94 vibrations, at my wit's end
#32
08-01-2005, 01:33 PM
Originally Posted by Jharger
Interesting. Well, generally speaking, abusing a vehicle won't typically get it to perform better. You probably cut the bushing completely in half and now have the radius arm itself resting on the steel braket. This will throw off an alignment.
Certainly the radius arm bushings can cause vibrations. This is one of the big checklist items guys have been addressing this problem with. Think about it - anything that is designed to hold the tires in place that is then loose won't hold the tires in place. Ala vibration!
When I changed min I also did the twin I beam pivot bushings - all in polyurethane. This got about 1/2 the vibration out and also straightened out the back end. The left rear was about 1 inch lower than the right rear. Getting the fornt end geometry squared up again pulled the back end into place.
So radius arm bushings are a big deal. Change them. Let me know if you need the directions for this. You may be cutting frame rivets - which is an accepted Ford Mo Co practice as I found reading a TSB, much to many's dismay.
Certainly the radius arm bushings can cause vibrations. This is one of the big checklist items guys have been addressing this problem with. Think about it - anything that is designed to hold the tires in place that is then loose won't hold the tires in place. Ala vibration!
When I changed min I also did the twin I beam pivot bushings - all in polyurethane. This got about 1/2 the vibration out and also straightened out the back end. The left rear was about 1 inch lower than the right rear. Getting the fornt end geometry squared up again pulled the back end into place.
So radius arm bushings are a big deal. Change them. Let me know if you need the directions for this. You may be cutting frame rivets - which is an accepted Ford Mo Co practice as I found reading a TSB, much to many's dismay.
#33
08-01-2005, 01:50 PM
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Heat from Cat is one thing and a lot of folks report the right wears out faster than the left because of this. But the radius arm bushings are a very soft rubber. Ford liked it because it gave the car a softer feel and was easier to sell - but they sure don't last!
I have poly urethane bushings everywhere now except for the upper rear leaf shackles. the ones I ordered came with the right part number but the OD was wrong and wouldn't fit - never went back to readdress that one. At least I know all the parts are relatively fixed in place and won't move around - a couse of highway vibration.
Autozone has a picture of the twin i beam uspension on there web page. This should help you.
Radius arm bushings - and the associated plastic washers. Ford dealer is now selling a F150/Bronco plastic washer as the replacement for the explorer. The replacement ones look to have more glass fill in the plastic which makes them stronger but also more brittle. They had one older stock Explorer one (white) and the rest F150's (black). So I tried both and the Explorer one broke in about 2 weeks. Bronco ones have been on over a year and no problems yet.
Twin I beam axel pivot bushing. These are where the i beams mount to the truck - look underneath on either side of the oil pan. It's a bitch of a job so for $100 I brough it to 4 Wheel Parts to do it. You need to drop the I beam and get it low enough to get a tourch on it to burn out the rubber bushing. Then pound out the steel casing of the bushing with a punch. Now you can install the new poly bushings. It's a pain to get it all to line up and get the bolt back in since the I beam assembly is so heavy.
Rest are easy - basically just the front/rear sway bars. There are bushings in the idler links - 8 ttl per car. And then each swaybar has 2 rubber mounts.
The last thing that I mentioned before was the rear leafs. The eyes of the leafs and the 2 uper shackles make 6 total bushings. These too need to be burned out with a torch.
Only other rubber on the car are 2 motor mountsand one transmission mount - also all available in Poly if you want.
I have poly urethane bushings everywhere now except for the upper rear leaf shackles. the ones I ordered came with the right part number but the OD was wrong and wouldn't fit - never went back to readdress that one. At least I know all the parts are relatively fixed in place and won't move around - a couse of highway vibration.
Autozone has a picture of the twin i beam uspension on there web page. This should help you.
Radius arm bushings - and the associated plastic washers. Ford dealer is now selling a F150/Bronco plastic washer as the replacement for the explorer. The replacement ones look to have more glass fill in the plastic which makes them stronger but also more brittle. They had one older stock Explorer one (white) and the rest F150's (black). So I tried both and the Explorer one broke in about 2 weeks. Bronco ones have been on over a year and no problems yet.
Twin I beam axel pivot bushing. These are where the i beams mount to the truck - look underneath on either side of the oil pan. It's a bitch of a job so for $100 I brough it to 4 Wheel Parts to do it. You need to drop the I beam and get it low enough to get a tourch on it to burn out the rubber bushing. Then pound out the steel casing of the bushing with a punch. Now you can install the new poly bushings. It's a pain to get it all to line up and get the bolt back in since the I beam assembly is so heavy.
Rest are easy - basically just the front/rear sway bars. There are bushings in the idler links - 8 ttl per car. And then each swaybar has 2 rubber mounts.
The last thing that I mentioned before was the rear leafs. The eyes of the leafs and the 2 uper shackles make 6 total bushings. These too need to be burned out with a torch.
Only other rubber on the car are 2 motor mountsand one transmission mount - also all available in Poly if you want.
#35
08-01-2005, 04:03 PM
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I'd say you sliced through then on that off road excursion. That or the nut backed off. The poly ones hold their shape where the rubber ones just moosh. When they moosh too much, they loose compressing the arm itself and the whole thing gets wobbly.
The poly ones don't do this. They keep their shape. only wat to turn them is to cut it in half or the nut backed off.
The poly ones don't do this. They keep their shape. only wat to turn them is to cut it in half or the nut backed off.
#36
08-02-2005, 02:30 PM
Originally Posted by Jharger
I'd say you sliced through then on that off road excursion. That or the nut backed off. The poly ones hold their shape where the rubber ones just moosh. When they moosh too much, they loose compressing the arm itself and the whole thing gets wobbly.
The poly ones don't do this. They keep their shape. only wat to turn them is to cut it in half or the nut backed off.
The poly ones don't do this. They keep their shape. only wat to turn them is to cut it in half or the nut backed off.
I do hear a clunk when pulling a hard left when leaving for work out of the driveway. Comes from front right.
#37
08-02-2005, 02:33 PM
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If you can spin the RA bushing, it is not beign compressed, hence it is loose. Loose not good - could be the noise you hear. Some folks say they have to double up on the big washer before the nut to get enough compression on the RA bush - but I didn't think the poly ones needed this. let know what you find.
#38
08-02-2005, 06:19 PM
I've only had my seccond hand 97' Explorer for a month now but I also had serious vibration problems to start out with which have now been solved.
I raised each wheel and spun it by hand whilst holding a fixed stick up near the rim and observered the distance bettween the rim and the stick. I was amazed to to discover that the wheel appeared buckled even though when it was previously balenced It checked out OK.
I later discovered that for some unknown reason the previous owner had inserted 3/16
alluminium spacers bettween the hub and wheel on all four wheels, upon inspection each individual spacer was NOT of uniform thickness.
I removed all four spacers and now the car runs as smooth as a bird.
I raised each wheel and spun it by hand whilst holding a fixed stick up near the rim and observered the distance bettween the rim and the stick. I was amazed to to discover that the wheel appeared buckled even though when it was previously balenced It checked out OK.
I later discovered that for some unknown reason the previous owner had inserted 3/16
alluminium spacers bettween the hub and wheel on all four wheels, upon inspection each individual spacer was NOT of uniform thickness.
I removed all four spacers and now the car runs as smooth as a bird.
#40
08-02-2005, 09:45 PM
Originally Posted by JimAbbott
I've only had my seccond hand 97' Explorer for a month now but I also had serious vibration problems to start out with which have now been solved.
I raised each wheel and spun it by hand whilst holding a fixed stick up near the rim and observered the distance bettween the rim and the stick. I was amazed to to discover that the wheel appeared buckled even though when it was previously balenced It checked out OK.
I later discovered that for some unknown reason the previous owner had inserted 3/16
alluminium spacers bettween the hub and wheel on all four wheels, upon inspection each individual spacer was NOT of uniform thickness.
I removed all four spacers and now the car runs as smooth as a bird.
I raised each wheel and spun it by hand whilst holding a fixed stick up near the rim and observered the distance bettween the rim and the stick. I was amazed to to discover that the wheel appeared buckled even though when it was previously balenced It checked out OK.
I later discovered that for some unknown reason the previous owner had inserted 3/16
alluminium spacers bettween the hub and wheel on all four wheels, upon inspection each individual spacer was NOT of uniform thickness.
I removed all four spacers and now the car runs as smooth as a bird.
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#41
08-06-2005, 04:43 PM
I just got a call from the shop that is doing an alignment on my 94 Explorer. They say I have to have new "adjustment bushings for camber". Two times $7 for the parts and an hour of labor. Is this one of the bushings you refer to above? Is it common to need these? Do they have another name? Obviously one of those things where you can't say "no", but I want to know if this is a scam. Going to be an expensive alignment. Thanks.
#42
08-08-2005, 02:57 PM
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Sorry. been out of town. These are not rubber bushings. Metal and all they are are tapered washers. They spin around and rotate the top ball joint mounting surface to pull the camber in or out. $7 is a steel for these. I had a shop charge me $35 a peice before. Is it common? Yes and know. If eveything stayed the same from the day it was built, you would never need to change them. But springs sage and other components wear and then the camber is out and too far to adjust with stock bushings. They come in 1-2 degree increments so there is not a lot of room for variation with any given size.
#43
08-27-2005, 10:27 AM
Thanks Jharger. You are right, they ended up saying the parts were closer to $20 per side. Add in an extra hour of labor per side and it got pretty steep for an alignment. They were supposed to save the old parts for me, but didn't. Later, I couldn't see any evidence of a newly installed part, so I was concerned. Judging from what you said, I guess the repair was legit.
#44
08-27-2005, 11:36 PM
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Right. It's not something youy can see looking at a tire - gee is it 1 degree leaning in or 1 degree leaning out?
That's what the alingment equipment does.
When I had the bushings changed, that alignment was $175. But the truck drove straight - the first time in 6 years since it was new. It never ran straight when I drove it off the lot.
That's what the alingment equipment does.
When I had the bushings changed, that alignment was $175. But the truck drove straight - the first time in 6 years since it was new. It never ran straight when I drove it off the lot.