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So went back out this morning, too quite a bit but it fired up, but as is the norm now, after about 5 minutes when it started to warm up, it died and won’t start again. Will give an hour or so and see if it starts again after cooling off.
I did pull the spring out of the FPR and reinstalled to make sure it was clean and set right. Did that before starting it, so doesn’t seem to be the issue. Also popped off the ICP plug and it was perfectly clean, no oil in it. HPO reserve was full also.
any other thoughts or ideas on what to check? Was running fine before fixing the fuel leak in the FPR, so not sure how replacing o-rings and the screen could cause this issue.
Just guessing, but could a faulty oil temp sensor cause the PCM to get confused? I guess the only way to tell is with AE, or other sensor reading scanner.
Indeed, a faulty EOT could throw off the PCM functions that depend on EOT. But how is that relevant? Fuel pressure regulation is purely mechanical.
Personally, I don't think he has a fuel pressure issue. I think that it is just coincidence that this started right after resealing the FPR.
Is there any way you can hook this up to a scanner? Do you know anyone with Torque Pro? It would be nice to see what's going on right before it shuts off.
Unfortunately no access to a scanner. Pulled the FPR off and noticed the white plastic piece that holds the screen that connects to fuel bowl, the end that is against the ball is flat on the end, it was cracked with a few pieces of plastic just sitting in there. Cleaned those out and for the heck of it put it back together. Fired up great, thought wow that was too easy, but again once it warmed up it died. It seemed to miss, or hiccup once and hopped in to give it a second and it is exactly when the RPMs drop when warm up some it shuts off. The coolant hose coming off water pump for heater was just warming from the feel of it. Tried a couple more times to start it. Would crank and a couple time started and as long as had pedal floored and RPMs really high it stayed running but the second I left off the pedal a little it immediately cut out.
Acts like getting no fuel once the RPMs try to drop to normal level after a few minutes after starting. Once they drop it acts like it is shutting off due supply. But once the engine is cold it will fire right up, stay at 700+ RPM then once it warms some and tries to drop RPMs it just dies.
I dont have a CPS to swap out, would need to go buy one, but also do t want to just throw parts at it if it sounds like something somebody has experienced similar issues with.
One way to check the CPS is to see if the tach shows the rpm during the starter run. I too am not convinced this is actually a fuel pressure issue. One way to see if you are getting starved for fuel, is to look in the fuel bowl. I would also expect the next start run to need to turn over a few times until you got enough fuel. Does it start right away once it's cool?
I'm sorry to say you are probably at a point where you need to scan. If we know where you are, someone here may be close enough to you that has one, there are some less expensive options for a tablet or phone where you connect via bluetooth to the OBDII port, but I forget the name of the one everyone here likes.
Unfortunately no access to a scanner. Pulled the FPR off and noticed the white plastic piece that holds the screen that connects to fuel bowl, the end that is against the ball is flat on the end, it was cracked (Got a picture, can't visualize what you are describing) with a few pieces of plastic just sitting in there. Cleaned those out and for the heck of it put it back together. Fired up great, thought wow that was too easy, but again once it warmed up it died. It seemed to miss, or hiccup once and hopped in to give it a second and it is exactly when the RPMs drop when warm up some it shuts off. The coolant hose coming off water pump for heater was just warming from the feel of it. Tried a couple more times to start it. Would crank and a couple time started and as long as had pedal floored and RPMs really high it stayed running but the second I left off the pedal a little it immediately cut out.
Acts like getting no fuel once the RPMs try to drop to normal level after a few minutes after starting. Once they drop it acts like it is shutting off due supply. But once the engine is cold it will fire right up, stay at 700+ RPM then once it warms some and tries to drop RPMs it just dies.
I dont have a CPS to swap out, would need to go buy one, but also do t want to just throw parts at it if it sounds like something somebody has experienced similar issues with.
This problem sounds like air in the fuel bowl not being vented back to the tank. The purpose of that screen is to filter particles and vent air back to the tank thru a very small orifice past the screen to the return line. It is really small, .02 or .002 inches, can't remember. After sitting for awhile the air would probably vent but running it would take a few minutes for the air to build back up inside the bowl. I'm thinking you may have some very small debris in that orifice, especially since you indicated the found small plastic pieces, if I'm understanding you correctly. Some shop compressed or canned air might dislodge it, worth a try. You can also remove the fuel filter lid when it dies and see - hear if air pressure is built up inside
I will check again. Every time I have taken the cap of the fuel filter it is full, but haven’t checked immediately following when it died, will do that and see what it looks like. I will also see if I can clean out the little holes and if that makes a difference, and snap a picture of it. Will need replaced again anyway being that the edges cracked, but there was still the o-ring to seal it, but ...
i do need to get a gauge gauge to check the fuel pressure. Will try to do that this weekend. Will also check the bowl to see if empty right after it ****s off. When starting it does the same as it always has, couples of time cranking them fired up. No different than before all this started. Tried watching the tach, but didnt see if it moved last time or not. Thinking it didn’t spike or anything. Also didn’t notice it noving at all when cranking it when it wouldn’t fire. Will double check again to make sure that is fully correct, and any differenece from initial start when it does fire.
The fuel eel filter is pretty clean, white minus the diesel coloration, but not dirty. I did notice last night there was some grit/sand in the bottom of the fuel bowl though.
Here is some updated info. I am attaching a few pictures as well. Also a link to a youtube video that shows some specifics. When it fired up cold was idling at about 7-750rpm. Slowly over a couple minutes it dropped to about 6-650 then can see in the video it just dies. Tach did not move prior to it dying. Tried to fire up again and could here it start then suddenly die. If watch closely can see the tach moving a tiny bit when cranking, but when it actually starts there is no difference. Towards the end it ran for a couple second when it had the pedal down keeping it at about 1500rpm's, but then still just died and would not even try after that. I checked the fuel bowl right after and it was full. Did not hear anything from it and was not filling/dropping. No air pressure inside it either.
I also pulled out the white plastic orifice piece to get a picture of where it was cracked, which is included here, but ironically as soon as I tried to pull it out, the entire part that goes into the fuel bowl just crumbled apart. Seemed like even though it was brand new, the plastic was completely rotted, as if baking in UV's for a few years. Perhaps that was the issue, though would that prevent the truck from firing up at all after it warmed up for a few minutes?
Not yet, was going to try to pick up tomorrow. Did forget to mention, checked fuel pressure while idling, didn’t have an extension but also never get past idling really, it was about 62-63psi
Is this what you purchased on the white plastic insert that goes into the fuel bowl? It looks nothing like the picture you posted (kinda) but maybe the end broke off?
First there are two different versions of the fuel bowl. Yours, a 94.5 to 95 model and then the 96 to 97 later model. The earlier versions had that additional assembly with the big screen filter. The later versions it was removed entirely. I know that does not help you at this time but just FYI when troubleshooting. I'm going to admit I've never seen the earlier versions. That piece is really important as it has a duel purpose.
1. Vent air from the filter bowl back to the tank.
2. Allow some fuel from the return lines and regulator to go back into the filter, depending on the pressures .. the purpose of the check ball.
I'm wondering since installing the new white piece if you did not remove the inner o-ring? Just a guess on this end but something was causing it to break apart early in its life cycle. Once again I'm certainly no expert on the earlier versions since the ones I've worked on were 96 - 97 model versions. But the theory is the same.
Yup, that’s the same kit I used. Looks different because the larger diameter side is the part that crumbled to pieces when I tried to take it out to snap a photo of the smaller diameter side (the side on the top that you can see in the photo). The small diameter side in the photo is the section that had pieces break off initially. Will have to wait until I can get another piece to put in and see if that may have been an issue. Pretty sure I had the original O-ring out of there, but will double check on the next one that goes in to make sure. Guess I will post back in a couple few days on how it goes. I live in middle of nowhere Wyoming, so most of the time I have to order everything, makes for a long process to get everything done!
03-06-2018, 12:45 PM
