BOSCH Spark Plugs and Wires
#16
09-06-2004, 03:35 PM
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Originally Posted by Fiferian
I have a '98 Ranger, 4 cylinder. I just bought plugs and wires for it ( Bosch copper core) and want to know what do you have to do to get to the 2 plugs at the back on the left. It looks like I have to dissassemble half the engine to get to them!
#17
09-07-2004, 02:05 AM
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Plug Heat Range
Greetings John,
Obvioulsly everyone has their oun POV, what I suggest...is if you feel its worth it TRY IT.
if you are trying to get better mileage or Power...there are so many different things you could do. just do what you feel is right...\
But I have to agree...whoever told you the redo the valve guides was blowin smoke.
Obvioulsly everyone has their oun POV, what I suggest...is if you feel its worth it TRY IT.
if you are trying to get better mileage or Power...there are so many different things you could do. just do what you feel is right...\
But I have to agree...whoever told you the redo the valve guides was blowin smoke.
#18
09-07-2004, 07:34 AM
Cargo Master
Originally Posted by Big Jim M
Howdy John
Hey 70K is a little early for changing out the plugs! If it ain't missin leave them alone! AND think of this. If the plug DOES spark... it lights the fire, and NO PLUG can light the fire and make it QUICKER OR MORE POWERFUL!! Once the fire is lit it is all over! The type of plug, old, used or NEW does not matter! If it does make a spark, it did the SAME job as ANY OTHER plug could have done!
Do NOT fall for the gimmic ads... Use what the manufactorer intended and you will not go wrong. Everyone elses plugs are just TRYING to get it right. The plugs that CAME in your ride are the correct heat range and design for YOUR engine.
And the guy above that thinks he got 2 mpg with the different plugs is just kidding himself! He can change to the original plug for his vehicle and the milage will not change. They simply light the fire! At the first start of a spark the fire is lit and NO plug nor NO coil will make the fire any different! Lit is lit.
Big Jim
Hey 70K is a little early for changing out the plugs! If it ain't missin leave them alone! AND think of this. If the plug DOES spark... it lights the fire, and NO PLUG can light the fire and make it QUICKER OR MORE POWERFUL!! Once the fire is lit it is all over! The type of plug, old, used or NEW does not matter! If it does make a spark, it did the SAME job as ANY OTHER plug could have done!
Do NOT fall for the gimmic ads... Use what the manufactorer intended and you will not go wrong. Everyone elses plugs are just TRYING to get it right. The plugs that CAME in your ride are the correct heat range and design for YOUR engine.
And the guy above that thinks he got 2 mpg with the different plugs is just kidding himself! He can change to the original plug for his vehicle and the milage will not change. They simply light the fire! At the first start of a spark the fire is lit and NO plug nor NO coil will make the fire any different! Lit is lit.
Big Jim
You can believe what you want. But I know how to calculate fuel mileage. I fill up each time and divide the miles I drove by the gallons I put into the tank. I was averaging 14-14.5 miles per gallon before the plug change. After putting in the Bosch Platinum 2s I started averaging 17 miles per gallon. AND I did notice a healthier running engine. To me, that is a significant difference and it was well worth it. In fact, I got 21 miles per gallon on a totally interstate trip after putting in the Bosch's. This new Ranger of mine has NEVER even hit 20 miles per gallon with the factory equipment. So believe what you want. But NO, not all fire is the same. It's not totally a sales gimmick.
#19
09-07-2004, 04:27 PM
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Howdy WXBOY
Hey this is not church! Belief has nothing to do with it. If you take those highly advertised plugs out and put new factory ones in there you will have exactly the same milage.. Please try to explain to me how one spark can light gasoline and produce more horsepower out of that gasoline than ANY other spark can???
Please think about this a while. The spark does NOTHING towards making horsepower. If there is a spark of ANY strength the gas is lit and at that time the fire takes over.
Your computer makes sure the spark occurs at the proper time... there is nothing else to consider. If you think there is some other equasion please spell it out here.
For a little history:
When computers took over the running of our rides the mixture LEANED out for fuel milage, with this lean mixture and the input of exhaust gas into this lean mix the existing plugs and coils sometimes sparked into a mixture that was off balance and would not light up! It was determined that the spark needed to be LONGER so it would cover more of the mixture in the cylinder and hopefully would always find some lightable fuel. So we have plugs now that have a gap that is twice as big and coils that will provide the current to jump that huge gap. Any coil and any plug that will do the above does the same as all the others. Any exception would be the plugs with all the extra electrodes.. These numerous electrodes may from time to time cause the spark NOT to see a flamable mixture and in so doing can cause momemtary misses.
Now as for the BLACK PLUGS.. That means nothing! Pull one of those Highly advertised plugs and see if it.too, has turned black.
And yes 100K and more is the true time to change plugs... Or maybe just regap them.
Big Jim
Please think about this a while. The spark does NOTHING towards making horsepower. If there is a spark of ANY strength the gas is lit and at that time the fire takes over.
Your computer makes sure the spark occurs at the proper time... there is nothing else to consider. If you think there is some other equasion please spell it out here.
For a little history:
When computers took over the running of our rides the mixture LEANED out for fuel milage, with this lean mixture and the input of exhaust gas into this lean mix the existing plugs and coils sometimes sparked into a mixture that was off balance and would not light up! It was determined that the spark needed to be LONGER so it would cover more of the mixture in the cylinder and hopefully would always find some lightable fuel. So we have plugs now that have a gap that is twice as big and coils that will provide the current to jump that huge gap. Any coil and any plug that will do the above does the same as all the others. Any exception would be the plugs with all the extra electrodes.. These numerous electrodes may from time to time cause the spark NOT to see a flamable mixture and in so doing can cause momemtary misses.
Now as for the BLACK PLUGS.. That means nothing! Pull one of those Highly advertised plugs and see if it.too, has turned black.
And yes 100K and more is the true time to change plugs... Or maybe just regap them.
Big Jim
#20
09-07-2004, 04:51 PM
Originally Posted by Big Jim M
Hey this is not church! Belief has nothing to do with it. If you take those highly advertised plugs out and put new factory ones in there you will have exactly the same milage.. Please try to explain to me how one spark can light gasoline and produce more horsepower out of that gasoline than ANY other spark can???
Please think about this a while. The spark does NOTHING towards making horsepower. If there is a spark of ANY strength the gas is lit and at that time the fire takes over.
Your computer makes sure the spark occurs at the proper time... there is nothing else to consider. If you think there is some other equasion please spell it out here.
For a little history:
When computers took over the running of our rides the mixture LEANED out for fuel milage, with this lean mixture and the input of exhaust gas into this lean mix the existing plugs and coils sometimes sparked into a mixture that was off balance and would not light up! It was determined that the spark needed to be LONGER so it would cover more of the mixture in the cylinder and hopefully would always find some lightable fuel. So we have plugs now that have a gap that is twice as big and coils that will provide the current to jump that huge gap. Any coil and any plug that will do the above does the same as all the others. Any exception would be the plugs with all the extra electrodes.. These numerous electrodes may from time to time cause the spark NOT to see a flamable mixture and in so doing can cause momemtary misses.
Now as for the BLACK PLUGS.. That means nothing! Pull one of those Highly advertised plugs and see if it.too, has turned black.
And yes 100K and more is the true time to change plugs... Or maybe just regap them.
Big Jim
Please think about this a while. The spark does NOTHING towards making horsepower. If there is a spark of ANY strength the gas is lit and at that time the fire takes over.
Your computer makes sure the spark occurs at the proper time... there is nothing else to consider. If you think there is some other equasion please spell it out here.
For a little history:
When computers took over the running of our rides the mixture LEANED out for fuel milage, with this lean mixture and the input of exhaust gas into this lean mix the existing plugs and coils sometimes sparked into a mixture that was off balance and would not light up! It was determined that the spark needed to be LONGER so it would cover more of the mixture in the cylinder and hopefully would always find some lightable fuel. So we have plugs now that have a gap that is twice as big and coils that will provide the current to jump that huge gap. Any coil and any plug that will do the above does the same as all the others. Any exception would be the plugs with all the extra electrodes.. These numerous electrodes may from time to time cause the spark NOT to see a flamable mixture and in so doing can cause momemtary misses.
Now as for the BLACK PLUGS.. That means nothing! Pull one of those Highly advertised plugs and see if it.too, has turned black.
And yes 100K and more is the true time to change plugs... Or maybe just regap them.
Big Jim
#21
09-07-2004, 05:52 PM
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Originally Posted by Big Jim M
Hey this is not church! Belief has nothing to do with it. If you take those highly advertised plugs out and put new factory ones in there you will have exactly the same milage.. Please try to explain to me how one spark can light gasoline and produce more horsepower out of that gasoline than ANY other spark can???
Please think about this a while. The spark does NOTHING towards making horsepower. If there is a spark of ANY strength the gas is lit and at that time the fire takes over.
Your computer makes sure the spark occurs at the proper time... there is nothing else to consider. If you think there is some other equasion please spell it out here.
For a little history:
When computers took over the running of our rides the mixture LEANED out for fuel milage, with this lean mixture and the input of exhaust gas into this lean mix the existing plugs and coils sometimes sparked into a mixture that was off balance and would not light up! It was determined that the spark needed to be LONGER so it would cover more of the mixture in the cylinder and hopefully would always find some lightable fuel. So we have plugs now that have a gap that is twice as big and coils that will provide the current to jump that huge gap. Any coil and any plug that will do the above does the same as all the others. Any exception would be the plugs with all the extra electrodes.. These numerous electrodes may from time to time cause the spark NOT to see a flamable mixture and in so doing can cause momemtary misses.
Now as for the BLACK PLUGS.. That means nothing! Pull one of those Highly advertised plugs and see if it.too, has turned black.
And yes 100K and more is the true time to change plugs... Or maybe just regap them.
Big Jim
Please think about this a while. The spark does NOTHING towards making horsepower. If there is a spark of ANY strength the gas is lit and at that time the fire takes over.
Your computer makes sure the spark occurs at the proper time... there is nothing else to consider. If you think there is some other equasion please spell it out here.
For a little history:
When computers took over the running of our rides the mixture LEANED out for fuel milage, with this lean mixture and the input of exhaust gas into this lean mix the existing plugs and coils sometimes sparked into a mixture that was off balance and would not light up! It was determined that the spark needed to be LONGER so it would cover more of the mixture in the cylinder and hopefully would always find some lightable fuel. So we have plugs now that have a gap that is twice as big and coils that will provide the current to jump that huge gap. Any coil and any plug that will do the above does the same as all the others. Any exception would be the plugs with all the extra electrodes.. These numerous electrodes may from time to time cause the spark NOT to see a flamable mixture and in so doing can cause momemtary misses.
Now as for the BLACK PLUGS.. That means nothing! Pull one of those Highly advertised plugs and see if it.too, has turned black.
And yes 100K and more is the true time to change plugs... Or maybe just regap them.
Big Jim
I uderstand what you are saying. But can you explain why you would incress your gas mileage when you put new plugs in?
Also what would you say is the most important itiem in gaveing you a much better gas mileage when you know that your gas mileage has droped off? Can you explain why or what a Ford Grage does in a turn-up and this would go for any cars or trucks any make or model.
We all would like to keep are cars or trucks in the top performance as we can. This is the most important thing there is.
To me you are very informing
As you stated above about those other plugs, I do have to say they cannot make claims to something that is not there. Right
#22
09-07-2004, 07:08 PM
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Getting back to changing the plugs...
My engine was running rough and changing the plugs helped. The plugs... sometimes they go before 100K. My dad and my grandpa agreed, but sorry pops... sometimes convention does not equal reality. They also told me that the A/C shouldn't take any HP from the engine... but mine does! I swear!!! 
Moving on... those back two are hard! I had a little (read: LOT OF!) help from a friend of mine (and his friend who fixed one of the plug wires when the darn thing pulled itself apart) He actually took the intake off and replaced it with a "fantastic gasket" as I like to call it... it's like a caulk gun in a way. You could always just replace the intake gasket, but where do you find one late at night?? I know a guy who changed them without removing anything, but it's HARD! I think there's a tool... heh heh... but I think if you yank at the wires hard enough they'll come off (should change those anyway...) and get an extention for your socket wrench or something... good luck!
P.S. "Why new plugs could change gas mileage" If your old plugs aren't quite doing the job (weak spark, can't get it up in time etc...) the engine can't efficiently use the fuel it has and that sucks. If the spark is even a little off it can miss maximum air compression, therefore missing complete combustion, and logically, power. Inefficient use of fuel, that is... and I think it leaves a residue on the plug in that case... eh, I could always be wrong... so don't take my words as law!
Moving on... those back two are hard! I had a little (read: LOT OF!) help from a friend of mine (and his friend who fixed one of the plug wires when the darn thing pulled itself apart
) He actually took the intake off and replaced it with a "fantastic gasket" as I like to call it... it's like a caulk gun in a way. You could always just replace the intake gasket, but where do you find one late at night?? I know a guy who changed them without removing anything, but it's HARD! I think there's a tool... heh heh... but I think if you yank at the wires hard enough they'll come off (should change those anyway...) and get an extention for your socket wrench or something... good luck!P.S. "Why new plugs could change gas mileage" If your old plugs aren't quite doing the job (weak spark, can't get it up in time etc...) the engine can't efficiently use the fuel it has and that sucks. If the spark is even a little off it can miss maximum air compression, therefore missing complete combustion, and logically, power. Inefficient use of fuel, that is... and I think it leaves a residue on the plug in that case... eh, I could always be wrong... so don't take my words as law!
Last edited by D-ranged2.5; 09-07-2004 at 07:13 PM.
#23
09-07-2004, 08:25 PM
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#24
09-07-2004, 08:48 PM
...I will now attempt to debunk for you the myths and legends surrounding Bosch Platinum spark plugs: Bosch acknowledges a problem with using their Bosch Platinum spark plugs in engines with ignition systems that employ 1 coil for each pair of spark plugs (also known as a "waste spark ignition system")...The problem that Bosch has acknowledged when using their Platinum plugs in engines with waste spark ignition systems stems from the tendency of electrode metal to get transferred depending upon the polarity (direction of current flow) of the spark. In waste spark ignition systems, 1/2 of the plugs always see reverse polarity sparks. Given the very narrow platinum center electrode of the Bosch Platinums, performance will be degraded more significantly when reverse polarity sparks will cause material to be transferred from the large ground/outer electrode onto the narrow platinum center electrode's exposed end surface....
#25
09-07-2004, 09:39 PM
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#26
09-07-2004, 09:43 PM
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#27
09-07-2004, 10:16 PM
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Originally Posted by JohnAW
Big Jim
I uderstand what you are saying. But can you explain why you would incress your gas mileage when you put new plugs in?
Also what would you say is the most important itiem in gaveing you a much better gas mileage when you know that your gas mileage has droped off? Can you explain why or what a Ford Grage does in a turn-up and this would go for any cars or trucks any make or model.
We all would like to keep are cars or trucks in the top performance as we can. This is the most important thing there is.
To me you are very informing
As you stated above about those other plugs, I do have to say they cannot make claims to something that is not there. Right
I uderstand what you are saying. But can you explain why you would incress your gas mileage when you put new plugs in?
Also what would you say is the most important itiem in gaveing you a much better gas mileage when you know that your gas mileage has droped off? Can you explain why or what a Ford Grage does in a turn-up and this would go for any cars or trucks any make or model.
We all would like to keep are cars or trucks in the top performance as we can. This is the most important thing there is.
To me you are very informing
As you stated above about those other plugs, I do have to say they cannot make claims to something that is not there. Right
Gas milage with new plugs is in MOST cases pride of ownership and accomplishment! If the tune up is totally worn out and the wires are weak ect. And everything is replaced in the tune up on a very bad running engine. Then yes you will see an improvement back to normal. BUT from normal no plug change will get ahead of the factory norm.
As for claims... Hell John every aftermarket company is fudging on the facts. The air cleaner company tells you their air cleaner will add 10 H/P to your car. And it WILL but it is only at 7200 rpm! So they sell millions of those air cleaners and guys THINK they have 10 more H/P! They even get on here and tell how good the truck runs and even tell story's about getting better milage too... I don't think they are lieing on purpose I suspect many of them actually beleive what they say.
Then the muffler guy advertises 5% increase in H/P and everyone goes out and buys one... and the new one is LOUD and it SOUNDS like they are going fast. However in many cases the new system defeats the vacuum that was designed into the original system that they threw away! So now their engine is louder and is laboring to discharge the exhaust until they are in PASSING GEAR at 5,000rpm!
It is all like that. Race track modifications will not work on the street! And anyone can advertise anythng they wish.
I'm rambeling not ranting.
If you think about changing something on youyr truck, ask yourself ...Why did Ford not put this on there? They are trying to get the best milage possible, why would this thing be better than their's?
Big Jim
#28
09-07-2004, 10:35 PM
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Ford and ALL other companys put quiet exaust on so that they won't continually have complaints about the truck being too loud etc. That and emmissions. Changing the exaust and air filters do help with Hp and Torque, as well as milage in most cases as long as you don't go overkill on it. Example: a 302 with True dual 2.5" exaust will make more power but it will be way up in the Rpm range. You put the same exaust on but 2" pipes and it will be around the normal Idle to whatever range. See what I mean? The quiet exaust is just because of emmissions laws and the fact tha most people don't like loud exaust.
#29
10-05-2004, 01:22 AM
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Today I installed plugs and wires in my ranger what a pain, had my hand bent more way than i thought was humanly possible. I own a 97 ranger with the 4.0 I put the regular bosch platinums in it and motorcraft plugs. I noticed my truck ran alot smoother and quieter. People cant bash all of bosches plugs becuse there 3 different ones. From experence the +4 and the +2 can make a car run rough and its not just fords. The reason for this is the +2 and the +4 run hotter than the other plugs and there for the motor is running to hot in it. The +4 and +2 should be used in performance aplications only you cant put a set of +4 in a metro and expect it to perform any better. Ive installed the +2 and +4 in other cars like a 97 chevy cavalier Z and that thing ran like crap with them in it. If you decide to use the bosch in any car unless its a performance aplication use the regular 1 eltrode ones save your self 5 bucks a plug for the +4 when its going to make your car run like crap. The regular ones are just like the autolites except the name and price.
#30
10-05-2004, 09:21 AM
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Howdy Crazy
Originally Posted by Crazycookiecutter
Today I installed plugs and wires in my ranger what a pain, had my hand bent more way than i thought was humanly possible. I own a 97 ranger with the 4.0 I put the regular bosch platinums in it and motorcraft plugs. I noticed my truck ran alot smoother and quieter. People cant bash all of bosches plugs becuse there 3 different ones. From experence the +4 and the +2 can make a car run rough and its not just fords. The reason for this is the +2 and the +4 run hotter than the other plugs and there for the motor is running to hot in it. The +4 and +2 should be used in performance aplications only you cant put a set of +4 in a metro and expect it to perform any better. Ive installed the +2 and +4 in other cars like a 97 chevy cavalier Z and that thing ran like crap with them in it. If you decide to use the bosch in any car unless its a performance aplication use the regular 1 eltrode ones save your self 5 bucks a plug for the +4 when its going to make your car run like crap. The regular ones are just like the autolites except the name and price.
Too much for me to do here to school you on em but please read some about what is needed to fire up the mixture in the chamber and why plugs have only so much clearence in them.. After doing this you will give totally different answers to spark plug questions.
Big Jim