet, directing you to install a wire not included in the kit? It is directly related to the alternator. Joe

 

no, I bought this in 2001, finally installed in 2008!..

I did talk to them recently, and they did mention the 'bypass wire'.

which is basically the wire from the alt to the battery (at the starter)

sam