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59 f100 starting issues

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  #1  
Old 05-29-2018, 04:54 PM
fhorta
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59 f100 starting issues

Hello. Whem i turn key, panel lights go off and motor does not turn over. Hear a clicking sound. I jumped main terminals on starter solenoid and i get a spark but motor does not turn over. Checked all connections and there is no corrosion. Tried fresh battery and still no success. I can push start it. I am guessing at this point i have a bad solenoid or starter. How can i narrow it down? Or what else can i do to test? What do the spark mean on solenoid when i jump the terminals? Thanks a bunch.
 
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Old 05-29-2018, 11:48 PM
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Make sure the starter is grounded and bolted up properly, have someone turn it over for you while you check voltage to the starter from the solonoid. If all the connections are proper, the battery is good and it still doesnít turn over then the starter may be bad but this is not for sure because the proper way to test a starter is to do a draw test which checks how many amps is drawn. The solonoid connection inside may be bad but still put out voltage. If the solonoid is clicking and no power to starter then the solonoid is bad. If the solonoid is pretty old it might be a good idea to change it anyway cause they are cheep. If you do change the solonoid and the battery is good and the engine turns over slowly then the starter is drawing too many amps and is bad. If still doesnít start then starter is bad. Lastly there is the tap test although I do not recommend it as someone can get hurt if you donít know what you are doing!
The solonoid will always spark because of the high amperage from the battery or you may be doing it wrong.

If none of this makes sense to you then please have a mechanic check it out cause a draw test is usually a lower costing service.
good luck and hope this helps.
 
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Old 05-31-2018, 08:54 AM
fhorta
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Thanks! I will try changing solenoid first. Does look rather old. I ordered from rockauto for $4.99. Should be arriving a couple of days.
 
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Old 05-31-2018, 10:21 AM
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You have to think how this system works - it makes a full circle - battery + > solenoid> starter> ground from starter to motor> ground on motor to battery.
You said the solenoid looks old but may not be the cause. How old are the battery cables and don't say they look good as you can not tell how good they are by looking at them.
Look over this link and it will show you how to find what is wrong with your truck.
https://www.ford-trucks.com/forums/1...w-starter.html

It will pin point where the issue is. It could be just dirty battery connection(s), cable connection or even a bad battery cable. When you find a bad cable but they look good, cut the insulation off and now look at it.
That is why with new projects I replace all the battery cables so I know they are good.
I bet you will find either a bad connection at the battery or the cables bad or both.

Post back what you find and the fix as it can help others.
Dave ----
 
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Old 06-01-2018, 10:08 AM
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Originally Posted by fhorta
Thanks! I will try changing solenoid first. Does look rather old. I ordered from rockauto for $4.99. Should be arriving a couple of days.
If this 5 buck chuck you ordered from the Rock is good old domestic NOS you're in luck, if it's just import chinesium throw it in the trash. It will be nothing but trouble.
 
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Old 06-09-2018, 03:52 PM
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Sorry for delay. Had time today to work on truck. Unfortunately, the solenoid is made in china. I did tests recommended on link, the drop load test i think it's called. Battery remained above 10 during the 15 second load test.
when testing negative side by placing negative on negative post and positive on starter casing rhe voltmeter read in the .2 and .3's . When tested the positive by placing positive end on positive batt terminal and negative on starter's insulated terminal, the reading was between .9 and 1.
I then installed the new solenoid and got same results. I think my next step is to get new positive batt cable. I did cut the ends of both cables and inspected for corrosion but "looked" ok.

I did notice a stronger turnover with new solenoid.
Im also having latent carb issues too so guess minus well order a new one.
 
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Old 06-09-2018, 04:00 PM
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It just dawned on me...; before, engine was not turning over at all. Just clicked, and the times it did turn, did so very weak. I did purchase a batt charger and put batt to charge. Charger is smart charger so left batt for several days until charger indicated fully charged. So possible weak batt was part of problem, along with old solenoid. But im still getting over .3 on the positive leg load test. What should i make of this?
 
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Old 06-09-2018, 05:30 PM
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It does sound like the positive cable should be replaced. For whatever reason the + pos side voltage drop always runs a little higher than the ground path side, but the figures you're getting are not allowable. I think the limit is 0.3 or 0.4 volts for the pos side. As you know it's cumulative, it all adds up.

If you cut the cables to check for corrosion, it sort of implies using those bolt on battery cable terminal ends. Those are notorious for causing trouble. Is the cable all original? Replace every bit of it - block to frame, block to firewall, solenoid to starter, etc.

Also when they do get replaced a lot of folks purchase those generic blister pac battery cables hanging on the wall at the local ottozone or the like. Unfortunately these are not very good quality, probably OK for a 4 or 6 cylinder. If you have a tractor supply store nearby they can make up a set of heavy duty cables with quality coated copper terminals for not too much more money, and they are light years ahead of the drug store cables. A couple guys on that auction site make cables up in whatever length and terminals needed. These are slick too. I had a full set of 2/0 AWG stranded pure copper cables made up for my '64. Never have to worry about the cables, although if the tweekers ever find out I'm probably hosed.

1 Gauge cable should probably be considered, yes maybe overkill but the manufacturers really skimp and use the lightest stuff they can get away with. I think they used 4 gauge or even less. The main ground cable should be at least as large as the rest, and connect directly to the block, or maybe a bolt on the starter. Make sure the starter itself has a clean electrical bond with the block, no paint, but your voltage drop numbers are low enough to show that's probably not an issue.
 
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Old 07-26-2018, 05:20 PM
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Hey all. So finally got around to getting New cables. My question now..does it matter if i use 2 gauge for positive and 1 gauge for negative?
 
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Old 08-10-2018, 10:13 PM
fhorta
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So. After mew solenoid, new battery cables and termimals, one gage for negative and 2 gage for positive and new starter, now i get clicking sound. No turnover. Checked battery coltage with volmeter and showing 12.38 volts. Any ideas, suggestions?....at first when turning key the starter would just spin as if not engaging. N Ow it seems to be engaging but not turning over. I guess that $5 buck chuck solenoid could be suspect. It does feel hot to the touch on where the negative cable coming from starter connects to the solenoid. Guess i minus well put the old one back on and see what it does.
 

Last edited by fhorta; 08-10-2018 at 10:14 PM. Reason: Spelling
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Old 08-11-2018, 05:39 PM
fhorta
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Solved...it seems. Hope im not speaking too soon. I guess the battery was lower than indicated. I slapped on freshly charged battery and now it's cranking like a dream.
In conclusion the starter was definitely bad. I tested it while off with battery cables and it really struggled to turn. When i tested new one it really spun much faster and stronger than old one.

Obviously, the battery would drain quickly when cranking old starter due to starter was dragging so badly. So that explains the slow cranking after so many tries. Not bad battery, but drained.

Jury still open on the solenoid. I still have the $5 buck chuck on. I also kept the old one, US made. We will see what happens.

The upgraded battery cables are definitely showcasing their stuff. Got them at Tractor trailer supply. When turning the key, that sucker really cranks. Never before had it turn over so strongly.

Now stil having carb issues. Probly order new one.

Also, oil light flickering in idle and when driving. Levels are good. Will have to look into that. Thanks to all who helped me on this.
 
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