Cant you just mark the factory bolt and nut in relation to how it is put together before you take everything apart and wouldn't you be able to reassemble it back in the same possition?

Shane
Glynn Motorsports

 

you can try that....but you wont be able to get it back exactly 100% where it was... and the fact that you are putting new parts in, and things are moving around, u probably dont want it back exactly where it was...
The bottom line is, you 100% need an alignment if you are doing this job, and if u want your alignment done correctly, u need a C/C kit... its like $28, just stick it in there.
If you dont use one, and dont get aligned, you are just going to wear through ur tires quicker, and put stress on all the new parts u are putting in, and they will wear out quicker too.

 

Well, 98 Expy XLT 2WD, had it since it had 36K miles, first time doing ball joints at 145K miles. Light use city driving never off road or heavy work. Price quoted at shop all 4 joints WITH alignment for $388 "chinese" parts or $488 with TRW. They are only charging two hours of labor ($140). For what I read here, doesn't sound like a bad price.

If I can find the parts they will do the labor and alignment same price, so I am going to shop around for the parts and maybe bring them in.

Edit: after shopping around, question : for the price I am wondering why get the lower joint if I can just get the whole arm with the joint in it. Since this is all coming apart, if the cost isn't an issue, would it be harder or easier to just replace the whole lower arm? I don't have a press for the lower and I just thought the price of the rental might be offset if I just get the whole arm with new bushings and leave it all new.

 

I am going to post my experience, but I want to preface it by adding this:

I am only posting my personal experiences when I post on here and do not mean to imply that anyone else may have these issues. The reason for this is simple. I have been accused of stating that all Ford products are bad and that my own personal driving habits are responsible for issues I experienced which led to purchasing a different manufacturer's full-sized suv. All on this board.

Now, In my 2005 Expedition, I was experiencing a "thump thump thump" in the tires, which was diagnosed as "out of round". They were the original continentals so I put new Dueler AT's on the truck @ 55K. At 56K, the new tires made the same sound...the tire shop suggested I have the front end checked out. I took it to an independent shop for an alignement and they came to me and told me the lower ball joints were shot and the uppers were 35% gone and that there was no point in aligning it in this condition. I had ford confirm this. On a scale of 1-10, with 1 being the worst, the lowers were rated at a "2" and the uppers at a "6". All at 56,000 miles. Ford told me this was completely normal for a 2005 Ford Expedition

My truck was driven 90% on highway, a 2wd, no offroading and very very little unpaved roads.

These are the facts. I am in no way saying anything about quality. If you choose to use this information in a way that allows you to form an opinion, that is your choice.

 

'98 4X2 changed first set of upper and lowers at 180k miles. stock wheels. no complaints. currently has 215k on everything else and the alignment just checked ok last week. Usually get about 90k to a set of Michilen LTX tires. Maybe I baby the truck too much...

 

Well, took the whole thing apart today. I even removed the lower control arm to have new bushings pressed in (might as well do it all). The ball joints, uppers and lowers, on both sides were destroyed. Who knows for how long. The only casualties are the current set of tires, so I figure the problems started around 30K miles ago or so.

I bought the parts kit on eBay that has upper arms, lower ball joints, all the tie rods and two more parts for a complete rebuild. I am having the lower joints pressed in and the lower control arm bushings pressed in as well. I am even doing new brake pads and repacked the bearings (they are good).

It should be back to new soon. 5 hours disassemble on my driveway taking it slow with power tools.

 

Job done : assembly was a little harder than expected. One of the lower control arm bolts (rear passenger side) was extremely stubborn. I don't know if the bushing there was the right size but it was just by a bit so the hammer took care of it.

Word of advice : research your parts. I took the lower control arms to press in new bushings and the lower joints. I didn't expect to pay $60 EACH SIDE for the lower control arm bushings. I later researched online and found them much cheaper. I should have bought them ahead of time. I like to support my local parts store, but $120 in bushings vs web prices of $8 to $45 each is a big diff.

Anyway, once arms done, assembled. I took it in for alignment this AM and everything went to green (caster, camber and toe). I then stopped by the local oil placed and they lubed her up all over for free (well, I tipped him).

Now for the next 145K miles... Thanks to this forums for all the helpfull advice.

 

Oh boy...now I'm worried about mine. One more thing to add to my "list!"

Question, has anyone here used the Energy Suspension Hyper Flex kit for their bushings? Positives/negatives? I've used their products before successfully on swaybars, just curious if that much $$ in polyurethane is worth it on these rigs?

Also...unless the torsion bars are actually thumping, is it worth the trouble to replace the bushings on those? Or dumb not to while doing ball joints?

Thanks!

Sam

 

Alright, questions I might as well get out of my head while everyone is sleeping...

RockAuto has tons of stuff I'm sure I could use...but I'm not sure of quality here...

Spicer/Raybestos sells upper and lower control arms, already assembled in a couple different grades I guess...Red Label service grade and a pro grade. I'm not sure here...either are cheaper than Moog, and WAY cheaper than Motorcraft (surprise, surprise)...but how can they sell a whole assembled unit with the ball joint already installed, as well as the bushings for a bit less than $30 for uppers? Closer to $60 each for the "Pro" grade?

Also, not seeing a 4x4 application from Spicer...why? Or should I stick with Moog? Not hearing good things about Moog as of late...

Thanks guys!

Sam

 

Not to dig up dead horses here...and maybe I'm missing something? I tried this Ball joint test as you describe and I do get tons of movement...but I wanted to verify the TYPE of movement. You say any movement is bad...I'm assuming my ball joints are shot here...but did note that using the control arm as a pivot point with the pry bar, I do get up and down movement as the control arm is moving. Do I assume this is bad? If it is a sign of bad ball joints, also note that I can get mine to move without the aid of a pry bar.

thanks man...and if I'm way the heck off here, please feel free to correct!

Sam

 

Well I got 160K out of mine originals ones. I have recently replaced with motorcraft regreaseble ***** upper and lower I will see what happens next!

 

Yeah, I'm thinking mine have that and then some on them. My tie rods are sloppy to say the least...as are all the rubber bushings, etc in the front end. Even if my ball joints, in the off chance, are still good...I would be dumb to not replace them me thinks. Also, for my money, it may be worth it to buy control arms with the Moog ball joints already installed. Less chance of loosing an eye.

 

A more accurate way to test the ball joints is to not have the suspension supported with a floor jack. The problem with using a floor jack is that as you lift the wheel up the jack has give and will rise as well.

The better method is to raise the vehicle and place a jackstand under the control arm as close to the tire as possible and let the jack down. Try to set the jack stand height so that the tire ends up about 2" off the ground after being lowered onto the jackstand. Now place a block of wood right in front of the tire to use as a fulcrum and slip a bar or 2x4 over the block of wood but under the tire. Pull down on the bar and watch for any play between the 2 halves of the lower ball joint. Any movement over 0.030 and it needs to be replaced.

 

This is starting to make better sense now. Thanks!

Next question...how about uppers? What is the proper test there?

 

For upper you have the tire off the ground just like when checking lowers. But with uppers you pull and push the top of the tire in and out while looking for play in the 2 halves of the upper ball joint. With the uppers, it really helps to have a second person. One to push/pull the tire and one to watch the ball joint.