Hi everyone,

I have a 02 f250 crewcab lariat v-10 with 135k on it which spent most of its life in Chicago. I think I've seen most every thread on bleeding brakes, but I have yet to see the actual procedure posted. There has been references to a service manual, but I don't have one. Anyone know how to do it without me having to buy a manual and wait for it to be sent to me? I just want to make sure the shop I take it to tomorrow knows what they are doing.

The reason i think my brakes need to be bled, is that ever since i took it to a garage to have new calipers/rotors/pads put on both back wheels, the brakes seem to require above normal effort to stop. Also, i recently discovered that stomping on the brakes causes the pedal to go to the floor, (not easily), and the ABS doesnt kick in and no skidding. I know the ABS works, or at least used to, because when I bought the truck about 6 months ago, the ABS kicked in on a snowy road.

thanks!

 

A shop will probably vacuum bleed, which is different from shade tree bleeding. The idea is push or pull out the air, it can't travel up stream if there is a vacuum source pulling or pressure pushing it out.

I like to start at the wheel furthest from the MC first and work my way closer.

 

A scanning tool is need to activate the electric antilock brake modual to release the trapped air.

 

Exactly! Give that man a cigar!

Sounds like you have air in the ABS valve unit.

 

Thanks guys. So I can just ask the guy at that the dealer to use a "scanning tool" to release any air from the ABS module and cross my fingers? hopefully they wont get offended when i suggest how they do their job... the problem is when i called them to explain the scenario, he said it doesnt sound like the brakes need to be bled, and thats what everyone i spoke with suggests. I'm just trying to prevent them "troubleshooting" by replacing various parts that won't fix it when the brakes probably just need to be bled properly.

No one has the step by step procedure for the bleeding?

thanks again

 

FYI, i took my truck to the dealer yesterday. I asked them to bleed the brakes including the ABS valve. They called me and said they got done test driving it and said they didnt know why i brought it in. I re-explained that the scenario and he said he pulled the ABS fuse and said the backs were locking up during a hard stop but the front still weren't. He said the brakes were "90%" and didn't think they needed to be bled, and started saying how he'd recommend putting new pads and spinning the rotors for $500+. So I asked him flush all the fluid and bleed them. $185 for test driving it and bleeding/flushing.

When I got it home after this, The ABS only sometimes seems to kick in, and barely. Other times it wont kick in at all just like before I brought it in.

I never had a F350 before, but I'm thinking that brakes should all still lock up during a hard stop with the ABS fuse out?

At this point I'm thinking about putting on new rotors and some kind of higher performance/higher friction pads to see if that's the solution.

 

Is your truck a 4x4, and what size tires are you running (height, width)? Our trucks are very heavy and take a long distance to stop.
I took my 08 out and performed a rapid full petal stop at 50 mph and no skidding or lockup occured. My 05 SRT-10 Ram has the biggest stock brakes ever installed on a truck (15" rotors/ 4 piston calipers) yet still stops with little to no wheel lock-up. Its possible you don't have a problem.
Did you properly "burnish" in the new rear brake pads? if not they could be glazed over.

 

Its a 02 F250 v10 4x4 CCSB 3.73, stock tires, stock truck. Does your ABS pulse when you do this type of stop? Mine does very slightly but seems to do it only somtimes, sometimes i get no ABS pulse and I'm basically standing on the pedal.

 

That's weird. If I lay on the brake too fast, the ABS will certainly start pulsing like mad with 285/75R16's.

Are you sure the vacuum brake booster is working? Is the pedal hard? or totally soft and goes to the floor?

 

BTW, should i have posted this to the brakes forum? Should it be moved?

I haven't checked the vacuum brake booster. The pedal feels pretty normal, although I thought since putting all new brakes on in the rear, it seemed to require a little more pressure to apply the brakes, but it may be my imagination. Keep in mind the dealer didn't even think there was a problem when he test drove it. But with the ABS barely or not coming on at all during an emergency stop, it seems kind of obvious to me there's an issue.

The pedal isn't soft, although it will go to the floor when I stand on it, although not easily, I have to press pretty good. Also, if i shut the truck off, press the brake pedal down a couples times, it becomes very stiff/hard to press at the third time, which I think is normal.

If the symptoms still point to bleeding, I wouldn't rule out the dealer not bleeding them correctly. Or, if the pads/rotors up front aren't up to snuff, I guess i can see that causing braking power not to be 100%. But I would think the hydraulics should be powerful enough to overcome glazed pads or whatever else. I was going to try pads rotors next unless there's something else more likely. I just don't know which ones might provide the best stopping power/highest friction, not being concerned with dust, longetivity, etc.

 

Well I have a coupel trucks to compare, my 04 F250 V8 CC standard bed, which stops well with less brake pedal effort. I have never had to do a max effort stop with it but I imagine the rear brakes would lock due to just the box in back and heavy weight transffer to the front.

Now my 03 excursion which is notably heavier, requires more brake pedal effort to get the same stopping power. You really need to step on it good sometimes to slow down quickly. I have added powerslot cryo rotors to teh front, along with hawk pads and I got into a car chase scenario recently and the brakes felt fantastic, I was into ABS regularly as I chased a car taht was zipping around turns. I got into ABS countless times for a few minutes straight. All very short hard acceleration, then super hard braking, the brakes never faded and went ABS when I just flat laid into the brake pedal. (I dont know the braking limits/feel of the truck to properly threshold brake so I let the ABS do its thing). There was ZERO brake fade in this most extreme condition, multiple 30-40mph to 0-5mph over and over around a tight neighborhood late at night. I would see if you can find someone with a similar truck to let you try it on their truck (good luck talking em into letting you beat on their truck like that lol) or maybe get a dealer to let you test drive one on your own? Oh, and I had to flush my brakes afterwards a the fluid was dark and the pedal felta tiny bit mushy. I think I may have boiled the fluid just a touch.

For the record I was chasing someone that hit and ran me causing pretty good damage to my quarter panel. I got him.

 

I did the brakes on my 02 F-350 in the spring and have also noticed there is no more brake pulse when stopping hard and that the pedal effort is quite a bit more.
My wife has been nagging me to get it looked at but the thought of letting a dealer guess at the problem makes me shudder. I also pulled the ABS fuse and noted the brakes seem to lock up fine so I'm also thinking it's something with the ABS. My question is if there is air in the ABS module how does it get in there? I'v enever had a problem before.

 

Does anyone have a procedure for bleeding the R.A.B.S. without the scan tool?

Does anyone know how it operates?
12V to operate?
If so I could add a momentary switch to cycle it.

I replaced everything except the R.A.B.S. module including all the rear hard line that goes from the R.A.B.S to the flex line at the rear end and the drivers side wheel cylinder line.
I got a set of new calipers and a decent R.A.B.S module from the wrecking yard and rebuilt them so the system is dry except for a little brake assembly lube to prevent rust until it is assembled.

I do have a Super Star II tester but don't remember if it has anything to do with the ABS system, and there is not a drop of brake fluid in any part of my system right now.

 

There is no way to easily cycle the ABS system without the proper scan tool to do it.

There is a way, but it involves using a spare solenoid coil pack, ripping into it, and energizing each solenoid with +12V individually while energizing the ABS pump at the same time.

The "coil pack" I'm speaking of can be removed from the valve unit.