Agreed, I have experience with chains and binders, I ran a step deck semi trailer hauling oversized, and heavy equipment for 5 yrs before switcing to dry van, not everyone has the knowledge or experience on chaining down stuff. And my truck is a PSD with a chip, bigger exhaust, better intake, and a few other mods (like I have anything that isn't modded up) and it was working the heck out of it I wouldn't want ot pull that with any gasser short of a dump truck or something with a 429 truck engine in it., and that trailer I was using would be the absolute minimum that could handle that truck, it has 10k axles anything less and your asking for problems.

 

Good point. I think the tank can come off. It can be scrapped. I'd kind of like to keep the pump and motor on the tailend, because I can transfer them to a trailer frame here, and make a portable water trailer out of it. The master cylinder is no problem, I'll ship that to you. If you want to ask around whether for a hand doing the rears, or if someone can do it for us, that would be great. I can get rebuild kits for the wheel cylinders. Actually, take the whole added on crap off it. I won't need it, and if I want to make the truck work, I'll do it with just the truck, not the extra. See if we can maybe sell the pump and motor, or the entire added on thing either locally theree, or on the net, and maybe we can get enough money out of it to help recover other costs. That would remove excess weight of the axle, and the truck as a whole. Maybe ask around, and try to find an interested person for the tank and pump. It's got to at least be worth a few hundred bucks, maybe even 1000. I'll e-mail John for the vin inspection.

 

I called NAPA again, dang they're good, they have the wheel cylinder kits in stock, a complete set for all six cylinders. $3.99 for the rears, and $10.99 for the fronts. They have the master cylinder kit in stock in the next town over. They want bearing numbers in order to replace those, but they can get us the seals and bearings. See what we can do about getting the trucks brakes looked at, and we can get something going from there. I'll have to wait until next week, but I can send you the money for the battery, and the parts. If you can find an interested person for the pump and tank, cut it off and let them have it.

 

Well another thought is remove the pump, reel, and motor (probably have to in order to get to the tank anyway) then set the frame with the pump and engine on it into the bed protion of hte truck and better weight distribution.
As far as the getting someone around here to just do it, not a chance. first off these are mom and pop type places small community etc (like 2 mechanics and a bookkeeper that is usually the owners wife) they are very good but they can't afford to do it, and second they don't know you or have an interest in this site for that matter, and I can't afford to pay for much else and I won't ask them to do it for nothing, it's not mine or thier deal, and shouldn't have to, Sorry. Now if someone on here that lives in Iowa around this area wants to do it, then I can get it up to par enough to move to thier place (would have to anyway to get it to another shop, or for that matter even to safely load it). I personally am doing the work I can do, and paid out the diesel costs due to St Judes bieng mentioned, and that is the one charity I actually apporve of. I actually refuse to work on about anyone but my own stuff anymore but agreed to this for the charity reasons mentioned before.
Sorry not trying to offend, just wanted my position made clear is all. now onto what is at hand.

 

Bearings and seals are not a problem, we have the largest dealer of bearings in the world about 10 miles from me, infact they have bearings that the factory hasn't made in 50 yrs on hand and instock and ship worldwide (timken actually called them for bearings for a truck similar to this and they had the only 4 in existance anywhere in the world.)

 

I was not asking for anyone to do anything for free. When I first brought this truck up, I offered to pay expenses for people assiting, but thay would have to be able to work with me on that. I don't know anyone other you, and a few others, through this site in Iowa. I've contacted the legal antities needed to get that part done, and I have no clue as to who is where in the way of mechanics over there, and am being forced to rely on fellow club members to point me in the right direction. If you find me a shop, I'll pay their labor. If they want too much, then send it to the scrap yard, and let some one else deal with it. Or, if you are will to help me get it to a storage facility, and get me the address and number to that facility, I will pay for that storage facility, until I can get the truck picked up. I don't want anyone being burdened by this, and I will pay you back for your fuel if that is what you would like. I will also pay back the person who kindly payed for the web space for the site if that is what is wanted as well. I'm stuck 1700+ miles from my truck, and am being forced to do the one thing I can't stand to do, that is asking for help. I do not like getting others involved in my affairs, but I had no other choice here. If this can become an event to help sponsor facilities like St. Judes, or M-A-W, like I hoped it would, then great. If not, then at least we can all say we tried our best.

 

Thats not what I was saying Joe, not wanting this to be a sore issue, just wanted things clear is all. I understand your situation bieng so far away, and I haven't asked for anything, but I to am on a limited budget, and have my own bills and projects (like my wife is insisting I build a new shop this summer). And for the next 3 months my wife isn't working so that makes the budget even closer (she is a cook for the headstart program part time, and doesn't have a job in the summer)
And I was also saying I won't ask the shops to do it as a donation epecially since it isn't a charity that they would know anyway. By putting it out this way there is no confusion as to what is expected. I have already said I would do the work I can with my limited facilities, and will store it for a while as long as the city doesn't get after me (getting the lic plates onto it would stop that in anycase as that si the only requirement around here, either lic. or competition vehicle) I know the shops around here and know the people, and know that they aren't getting rick doing the work for farmers that are always wanting to cheap out on stuff as it is, and that is why I wouldn't ask them.

 

I understand. In fact, we just word that we are going to be able to move out to the father-in-laws 20 acres by the end of this summer. If you can possibly get a cost idea for someone to help with at least inspecting the brakes, that would help. I can get the money to pay for an inspection rather quickly. After it's inspected, and we know the damage, we can go from there. If the cylinders need to be sent to me, I can pay shipping both ways. I also do have that extra axle here, and it's supposed to have the same brakes on it, so I can take its cylinders, rebuild them, and send them your way. Same with the master cylinder. No hurry, I am working on plates right now. I am still waiting for the insurane paper work to get here, and then I can go get the tags for it, and send them to you. One thing at a time, I don't want anyone to feel overwhelmed, or pushed to do anything. If you think the pump, motor, and reel could be relocated to the front of the pumper body, then see what it would take to do so, and how much it would cost to get some help with that. I can't really budget stuff in, until I get an idea of how much we're looking at. I am basically putting my investment in your hands, with out meeting you, and giving you my trust that a suitable shop for some of the repairs can be located, and that you are willing and able to do what is in your realm of capabilities to help. Just let me know what you've got, and what you think, and we can brainstorm together from there, and get it figured out.

 

Joe, I was waiting tell you got it home to make suggestions, but I had better speak up now. My suggestion us to leave the platform and the tank, but cut the tank open on the top, and build a door into the rear - with wood benches running along the side of the tank (inside), you would have a place for people to ride and wave to the crowd.

Firetrucks are nice, but even they look better with a load of girls waving from them.

The platform would make a sharp stand to use as a soapbox for politicians to speak from, or a table to stack museum literature and handouts.

Everything would have to be clean and polished - look attractive and to where a mother would not need to worry about her children getting dirty or cut on a sharp edge. You park this at a children's hospital and the kids will be climbing all over it - until some do-gooder ruins everyone's fun.

I see this not as a factual restoration, but instead an item everyone can have fun with.

I would most certainly send it to a local repair shop and have them fix the brakes and wheel bearings. Not only would you then know that the truck is safe, but it also spreads the liability should something happen. It is unfair to ask Ron to do the repairs and assume the liability should something fail.

I would not worry about the weight of the rig - remember that you are running empty and it has handled all that weight plus water in the tank. I would put a 45 or 50 MPH speed limit on it - (big sticker on the dash!) - to avoid strain on the drive train and engine. It should also help with the gas mileage. The truck could still make 500 miles in a long day's drive.

You also need to make sure that the steering axle has good tires - especially as you have Dayton wheels. You don't want a blowout on the front with those.

I know money is an issue, but safety and common sense has to come first. I would send Ron $400 cash and ask him to take it to the shop for you. If it cost more than that, you can pay the shop direct. If it is less he can do the battery and other repairs that may be needed.

You also need to let us know if this is your personal truck to do with as you wish, or the start of a museum and a parade float available to anyone who wishes to use it.

 

Joe ??? how bout the pay pal account ???

john

 

no offense but i think that fire truck rear will be just fine i mean i loades up my one ton with 2.5 tons of hay and it acutally seemed to run better with the load. aslo we have a fire truck here locally a 1964 f 800 which the wieght constanly exceeds the gvw. jsut my opinion and as far as keeping it off the high ways it may be smarter and quicker to go the back way to redmond ive travlled the back way down there a few times and i know my way around

 

Hi Guys I could not resist the tempation to but in. That fire truck is not to heavy for the differential it has, even if full of water and equipment. Are we assuming that the fire truck was not usable and thus the low miles? If the truck was maintaned and sat only 2 years then it may need only a master cylinder and the brakes bleed until the system is flushed. If a cylinder leak is found at that point just fix that. It needs to be restored when it gets to its final destination. Tires are a big concern and keeping the engine RPM at about 3000 and below, not because the engine is old since I would say it is new according to the mileage but because that is what it was built to do. Take the back roads and enjoy the trip. Wish I could go along.

 

Guys, the rear end maybe just fine, but I am going off of info from people that were around when this truck was new. I mean yes I overload my stuff too, I mean I just got done pulling a 12000lb fire truck on a 4500lb trailer with an F250 I do believe that is well over the GCWR of the pickup, and it doesn't bother me. What does bother me, and this comes from guys that used to run those axles is that both of them (and they don't even know each other) without me even asking for this said the same thing, and that was the eaton center load axles running heavy like that have a tendancy to overheat and destroy the bearings. Ok we can resolve some of that issue with weight redistribution, and/or removale. Remember the pump, engine, and tank are not part of the original equipment for this vehicle when it was built, and are put on a framework that is 8ft behind the axle this causes a lot of extra weight transfer to the rear axle, and moving that weight up into the load area of the truck will resolve it.
As to the brakes, first let me say this for those that do not know, I maybe a truck driver now but I am trained as, and worked as a mechanic, I graduated from Wyoming Tech in laramie WY with the second highest score ever achieved out of that school at the time (now it's the third highest last time I heard) was the only student ever asked if I wanted to take a teaching position before I even graduated, I am ASE Master Tech certified, as well as CCT journeyman, and a couple of others. I am VERY good at this stuff. Now the brakes are the main issue first off, and when you have the rubber seals that have gone out in the master cyl causing it to leak it needs fixed the reason I am saying we need to work on the wheel cylinders is something took out that master cylinder, be it age, bad fluid whatever, well the wheel cylinders have the same treatment and issues and if your going from this thing not having good brake preasure for several year according to the previous owner and the fact this thing has been just used around a farm never leaving the place for the past 12 yrs now when hte master cylinder is repaired and the system bled (if I can even get the bleeders lossened) and bump the preasure back up the wheel cylinders are likely to go next. The suggestion of just fixing the master cylinder and then running it until you see a wheel cylinder leak and then fixing it would be fine if I was just gonna run it around the farm but this truck is about to undertake a 1700+ mile trip over mountains some with rather steep passes. Now I personally wouldn't want to drive it over those passes with brakes that might or might not hold, and I dang well won't ask someone else to do something Iwould refuse to do. Also the same time the axle seals could be and should be replaced to prevent an axle from starting to leak, remember this thing probably still has the original axle seals in it so 53 yr old rubber seals that have been sitting have probably hardened up, and then we expect them to work just fine on that long of a trip? Not a good idea. If it hadn't been for the master cylinder having been out for years I probably wouldn't have thought much of it, so this is probably a blessing in disguise. We want this thing to make it with minimal issues along the way, having a breakdown along the hiway can be very expensive, and create other issues safety and otherwise wereas fixing the obvious now is going to be cheaper, and safer in the long run.

 

Personal opinion, it's pretty clear that the truck ought to be flat-bedded to Oregon. Either that or a substantial part of the resto is going to have to be done by people in Iowa. I wouldn't drive my F-1 1700 miles over the Rockies without a lot of prep, and it's already 90% resto'd. Any money saved by not paying a commercial hauler might be spent on someone's funeral arrangements.... It is simply part of the cost of buying the truck. Just my $.02...

 

I have been following this whole ordeal since Joe bought the truck a while back. When the relay idea first came up I just thought I would sit back and see how it would play out. I didn't want to give my input because I didn't want to drummed off the board for being a kill joy but this whole relay idea didn't seem to be a good idea to me. There are too many factors that can kill the whole thing.

First, insurance. Regular insurance for a truck this size is astronomical and old car insurance is very restrictive. Most old car insurances require that only a certain number of miles a year be put on a vehicle, it can only be used for very occasional driving like going to car shows and parades and must be stored in a locked facility.

Second, if you are able to get the proper insurance I don't think the insurance company would look too kindly on having a dozen different drivers that they don't know the driving records of driving an old truck 1700 miles. I don't mean to insult any of the volunteer drivers but we only know each other through this board, we don't know if you had any accidents, DWIs or other traffic offenses on your records.

Third, what is the experience of the volunteer drivers? Again, I do not mean to insult but this is a very heavy, big old truck. It has 50+ old mechanical technologies and there are a lot of people on this board who complain that their F-1s ride, steer and stop rough, multiply that by 10 for a truck this size, plus add mountain driving.

Fourth, this truck is 50+ years old. Even if this truck doesn't have that many miles on it, it still has 50+ year old parts with 50+ years of deterioration. The question of the strength of the axle has been raised. I would rather err on the side of safety and agree with Ron, his credentials speak for themselves, not to mention he is the only person who has up close knowledge of this truck. He is right there and can see the exact condition of the truck. It might have worked for short runs out to the country side to put out a barn fire but a 1700 mile trip over mountains is a whole different story. I also think it is impractical to assume Ron has the time and means to do all the work that is required to get the truck road ready. Most of us, including myself, don't have the time to do the things that need to be done on our own truck and home projects let alone a project of this magnitude.

I strongly agree with Ross, I think Joe would be way better off hiring a trucker with adequate equipment to haul this truck home. I don't have any idea what that would cost but if there would be any problems on the road during the relay I think the cost of repairs and damages could easily surpass the cost of trucking. Also, with the cost of fuel, driving a old, big gas guzzling beast like this is going to cost a small fortune, most likely almost as much as the trucking. I realize the initial price of the truck was very temping but the cost and time of getting it home should have been calculated before finalizing the deal. I have seen a lot of nice trucks on uPay go cheap only because they were located in the middle of nowhere and would take days to get them home.

There, I said my peace, now I will sit back and take my lashings.