Why the decrease in engine displacement?
Postmaster
Joined: Feb 2004
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From: IL
Talk about timing! My neighbor's son owns a 405 hp (displacement ?)02 Z06, and he had just stopped by for a visit earlier today. We were talking and he told me his boy had luckily bought an extended warranty for it not long ago for $2200.00. Turns out that was a good move, she's in the shop due to 2nd and 3rd gears going out, and I think he said a pinion also. It has 30k on it!
He had brought it down a couple of times a year or so ago. The first visit he was eager for me to take a look-see under the hood so I humored him as I'm not really in to street performance cars. I was amazed to see oil leaking around what appeared to be the rear end of the passenger side valve cover area. There may have been more/less to it, but I didn't want to look to close and draw attention! Also, I noticed the highest pully had been rubbing the underside of the hood through the insulation, awful close to the hood itself.
Now, I'm not sure how he drives it in general, or if he abuses it, but I have followed him from town a few times and he was always doing the speed limit or close to it. It "appears" he takes care of it, but one can only assume.
He had brought it down a couple of times a year or so ago. The first visit he was eager for me to take a look-see under the hood so I humored him as I'm not really in to street performance cars. I was amazed to see oil leaking around what appeared to be the rear end of the passenger side valve cover area. There may have been more/less to it, but I didn't want to look to close and draw attention! Also, I noticed the highest pully had been rubbing the underside of the hood through the insulation, awful close to the hood itself.
Now, I'm not sure how he drives it in general, or if he abuses it, but I have followed him from town a few times and he was always doing the speed limit or close to it. It "appears" he takes care of it, but one can only assume.
Posting Guru
Joined: Jun 1999
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From: Everett, Wa
Originally Posted by Fordsflylow
That "reads" as great mileage for that size motor and hp, but is it reality? I know of no one who gets what the EPA has set as mileage claims for a particular vehicle.
Could it be gmc with their deep pockets pulled some strings to get those #'s!?!
I'm also curious to see how durable the motor is and whether it will make it to the six-figures with ease. Chevy big blocks, as I know of em, made great power, just never held together well. Time will tell I guess!
Could it be gmc with their deep pockets pulled some strings to get those #'s!?!
I'm also curious to see how durable the motor is and whether it will make it to the six-figures with ease. Chevy big blocks, as I know of em, made great power, just never held together well. Time will tell I guess!
Also the the Z06 motor, LS7 is not a big block but a small block. If I'm not mistaken this motor has already been built by a few to have close to 700hp of street gas power.
Posting Guru
Joined: Jun 1999
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From: Everett, Wa
Originally Posted by rusty70f100
I think most of the Corvette's mileage has to do with the fact that it's a very low, aerodynamic car, not anything too special with the engine. Notice the difference between city and highway mileage. You put that big engine to work, the mileage is going down. What do those things weigh, anyway?
You'll notice I never said there was anything wrong with it!
You'll notice I never said there was anything wrong with it!
Its funny really having this much torque. Most of the time just driving around the city the engine is only turning 1000rpms.
Postmaster
Joined: Feb 2004
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From: IL
Our 93 T-Bird LX has the auto 4 speed OD and at 70mph she's running about 2000rpm. OD makes a big difference! Of course, she only has a 3.8L v-6 and is getting around 32-34 mpg hwy, but then my wife is not one to get on it much. It's amazing to me that the 3.8L cranks out close to 200 hp and gets that good of fuel mileage. She's been reliable too!
Just wondering, do they even put an auto in a vette or are they all manuals?
Just wondering, do they even put an auto in a vette or are they all manuals?
Postmaster
Joined: Feb 2004
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From: IL
Originally Posted by tmyers
Also the the Z06 motor, LS7 is not a big block but a small block. If I'm not mistaken this motor has already been built by a few to have close to 700hp of street gas power.
Hey to each their own, but IMO no one needs 700 hp for the street, it's already dangerous enough out there.
Posting Guru
Joined: Jun 1999
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From: Everett, Wa
An engine holding together is all a function of RPM if is built correctly. Run a properly built 700hp motor easy and it will last. Run a 90hp motor at max rpms all day long and it will die.
The big HP motors that you see in the vettes are most of the time Turbo Charged. If you drove some of these vehicles you would never even notice it unless you put your foot it in.
Oh ya the vette comes in an automatic, in fact the is the majority of them sold. By the way that is what I have.
The big HP motors that you see in the vettes are most of the time Turbo Charged. If you drove some of these vehicles you would never even notice it unless you put your foot it in.
Oh ya the vette comes in an automatic, in fact the is the majority of them sold. By the way that is what I have.
Senior User
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 217
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From: Phoenix
i think eengines are smaller than they were yrs ago but the are computer managed and so is the transmission aswell making them if programmed right very powerful and another thing that i have not seen posted how much does a car/truck weight today as opposed to 30-40 yrs ago alot less has to be moved so you can get great performance from a smaller engine, i love my 460 and that if i want more power i can pop the hood and turn a screw for a bit more power or the other way for some economy but i am a fan of old school stuff so i'll stick with carbs for now but i am buying a 66 mustang and i might computer manage it just cause i will be traveling in it more
Posting Guru
Joined: Jun 1999
Posts: 2,404
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From: Everett, Wa
I think you are correct. With computers we are getting the most out of an engine. Try running 11:1 with an old school motor on todays pump gas. Not going to happen. The LS2 runs at 10.9 and and the LS7 runs at 11:1 on 91 octane. Want to run 86, yep you can do that but at a decrease performance level thanks to the computer. Want to run a little boost, yep you can safely run up to about 5.5 thanks to the computer system.
The cool thing IMO though is system are out there to take our old engines and do the samething. On my stroked 460 I plan on running FI using the same computer that is used in the Mustangs. After tuning I will get the most out of the motor and not have to worry about blowing one up again because of detenation.
The cool thing IMO though is system are out there to take our old engines and do the samething. On my stroked 460 I plan on running FI using the same computer that is used in the Mustangs. After tuning I will get the most out of the motor and not have to worry about blowing one up again because of detenation.
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Elder User
Joined: Jan 2005
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From: Lindsborg, KS
Computers may be great and all but it's a pain to diagnos anything if you are the average joe. Take back in the good ole days where my truck came from, they could work on their vehicles and diagnos what the heck was wrong if something started acting up. Nowdays, it's a different story, all these lil wires running everywhere, a need to drive the Corvettes at least once every month or a few months cause the electronics drain the battery while it sits there shut off(true story, brand new Corvette, wouldn't start because the electronics had drained the battery out, had to replace it so they could move it). Personally, this computer stuff isn't worth it. I'll stick with my good ole carbureted engine that doesn't need a billion wires going here and there on it. (go ahead, make fun of my ideas, i'm a teen but i've seen the pains/hassels of electronics, including firing on only half the cylinders cause the computer wasn't quite working right) But t his is just my opinion, back in the good ole days Ford made engines like the 427 SOHC and the Boss 429 and of course, the line up of 302's that compete against the 350's and the regular 427's and the list goes on.
I'll take my computerless truck any day over this new junk.
I'll take my computerless truck any day over this new junk.
Last edited by klatt_89; Jan 23, 2006 at 07:08 AM.
Logistics Pro
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 4,447
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From: Georgia
I long for the simpler days with no computers managing engines. I do also think with todays body material weights large engines would be overkill for the street. Why would you want to put a 1200 pound engine in a 1500 pound body. I think the handling would be awful.
Freshman User
Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 42
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From: Philly Area, PA
Originally Posted by jdmorg
You're gonna need to dumb that down for me, or I'm just over thinking it. What I was going for is that (and I'm not sure) I thought that Indy car engines were generally smaller, and that they also contained less rotational mass, because of how short the stroke was (I'm not talking about materials here, as it's probably unrealistic to look for F1 quality materials in a Windstar or something), which all lead me to think that the effieciency of an F1 engine was much greater than that of a normal, stock V8, and not just because of the materials used. Do you know what I mean? Is that the case?
Posting Guru
Joined: Jun 1999
Posts: 2,404
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From: Everett, Wa
Originally Posted by klatt_89
Computers may be great and all but it's a pain to diagnos anything if you are the average joe. Take back in the good ole days where my truck came from, they could work on their vehicles and diagnos what the heck was wrong if something started acting up. Nowdays, it's a different story, all these lil wires running everywhere, a need to drive the Corvettes at least once every month or a few months cause the electronics drain the battery while it sits there shut off(true story, brand new Corvette, wouldn't start because the electronics had drained the battery out, had to replace it so they could move it). Personally, this computer stuff isn't worth it. I'll stick with my good ole carbureted engine that doesn't need a billion wires going here and there on it. (go ahead, make fun of my ideas, i'm a teen but i've seen the pains/hassels of electronics, including firing on only half the cylinders cause the computer wasn't quite working right) But t his is just my opinion, back in the good ole days Ford made engines like the 427 SOHC and the Boss 429 and of course, the line up of 302's that compete against the 350's and the regular 427's and the list goes on.
I'll take my computerless truck any day over this new junk.
I'll take my computerless truck any day over this new junk.
You might think that but I wonder if it really is true. Case in pont. I built up a 429 in the 500 to 600hp range. For the life of me we could never get rid of a part throttle knock. Idle was great and so was WOT. We change carbs, timing, even the dizzy and it was still there. Finally blew the motor up after about 3 months. With FI we could of mapped the fuel needs and develop a program to meet those needs. That is why on my next build I will go to FI.
Oh and concerning the vette with the DBS problem. It is known problem that GM is working on. But it as nothing to do with the computers that run the engine. It is also not a problem with all the cars.
Fleet Owner
Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 28,609
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From: Lake Tahoe, Nevada
Referring back to several posts. One reference to Indy car engine size. They are the size they are because the rules specify the size. The rules also say that they will be V8s.
Formula I cars are turning over 19,000 rpm. Talk about piston speed. Their displacement is also dictated by their rules.
Formula I cars are turning over 19,000 rpm. Talk about piston speed. Their displacement is also dictated by their rules.
Elder User
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 908
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From: Lindsborg, KS
I was just saying that all the electonics on the Corvettes while sitting and haven't been ran for a while drain the battery. Second, i'm 16, i don't like computers, never will, i'll stick with the good ole fashioned carb's, mechanical fuel injection, i can't stand these new computerized things, too many things get fried etc.
Post Fiend
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 8,600
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From: Iowa
Originally Posted by tmyers
Try running 11:1 with an old school motor on todays pump gas. Not going to happen.
http://www.popularhotroddingweb.com/...power_squeeze/
You have to do everything right though.