7.3 idi injector pump replaced and no start. willing to try anything....
#1
04-16-2018, 09:47 PM
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7.3 idi injector pump replaced and no start. willing to try anything....
Hi
New to Ford trucks, just bought a non running 91 f350 4x4 dump 7.3 auto trans with only 53000 miles. Body in decent shape and i needed an inexpensive truck.,
P/o told me that it needed a injector pump, figured ok, ill do it...
got pump, installed it, prior to installing old pump not moving diesel while cranking.
new pump in and now moving fuel under crank.
timing marks all aligned, bolted down tightly, may have water in fuel, just put in diesel water remover
batterys have chargers on them to crank and crank
replacing fuel filter in the morning.
cranks and runs for 3 seconds and quits, / much better than prior to replacing pump, nothing previously
thought i had all air bled out of lines,,,, will try again.
clicking noise while in glow plug warm up mode, sounds like 16 clicks in a row,,,,, water light on while cranking
What am i missing? new to diesels, but theres nothing I cant fix if i really give it a go.
Need some input, thanks guys!
New to Ford trucks, just bought a non running 91 f350 4x4 dump 7.3 auto trans with only 53000 miles. Body in decent shape and i needed an inexpensive truck.,
P/o told me that it needed a injector pump, figured ok, ill do it...
got pump, installed it, prior to installing old pump not moving diesel while cranking.
new pump in and now moving fuel under crank.
timing marks all aligned, bolted down tightly, may have water in fuel, just put in diesel water remover
batterys have chargers on them to crank and crank
replacing fuel filter in the morning.
cranks and runs for 3 seconds and quits, / much better than prior to replacing pump, nothing previously
thought i had all air bled out of lines,,,, will try again.
clicking noise while in glow plug warm up mode, sounds like 16 clicks in a row,,,,, water light on while cranking
What am i missing? new to diesels, but theres nothing I cant fix if i really give it a go.
Need some input, thanks guys!
Last edited by znproperties; 04-16-2018 at 09:50 PM. Reason: missing information
#2
04-16-2018, 09:54 PM
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#3
04-17-2018, 12:21 AM
Cargo Master
First off, for a guy who is new to diesels, you are doing the right things to track down the problem.
This is the most disconcerting thing in your post. I"m not sure what would cause the engine to stop running after 3 seconds, if the IP is new. Where did you get your IP from? There are only a few trusted rebuilders out there.
Something tells me that you might have had some air in the fuel lines leading up to the IP when you replaced it. Maybe it started on some fuel and once that fuel ran out, the air in the new IP worked its way into the injector lines. I think you are on the right track here, and you should definitely check to make sure you are getting fuel from the IP to the injectors. Crack the lines again and see if you are still getting fuel to the injectors: How to Crack Injector Lines and Purge Air on a 6.9 / 7.3 IDI Diesel Engine ? IDI Online
Do you mean that you bolted the IP down to the gearhouse, and lined up the lines on the IP and gearhouse? Or do you mean you took off the gearhouse, lined up the timing marks on the camshaft gear and IP gear? If the latter, you don't have to pull the gearhouse when replacing an IP. I hope you were just talking about the IP-to-the-Gearhouse studs and nuts.
Overall, you are doing the right things to get this beast started. I'd say recheck that most of your injector lines have all the air purged. Also, recheck that your diesel schroeder valve is spurting diesel fuel as well. What to do if no Diesel Fuel is coming out of the Schroeder Valve on a 6.9 / 7.3 IDI ? IDI Online From the way you describe it, it seems like you need to make sure you are getting fuel. Report back if you are still getting fuel to the injectors and we can move forward with more troubleshooting.
cranks and runs for 3 seconds and quits, / much better than prior to replacing pump, nothing previously
thought i had all air bled out of lines,,,, will try again.
timing marks all aligned, bolted down tightly,
Overall, you are doing the right things to get this beast started. I'd say recheck that most of your injector lines have all the air purged. Also, recheck that your diesel schroeder valve is spurting diesel fuel as well. What to do if no Diesel Fuel is coming out of the Schroeder Valve on a 6.9 / 7.3 IDI ? IDI Online From the way you describe it, it seems like you need to make sure you are getting fuel. Report back if you are still getting fuel to the injectors and we can move forward with more troubleshooting.
#4
04-17-2018, 05:53 AM
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First off, for a guy who is new to diesels, you are doing the right things to track down the problem.
Thanks! I did a lot of research, wanted to do this right with a limited budget for this truck....
This is the most disconcerting thing in your post. I"m not sure what would cause the engine to stop running after 3 seconds, if the IP is new. Where did you get your IP from? There are only a few trusted rebuilders out there.
Bought it from a rebuilder Metro Fuel in Allentown PA, they do a lot of this kind of work, have a shop out back. Lots of big and little pumps rebuilt $600 was the cost
Something tells me that you might have had some air in the fuel lines leading up to the IP when you replaced it. Maybe it started on some fuel and once that fuel ran out, the air in the new IP worked its way into the injector lines. I think you are on the right track here, and you should definitely check to make sure you are getting fuel from the IP to the injectors. Crack the lines again and see if you are still getting fuel to the injectors: How to Crack Injector Lines and Purge Air on a 6.9 / 7.3 IDI Diesel Engine ? IDI Online
There was fuel going into injector pump but not out of it prior to relplacement, now it comes out.!
Do you mean that you bolted the IP down to the gearhouse, and lined up the lines on the IP and gearhouse? Or do you mean you took off the gearhouse, lined up the timing marks on the camshaft gear and IP gear? If the latter, you don't have to pull the gearhouse when replacing an IP. I hope you were just talking about the IP-to-the-Gearhouse studs and nuts.
I did not disturb the gearhouse, just marked the timing gear on the housing, with the 3 bolts and keyway dowel. pulled and replaced...
Overall, you are doing the right things to get this beast started. I'd say recheck that most of your injector lines have all the air purged. Also, recheck that your diesel schroeder valve is spurting diesel fuel as well. What to do if no Diesel Fuel is coming out of the Schroeder Valve on a 6.9 / 7.3 IDI ? IDI Online From the way you describe it, it seems like you need to make sure you are getting fuel. Report back if you are still getting fuel to the injectors and we can move forward with more troubleshooting.
Thanks! I did a lot of research, wanted to do this right with a limited budget for this truck....
This is the most disconcerting thing in your post. I"m not sure what would cause the engine to stop running after 3 seconds, if the IP is new. Where did you get your IP from? There are only a few trusted rebuilders out there.
Bought it from a rebuilder Metro Fuel in Allentown PA, they do a lot of this kind of work, have a shop out back. Lots of big and little pumps rebuilt $600 was the cost
Something tells me that you might have had some air in the fuel lines leading up to the IP when you replaced it. Maybe it started on some fuel and once that fuel ran out, the air in the new IP worked its way into the injector lines. I think you are on the right track here, and you should definitely check to make sure you are getting fuel from the IP to the injectors. Crack the lines again and see if you are still getting fuel to the injectors: How to Crack Injector Lines and Purge Air on a 6.9 / 7.3 IDI Diesel Engine ? IDI Online
There was fuel going into injector pump but not out of it prior to relplacement, now it comes out.!
Do you mean that you bolted the IP down to the gearhouse, and lined up the lines on the IP and gearhouse? Or do you mean you took off the gearhouse, lined up the timing marks on the camshaft gear and IP gear? If the latter, you don't have to pull the gearhouse when replacing an IP. I hope you were just talking about the IP-to-the-Gearhouse studs and nuts.
I did not disturb the gearhouse, just marked the timing gear on the housing, with the 3 bolts and keyway dowel. pulled and replaced...
Overall, you are doing the right things to get this beast started. I'd say recheck that most of your injector lines have all the air purged. Also, recheck that your diesel schroeder valve is spurting diesel fuel as well. What to do if no Diesel Fuel is coming out of the Schroeder Valve on a 6.9 / 7.3 IDI ? IDI Online From the way you describe it, it seems like you need to make sure you are getting fuel. Report back if you are still getting fuel to the injectors and we can move forward with more troubleshooting.
Maybe I can ger her to fire! like i said, only 53000 original on this truck with minimal rust....came with a plow too $1800 for truck, 400 for tow and 650 in parts so far., (wife game me a small budget for work truck) ;( but shes a ford, and i like it!)
#5
04-17-2018, 09:15 AM
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Genscripter,
Thanks for the reply, your information is helpful and very welcome!!!
I removed the fuel filter and p/o must have changed it, it looked pretty new outside and inside, I filled it with a mixture of water remover, DIESEL, and some atf to clean the injectors.
i think i removed most of the air from the Schrader valve, fuel seems to be flowing continually, initially, there was air,,,,,
rebled ....or tried to rebleed the lines
seems like its easier to get started, and it runs for about 7 seconds now and then quits, restarts much easier, runs for 7 seconds again, dies.
batterys now on charge till i get home......
Thanks for the reply, your information is helpful and very welcome!!!
I removed the fuel filter and p/o must have changed it, it looked pretty new outside and inside, I filled it with a mixture of water remover, DIESEL, and some atf to clean the injectors.
i think i removed most of the air from the Schrader valve, fuel seems to be flowing continually, initially, there was air,,,,,
rebled ....or tried to rebleed the lines
seems like its easier to get started, and it runs for about 7 seconds now and then quits, restarts much easier, runs for 7 seconds again, dies.
batterys now on charge till i get home......
Last edited by znproperties; 04-17-2018 at 09:38 AM. Reason: forgot to add info
#6
04-17-2018, 10:27 AM
Tuned
#7
04-17-2018, 11:06 AM
Cargo Master
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#8
04-17-2018, 12:59 PM
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p/o says he put in new starter, alternator, oil cooler, glow plugs and controller. Truck inspected till 11/18 and he said it ran until March 20th, Went to school with his wife, so I believe his account of history....
i cracked the lines, turned it over, see fuel escape from lines, then retighten...... the truck seems to start easier and run a bit longer each time. but quits after 7 seconds or so. White smoke out of tailpipe. which I'm sure is from flooding it.
should i just keep trying to bleed the lines, this seems like an endless task.... i might be needing new batteries too. this cranking is killing them, but when I first start out leaving them on charge, the are able to turn over strongly for the first 2 to 3 cranks at 15 seconds each.
i cracked the lines, turned it over, see fuel escape from lines, then retighten...... the truck seems to start easier and run a bit longer each time. but quits after 7 seconds or so. White smoke out of tailpipe. which I'm sure is from flooding it.
should i just keep trying to bleed the lines, this seems like an endless task.... i might be needing new batteries too. this cranking is killing them, but when I first start out leaving them on charge, the are able to turn over strongly for the first 2 to 3 cranks at 15 seconds each.
#9
04-17-2018, 01:13 PM
Tuned
#10
04-17-2018, 01:29 PM
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#11
04-17-2018, 07:15 PM
Okay, a few things. From the sounds of it, it is able to start for about 7 seconds, then shuts down. This leads me to believe the timing can not be TOO far out. And the pump is working, as well as the lift pump.
I suspect a fuel shut off switch? Is it shutting off instantly? Or does it spit and sputter before it dies? If it shuts off instantly and can restart on the next try, then it has to be shutting off it's own fuel. Which leads me to think Fuel shut off switch/valve.
The only things that could shut it down, are IP, Injectors, Lift Pump, air in the lines, Air intrusion (Could very well be cracked return lines or leaky Injector seals Are they wet???), Shut off Valve, and blown heads.
Most of those it seems like you could rule out. White smoke is VERY normal on startup. Especially with it being cold, that just makes sense that the engine is not able to fully burn the fuel due to low engine temp, and condensation to consider too.
Check the fuel shutoff. Maybe run a bypass to it? See if it is fully opening? also I would crack the Injectors to check for air in them.
I suspect a fuel shut off switch? Is it shutting off instantly? Or does it spit and sputter before it dies? If it shuts off instantly and can restart on the next try, then it has to be shutting off it's own fuel. Which leads me to think Fuel shut off switch/valve.
The only things that could shut it down, are IP, Injectors, Lift Pump, air in the lines, Air intrusion (Could very well be cracked return lines or leaky Injector seals Are they wet???), Shut off Valve, and blown heads.
Most of those it seems like you could rule out. White smoke is VERY normal on startup. Especially with it being cold, that just makes sense that the engine is not able to fully burn the fuel due to low engine temp, and condensation to consider too.
Check the fuel shutoff. Maybe run a bypass to it? See if it is fully opening? also I would crack the Injectors to check for air in them.
#12
04-17-2018, 08:13 PM
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vegetable0
Where is the fuel shut off switch? it has a brand new ip and it is now getting fuel, as it was not before i replaced the ip. there may still be air in the lines, and I'm trying to purge it all,.
runs for about 7 seconds and shuts right off, crank for 6-10 seconds and starts again, sometimes i have to crank it twice and then it fires. but runs l no longer than 7-10 seconds, and its beginning to start a little more frequently now.
thinking about putting in a cheapo electric fuel pump. prior to the fuel filter.
don't thnk its heads, engine was really clean inside when i took off timing gear cover to put in ip, it has only 53000 original miles and wasn't abused....
Where is the fuel shut off switch? it has a brand new ip and it is now getting fuel, as it was not before i replaced the ip. there may still be air in the lines, and I'm trying to purge it all,.
runs for about 7 seconds and shuts right off, crank for 6-10 seconds and starts again, sometimes i have to crank it twice and then it fires. but runs l no longer than 7-10 seconds, and its beginning to start a little more frequently now.
thinking about putting in a cheapo electric fuel pump. prior to the fuel filter.
don't thnk its heads, engine was really clean inside when i took off timing gear cover to put in ip, it has only 53000 original miles and wasn't abused....
#13
04-17-2018, 08:51 PM
vegetable0
Where is the fuel shut off switch? it has a brand new ip and it is now getting fuel, as it was not before i replaced the ip. there may still be air in the lines, and I'm trying to purge it all,.
runs for about 7 seconds and shuts right off, crank for 6-10 seconds and starts again, sometimes i have to crank it twice and then it fires. but runs l no longer than 7-10 seconds, and its beginning to start a little more frequently now.
thinking about putting in a cheapo electric fuel pump. prior to the fuel filter.
don't thnk its heads, engine was really clean inside when i took off timing gear cover to put in ip, it has only 53000 original miles and wasn't abused....
Where is the fuel shut off switch? it has a brand new ip and it is now getting fuel, as it was not before i replaced the ip. there may still be air in the lines, and I'm trying to purge it all,.
runs for about 7 seconds and shuts right off, crank for 6-10 seconds and starts again, sometimes i have to crank it twice and then it fires. but runs l no longer than 7-10 seconds, and its beginning to start a little more frequently now.
thinking about putting in a cheapo electric fuel pump. prior to the fuel filter.
don't thnk its heads, engine was really clean inside when i took off timing gear cover to put in ip, it has only 53000 original miles and wasn't abused....
#14
04-17-2018, 09:42 PM
Cargo Master
In my engine stand video (below) around minute 6, you can see how to check if your FSS is clicking:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jiob...youtu.be&t=353
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jiob...youtu.be&t=353
#15
04-17-2018, 09:44 PM
Cargo Master