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Been thinking about your front cover. My guess is that any capable machinist that has access to a Bridgeport, (VMC being better) could machine that flat in 30 minutes or less. (that includes set-up and the machining) If Deiselsite can *add* a bronze spacer, I don't see why removing say .020 from the LPOP surface is going harm anything.
Where do you compensate for that .020?
Take the front of cover (where lpop cover bolts) down too??
Take the front of cover (where lpop cover bolts) down too??
Ive wondered about this before....
Maybe you could but I don't like doing stuff like that. The next time I'm in there, I'm likely to forget what I did last go 'round so I prefer to keep it original as much as possible.
Maybe you could but I don't like doing stuff like that. The next time I'm in there, I'm likely to forget what I did last go 'round so I prefer to keep it original as much as possible.
You'd have to mill the face of the front cover. Then everything would be ‘like stock’. Maybe?
Been thinking about your front cover. My guess is that any capable machinist that has access to a Bridgeport, (VMC being better) could machine that flat in 30 minutes or less. (that includes set-up and the machining) If Deiselsite can *add* a bronze spacer, I don't see why removing say .020 from the LPOP surface is going harm anything.
I'm assuming you meant LPOP mating surface on the front cover when you said remove 0.02?
I'd guess that would only change where the LPOP sits on the crank. Bronze spacer has it sit farther out, milling the front cover has it mounting farther in on the shaft... seems there's enough tolerance to do the former, not sure about the latter.
Anyone used Melling intake n exhaust valves? Mahle seems to be the standard but the Melling equivalent part is almost ten dollars cheaper per valve and actually in stock at a lot of places.
Take the front of cover (where lpop cover bolts) down too??
Ive wondered about this before....
As I see it you have four surfaces. The LPOP surface, the CPS surface, the water pump surface and the HPOP cover surface. If one were concerned about the serpentine belt running true you could machine the water pump surface the same amount. I wouldn't touch the CPS surface as that would change the distance to the cam gear.
As I see it you have four surfaces. The LPOP surface, the CPS surface, the water pump surface and the HPOP cover surface. If one were concerned about the serpentine belt running true you could machine the water pump surface the same amount. I wouldn't touch the CPS surface as that would change the distance to the cam gear.
The pulleys/belts, etc are not at play here.
Moving the LPOP gears and cover closer to the engine only changes where the LPOP/front seal rides on the crank/harmonic balancer.
on edit: The crank may not allow pump gear to go on any deeper?? While waiting for that pic to upload it occurred to me that crank allows the gear to move close enough to damage the cover....
I’ve wondered about all this a LOT since I’ve scrapped a couple dozen front covers due to wear in this spot...
You have WAY more experience than I with these things. Question. Does the snout of the harmonic balancer touch the LPOP crank gear when tightened? Or, is it "floating" on the crank and being captured by the LPOP housing and the front cover? I would think the the LPOP housing controls the clearance of the LPOP lobe set.
You have WAY more experience than I with these things. Question. Does the snout of the harmonic balancer touch the LPOP crank gear when tightened? Or, is it "floating" on the crank and being captured by the LPOP housing and the front cover? I would think the the LPOP housing controls the clearance of the LPOP lobe set.
Balancer is tight to crank.
LPOP gears ‘float’ on crank and are held to the front cover by the LPOP cover. Independent of balancer/crank pulley.
I *think* the front cover could be milled in the wear area and across the face where LPOP cover mounts, but I don’t know enough about machining to know what that might cost.
The only thing I know for sure is it always looks better with paint or powder coating on it!
From the photo SSJ posted you can see witness marks where the pump was riding on the crank. It appears to have plenty of room to mill the cover just to clean up scratches.
Dan, you’re the machining expert so what do you think?
SSJ, I think it’s time you do a test run of this process.
From the photo SSJ posted you can see witness marks where the pump was riding on the crank. It appears to have plenty of room to mill the cover just to clean up scratches.
Dan, you’re the machining expert so what do you think?
SSJ, I think it’s time you do a test run of this process.
The question isn't whether or not that area can be successfully machined, the question is *how much* can be machined off? .020 isn't really very much. Can .050 be taken off? How about .100?
The question isn't whether or not that area can be successfully machined, the question is *how much* can be machined off? .020 isn't really very much. Can .050 be taken off? How about .100?
I’m sure there are tolerances to even the factory clearance so it will vary part to part.
Someone could line the gear up with the witness marks on the crank, then measure how far it can move before bottoming out on the crank. I would want to leave a little room for expansion in the “calculation”. I feel like this is a reasonable concept to clean up and reuse covers with “normal” wear. Someone with some parts would need to do some measuring though… SSJ.
Really liking this front cover discussion. I'll need to check and see what the cost would be to have that area machined smooth.
Dropped off the block at the machinist today. Estimated completion is two months. Crossing my fingers that pistons and bearings are still in stock by the time they get me the measurements. Shop said Melling valves are suitable substitutes for Mahle ones (likely come from the same factory).
Since having difficulty getting Mahle parts, going with Fel Pro for head gaskets and valve seals. Decided to return the China Mahle lifters to KC Turbos, got Ford branded ones from the dealer for not much more (plus an oil cooler).
Really liking this front cover discussion. I'll need to check and see what the cost would be to have that area machined smooth.
Dropped off the block at the machinist today. Estimated completion is two months. Crossing my fingers that pistons and bearings are still in stock by the time they get me the measurements. Shop said Melling valves are suitable substitutes for Mahle ones (likely come from the same factory).
Since having difficulty getting Mahle parts, going with Fel Pro for head gaskets and valve seals. Decided to return the China Mahle lifters to KC Turbos, got Ford branded ones from the dealer for not much more (plus an oil cooler).
Why not get Motorcraft head gaskets? I don't trust Fel Pro for oil cooler gaskets, so I certainly wouldn't want their head gaskets on my truck. That is just me though and perhaps more experienced FTE'rs have a more glowing opinion of Fel Pro.
Also, give a real good look at the edges and surfaces of the valves. I worked in a valve manufacturing plant for a year and you would not believe the valves that went out to Honda, Toyota, Nissan and Subaru. It was amazing how many defective valves were missed by in house QC and caught by the automobile manufacturer QC.
Sometimes the faulty valve would be installed and the engine replacement fell on the valve manufacturing company. There was a big white board with the number of valves sent back and catastrophic failures. It was updated daily.
