I have been looking into doing a buildup on the 351w in my '88 f150. I want to get 400 plus hp out of this thing and this is how I wanted to do it: save up a lot of cash, buy a 393 stroker kit, gt-40 upper intake manifold for a 5.0 mustang, get a lower manifold that adapts the upper manifold to the 351 block, a pair of victor jr. edelbrock cylinder heads, headers. Im still wondering about how to choose the cam for this buildup. Ive heard that the computer wont recognize a cam on computerized trucks like mine. Is this true? Do I have to modify the computer? Also, Im assuming that this gt-40 intake manifold setup will work on my engine considering it is the same block that they use for mustang buildups. Any help would be appreciated. Thanks.

 

1. Yes the GT-40 fits the 351W, Ford makes a special GT-40 lower intake.

2. Can't really help with the Cam Questions, but I do know they make "EFI" cams. If I were to guess what mod you'd have to do to the computer it would be to Chip it, or buy an aftermarket ignition timing system so you can override the oem computer and advance or retard according to your new cam.

Markus

 

To be honest with you the proper way to do it and the only way i know of is to convert it to mass air. Pro M makes a kit and i believe Ford Racing Performance Parts makes one now. This is the only way to do it properly without having driveability problems. The only other alternative is to have a custom chip burned for the speed density if that is possible on the trucks but it is only good for the combo programmed, if you change then you might have to get it reprogrammed. Where the Mass air adapts to the different air flow so you can change your combo. Forget the Victor Jr. go with the AFR 185's they are awesome and emission legal and you will probably have to port the GT-40 setup to get optimum performance, it doesnt flow to well. Just trying to help ya out a little.

 

Oh yea on the cam, a cam like an E-303 would give you lots of torque which would probably make it alot more fun on the streets and give you better driveability, but if you want horsepower go custom cam from Comp or Lunati, i would try the smaller cam first with such a big and heavy vehicle and then go bigger once you feel comfortable with it and it would also make it easier to tune at first. Just my advise hope i helped ya out a bit.

 

Don't go GT40, go with a Trick Flow Track Heat intake! It flows a lot better than the GT 40. I agree with going to Mass Air, but that's me. There's a lot of Mustang guys, mostly track only, that like speed density more than mass air, but for daily use I think you'll see more from mass air. As far as cams, the -303 cam is a good cam, but you'll probably want something more aggressive than the E-303. If you're going stroker, consider a custom grind cam.
My suggestion is call Coast High Performance and talk to one of their techs about what you want from the engine.
My two cents.
Later

 

I've seen 9 sec mustangs using stock ford truck intakes. Have you ever had a for truck intake off the engine?? The ports are huge. Take you stock intake to Van Senus and have them polish it up a bit, get a mass air setup(you can save a lot of cash by getting one off of a 94-early96 ford truck or van), and go with a FMS f-cam or bigger, also if you have an autu trans go with a 2500 stal converter.

John

 

What all parts would you have to aquire from the vans to have this work properly with a manual trans?


88 F-150 4X4 XLT Lariat w/5.0 EFI 5 spd (DAILY DRIVER)
86 Ranger 2WD w/2.3L EFI 5 spd to be 351W 4bbl C4 (NEW TOY- DETAILS WHEN FINISHED)
85 Old Cutlass Supreme 350/TH350 Holley 4160,Edelbrock Performer intake, el-cheapo headers, General Kinetics 270H series cam, 15.588 best 1/4 mile with original 10 bolt 2.41 gears (OLD TOY)

 

[font size="1" color="#FF0000"]LAST EDITED ON 03-Sep-01 AT 02:25 PM (EST)[/font][p]hi ryan356...if your unsure of your combination here's one that will give you 400 hp and 425 ft/lbs of torque without stroking and not a parts eater...using all edelbrock componets...i hope it helps...

351W Buildup With 400 HP And 425 ft/lbs of Torque

Edelbrock Performer RPM intake manifold..........................#7181
camshaft kit.............................#7182
Edelbrock Performer RPM cylinder heads (complete)................#6025
Edelbrock Performer Series carburetor (750 cfm, manual choke)....#1407
Edelbrock Performer-Link Timing Chain Set........................#7811
Edelbrock valve springs
(included with heads; stock heads use #5722).....................#5767
Edelbrock retainers
(included with complete Edelbrock heads).........................#9724
Edelbrock valve locks (included with complete Edelbrock heads....#9611

Shortblock Components:
Bore.............................................. ......4.000" + .030"
Stroke............................................ ......3.500" (stock)
Crankshaft.................factory cast steel (polished & shot peened)
Rods...............factory steel (polished & shot peened-A.R.P. bolts)
Pistons.......................................Spee d-Pro L-7078P + .030
Rings ...................Speed-Pro #R9343 +.035" 5/64" x 5/64" x 3/16"
Head Gaskets........................................... Fel-Pro #1011-1
Test Engine Specs:
Main Bearings (clearance) .............................(.0027"-.0031")
Rod Bearings.(clearance) ..............................(.0030"-.0032")
Piston Wall clearance .......................................... .004"
Ring End Gap clearance..............Top ring .018 "/ Second ring .012"
Rod Side clearance......................................... ..... .020"
Compression ratio............................................. ...9.8:1
Ignition and timing................ 34° total at 3000 rpm + MSD 6a box
Headers.......1-3/4" primary, 30" long with 3" collector, 4-1/2" long

Performer RPM Aluminum Ford Cylinder Heads:
Intake port volume............................................ ..170cc
Intake valve size.............................................. .2.020"
Exhaust valve size.............................................. 1.600"
Exhaust port volume............................................ ..60cc
Combustion chamber size..........................................60cc
Material specs.................A356 aluminum heat treated to T-6 spec


i hope this helps a little...feel free to contact me anytime direct... rapjap1@home.com

migraine
90 eddie baur bronco
98 mustang gt (its my wifes and im not allowed to drive it)
67 mustang fastback 351 stroked to a 408 600 hp
67 corvete coupe 350 with a 6-71 blower 1200 hp

 

migraine

Is the 350 really such a holy grail as to get 1200HP out of it with a supercharger?

Thats twice what your larger stroked 351 supposedly gets.

I'm just finding 1200HP out of anything except a 600 CI motor a little hard to believe.

Daywalker
92' F-250HD 351 4x4 xlt 4.10 ZF 5speed supercab longbed

 

[font size="1" color="#FF0000"]LAST EDITED ON 04-Sep-01 AT 11:02 AM (EST)[/font][p][font size="1" color="#FF0000"]LAST EDITED ON 04-Sep-01 AT 10:57 AM (EST)[/font]

[font size="1" color="#FF0000"]LAST EDITED ON 04-Sep-01 AT 10:54 AM (EST)[/font]

hi daywalker...what you have to remember that forced induction is where it is at...do you understand the principal and theroy of it...i am now in the process of building a 220 " rear engine rail with a 351 twin turbocharged engine...it should dyno about 1600 hp...it is my wifes ride...she should be able to grab a low 7 in the 1/4 and travel about 185 mph...i am 50 years of age and my wife is only 30...now she is the driver...in my old age my reaction time got a little slow...she is on her game...she will average 505's on the tree in ihra (without a box) we dont beleive in boxes or throtle stops...in ihra 500 is perfect not like nhra being 400...but im sure you knew that...back to the chevy...1200 hp is nothing for a blower that is 100% over driven...all you guys out there including myself for years is all we did was make the sleves biger and dump all the gas you can it it to make it go fast...those days were ok in the 60's when garlets and kalita and the guys were the pioneers but now it is all flow benches and technology...aparently you dont go to the dragstip or maybe you dont have one that host a national meet...my blower motor is for sale now because after all my dyno work i feel that turb charging is the way of the future...launch a car at 26 lbs boost and then lets have this conversation again...you'll feel like your testis came out of your groin...bottom end lag used to be the down fall but now that is gone...you dont need all that heavy iron anymore...the 351 stroked motor is for my wifes 67 mustang street toy...it seems like you dont beleive i got 600 hp out of it either...that was a simple build...with a little more balancing i could of took it to a 428 ci...to many slugs in the crank and about $800.00 more...i'm sure you understand the principal of balacing by adding mallory...well its actuly tugsten...did you study the buildup i listed for the one dude...you should of been able to see how easy it was to get 400 hp with no strain on the motor any where and it wont be a parts eater...i have been a hi performance engine builder since the 60's...now i wont build anything under 500 hp...maybe the problem is that if your not building your own engines your going to the wrong engine builder...thanks for the chat...


migraine

 

Out of curiousity, is that 1200 HP at the crank or at the wheels? Those are very impressive numbers. Unfortunately I don't have the money to buy a blower capable of that kind of boost, and my state is heavy emmissions, and the blower would make my daily driven Mustang impossible to pass, not to mention the cost in upkeep and loss of drivability/streetability that that kind of power would create.
In other words, for a daily driver high boost from any source, turbo or blower, just isn't logical.
My two cents.
Later

 

[font size="1" color="#FF0000"]LAST EDITED ON 04-Sep-01 AT 01:09 PM (EST)[/font][p]hi stang man...the twin turbo will have 24 lbs of boost not the blower...the 67 mustang and the vette are not daily drivers...the bronco and stang 98 gt are...the 67's are for the street but only on the weekend and crusies...racing fuel is far to exspensive for a daily driver and also that would be far to much strain on your pocket book plus your engine to drive it every day...the 1200 hp is at the crank...when i build an engine for some one i dont know what suspension, trani, weight, ratio and so on they are going to run so i always go by crank hp...from there you can finish your own combination for you racing program...i'm an engine builder not a chassis man...i take my rides to a chassis shop for the susspension work not counting our diggers from the past, we did not run the 4 links on them, we ran ridget...oh ya those impessive #'s are without even spraying it yet...if she would spray 1/100th after launch for 4 seconds at a 50 % spray (it can be controled from the cockpit from 0 to 100%) she would pick up another 4 tenths...you have to allow the delay so you dont blow the tires...i'm not a big nitrous fan but its the same as turbo's, you have to change your program to stay competive in this high tech feid now...it is not like before back in the 60's when you learned from trial and error and many blowed motors...now you can go to schools to learn this stuf...what does that tell you...if some one told me back in the 60's that one day t/f and f/c will run 4.5 at 330 mph with over 6000 hp or even put the motor behind the driver yet i would think they were crazy like you guys think i am right now...

migraine

 

[font size="1" color="#FF0000"]LAST EDITED ON 04-Sep-01 AT 11:31 PM (EST)[/font][p]I'll buy the 400HP 351 build up. I'll give the other more thought.

What tranny do you use with 1200HP? 6000HP?
What RPM does the engine go up to?
What fuel does it use?
Cooling system?

Daywalker
92' F-250HD 351 4x4 xlt 4.10 ZF 5speed supercab longbed

 

hi daywalker...the street corvette has a 4 speed...i run cam 2 racing gas any good gear head knows you cant hook up that kind of power on the street it is just a status symbol, i set up my own blowers (can you set up a blower)...it is not considered fuel...fuel is a term used with a nitro blend...rpm is 6000...with that kind of power you dont need a high rpm...4 vain hi flow aluminum radiator...with a blower motor the trick for runing cool is to richen your primary jets 10 to 12 % and your secondaries 20 to 25 % so you never fall into a lean situation and Never run alot of advance...now to the 6000 hp...t/f and f/c have a minimum of 6000 hp...they run fuel...fuel is a mixture of alcohal and nitro...also know as nitro methane...the percentage of each depends upon altitude and sea level...when they run at mile high in denver for a short quick example, it is so high above sea level the air is so thin they have to run alot more nito then alki to make power...i meen alot more...i hope that gives you a concept but it is a science...dont you ever watch the races on tv at least or you just solely into trucks...if you feel that it is so hard to get 1600 hp with a turbo why dont you ask some turbo manufactors instead of doubting me...remeber 1 thing daywalker its all in the heads...if you cant move alot of air you cant burn gas and make power...call fox lake power products and ask for ron...(330) 682-8800 he has one of the best porting shops in this country...its all done on cnc machines...he advertizes in all the magizines...his web site is www.fox-lake.com...ask him if i can get 1600 out of a 351 that will go low sevens...and then if you still dont beleive him either then try garret turbo chargers or the turbo people...we all cant be wrong...if you still dont beleive well then i dont know what to tell you...oh ya by the way i have a freind right now puting together a 76 vette with a 10-71 supercharger thats going to dyno out at 1800 hp but i'm sure you doubt that also...some people know how to make alot of horsepower and some people wish they did...i dont know if your picking my brain to prove me wrong or trying to learn something...only you know that answer...i find it real strange that a seasoned gear head does not know the current horse power of top fuel and funny car...i spelled out t/f and f/c just in case you did not know what that ment...they do have at least 6000 hp...well dude i dont know what else to say...here try this combination real quick...351w bore and stroked to a 408...comp cam # 35-772-8 mechaical roller which is at 0.50 NOT advertized 248/254 duration 614/621 lift at the valve... 0.384/0.388 lobe lift...lobe seperation at 110...power band (thats rpm range) 3000 t0 7000...victor jr.manifold port matched...demon 850 double pumper...you dont even need trick flow twisted wedies...(to much work and money to make them fit asnd work properly) so say edelbrock victor jr. or performer heads Fully cnc ported with the exsaust polished but do not fine polish the intakes....12.5:0 compression...2 1/4 " tubes...now theres 550 hp with 475 ft.lbs of torque without even trying hard...you should know that the bottom end should be all steel and with at least a eagle rod...i like carilos...o ya i also forgot we are building my cousin a hemi dart with 800 hp with a normally aspirated engine (just carburators) weighing 2300 lbs (alston frame) with origal metal body that i know will do 8.30's...it will be out next season...did i also tell you that my wifes 67 stang has glass hood, fenders, doors, 1/4 panels, trunk lid, headlight buckets, splash guards, and bumpers...and lexon glass weiging 2100 with her in it...i dont know where you live dude but here it is a valley of serious gear heads...we dont bowl ##### we perform...if you or any of your freinds do match racing for money feel free to come here...our team will have a car for just about any class you wish...so dude for now on if you want to pick my brain or what ever you are trying to do...do your homework first...there is nothing wrong with not knowing about something but dont doubt people that do know...that is not how you learn...have a nice day

migraine

 

So why bother replying? Migraine indeed.

This ain't stangnet, your dealing with ignorant country folk here. And when did I claim to be a gear head?

I now understand your claims. You forgot to mention money. $20,000+ for 1,800HP, I'll believe. As far as 6000 HP, tough #####, you can't muscle that one.

You're also talking the build up of the tranny, and axles. Plastic car? You're talking $50,000+ here for your 7 sec car. Yes, I'll believe money will buy anything. Your 550HP 351 is believable, for a decent chunk of change. So yeah, I guess I'm not a rich gearhead. Must be nice in that valley.

Daywalker
92' F-250HD 351 4x4 xlt 4.10 ZF 5speed supercab longbed