I've no idea how I would search for this so I'm posting w/o searching. If there is another thread here then tell me. I've towed a lot with tag trailers but am looking to move into bigger trucks and equipment.

In my perfect world I could tow a GN trailer with two pieces of equipment on it that total to approx. 12,000 lbs.-the length would be about 15-17' on the GN flat section with the tail at least 5 feet additional. This puts me at a 20' long trailer. In the tag trailer world you deduct the trailer "running weight" from the GVWR, I assume that this is the same for GN trailers. That would mean if I found a GN trailer that weighed 5500 lbs.(running weight) then the trailer would have to have a GVWR of at least 9-10 tons to carry the load.

Here's the question part: Is the GN truck king pin weight of 20-25% based on the total weight of the trailer running weight + plus the equipment or just the equipment?

Here are the scenarios:

King pin weight based on the total combined 8-9 tons, i.e at least 3600 lbs. at 20% of 18,000

OR

King pin weight based on the equipment weight of 12,000 lbs., i.e. at least 2,400 lbs. (20% of 12,000).

Thanks.

 

Your pin weight is based on the loaded trailer. How you load the equipment can affect the balance of the trailer. For instance if you have a pickup on the trailer nose first, there will be more pin weight than if you put the bed first (and the heavier front over or behind the trailer axles). Note also that your pin weight takes up that amount of the available payload of your truck.

Jason

 

Plan on 20-30% of the LOADED weight of the trailer... with a 20,000lb trailer that'd be 4,000 to 6,000lbs on the truck itself, like mentioned, depending on how its loaded. Less than 4000lbs on the truck can lead to problems, so make sure you don't load poorly and make the tongue TOO light.

 

Ok. If its the loaded trailer then its the combined weight of trailer weight and equipment-then in this scenario you would need an F350 DRW with a payload capability of at least 4-6,000 lbs. A loaded trailer here would be 12,000 equipment plus trailer at 5,500 lbs. to equal 17,500.

The 2008's in the 4WD F350 DRW handles 5,380 lbs. payload at max.

So here's the next question. How do I see other contractors pulling a 15,000 lbs. backhoe on a 20 ton 20'+ trailer with an F350 DRW? The king pin weight is well beyond the max payload for the truck let alone the GCWR of the trailer and load. We are talking 30,000+ lbs. Are they just making a choice to tow "heavy" with the risks or are they just, ahem, "unaware" of what they are doing?

 

Read the other posts on the top of the towing page... Manufacturer's GCWR are not legal definitions. Legal limits are defined by the amount of money you pay the DMV. Even though those trucks SHOULDN'T be towing that much, they can if they have proper tires (but not axles? brakes? etc?) and proper registration papers. In that concept, the GCWR is the total of the truck's GVW and the trailer's GVW. The truck must be plated for an amount greater than the GCWR. Makes no sense to me.

 

Ummm yeah, in some states you can apparently "buy" your way to more capacity at the DMV/BMV desk and having a nice chat with Betty behind the table!

 

It is not just the registered wieght. You have to get it to axle out. I can put my 18k lb backhoe on a 30' long 24k gvw gooseneck and load as not to overload the rear axle of my srw F350. The key is getting the wieght distributed properly.

 

so is there a scientific process for loading or just a gut feel to make sure you have not overloaded it, i.e. checking sag of rear end?

 

I am sure there are all kinds of formulas but I watch where the front axle is on the trailer and then how much weight the truck takes, i.e. how much it starts to settle. Once I see the truck taking some weight and feel comfortable where the load is in comparison to the front trailer axle I call it good. You want the truck to take some weight so it won't fishtail all over the place and still have as much weight as possible over the trailer axles.

I'd love to find these states that allow you to "buy" your GVW, here they take the trailer and truck ratings and you better not be over what is listed on the manufacturers plates, they also use that for what license you need to be pulling the load.

 

Thats about it. If you are unfamiliar with the whole setup, load it up and take it to a scale. Make sure you dont have too much on the pickup.

I think people have taken the term buying GVW the wrong way.

Just because you are registered for more wieght doesnt mean you dont have to have the additional axles to support it.

 

In your state, what if, a person puts components from a heavier truck in himself? Then he becomes the manufacture. Like putting F450 axles in an F250.
Funny thing, in the manual an F250 and an F350 have the exact same GCW. So whats up? There are loop holes in all the states rules.

 

That's because other than heavier suspension, they are the same truck. Same axles, same tires, same engines/powertrain/cab/everything else... just a few extra leaf springs.

 

Your arent going to be able to change the legal gvwr of the pickup, but DOT will look at the tires you have to determine axle limits. If you are running 19.5s they are rated much higher than light truck tires. This would allow you to run more wieght on each axle and technically change your gvwr. If you were to get in an accident pushing the original limits you might have liability issues due to the fact that the gvwr is on the vehicle ID tag. The reason you can go over the manufacturers gcvwr's is the fact that they are only an estimate and the actual gcvwr can not be determined without knowing the gvwr of the trailer involved.

 

tennesse is one of them. I called the local courthouse and asked about registering my truck for a specific weight. they told me i needed to figure out how much i wanted to tow and buy the appropiate tag. i asked how much the tags cost and she said "anywhere from a couple hunderd dollars for 16-20k on up to the thousand dollar range for 80k" so the way i understood from that conversation i could register my F-250 for 80K if I had the $$$$$. I dont use mine for buisness or ag purposes its personal use. yes i do tow tractors and hay but its for a "hobby farm" and/or show tractors, not for crop production or any kind of profit. so i just have passenger plates on mine. if i was to get pulled over and asked about weight I figure i can just play the "dumb civilian" card.

 

Well the rating is on the tires themselves, and in the state of WA they say nothing over 600 lbs per inch of width for a single tire, don't remember duals.
That gives an 8.5 inch wide tire 5100 lbs, but here you have to have duals to go over 10,000 lbs for an axle.