So, I know there is an Alternative fuels forum, but it appears to see very little traffic, and this is specific to my 7.3, so I figured it would make more sense here.

I have no interest in going down the used vegetable oil / bio-diesel rabbit hole. I've researched it, and it's just not practical for me. I have nowhere to store and process large enough quantities to justify the effort. Further, in my area, its is unlikely I could find free good quality used oil anyway. Also, none of the injector builders seem to approve it. I don't want to have to run multiple fuel tanks, heaters, etc....

I am very interested in eventually running centrifuged and blended waste motor oil, but that also has some practical considerations, given that I live in an apartment.

I did experiment, successfully, with some clean transformer oil recently. I am an x-ray tech, and the office I work at had to change out our x-ray machine.
The high voltage transformer was in about 12 gallons of nice clean mineral oil. I blended it at an 80/20 ratio with regular unleaded gas, then put 5 gallons of that mix in and filled the tank with diesel. So, 5 gallons oil/gas mix to about 30 gallons of diesel. The truck ran great with both batches. It was quieter, idled better, seemed to smoke a little less and have slightly more power on the 140hp race tune. I've been trying to find more ever since, unsuccessfully.

Now, on to the current question..... I recently found some NEW Canola (genetically modified/altered rapeseed oil) cooking oil, at a local store, for less per gallon then the current price at the pump for diesel. It would be about $0.70/ gallon less.
I would have no intention of running this is a primary fuel. I doubt I could get enough of it to do that anyway. IF I use it, it would be as a supplement, in a similar fashion as the mineral oil mentioned above.
Is it safe to use this NEW, unused, in the bottle canola oil with no further processing? Should I pre-blend it in a bucket , with either gas or diesel to thin it? If so, what percentage? I know USED veg oil can do all sorts of bad things, such as coking injectors, etc.... Would I have any issues with new oil straight off the supermarket shelf? What about gelling / wax drop out? It is still getting pretty cold at night here in NJ. I have been using the block heater, but thats it. There will be no fuel heaters. Will this be a problem?

I don't want to cause issues/damage to my fuel system or engine to save literally a few dollars. But, if this new cooking oil can be used, in small quantities, safely, then I might as well.

 

The only difference between new and used VO is the fats and food particles. Both will cause cokeing. David seems to get away with it but he lives in southern California. I wouldn't try it.

 

But I thought that IS the problem; the nasty stuff that comes with it being used for cooking, along with the increased water content and higher acid levels after its been cooked? I was under the impression that new unused oil was much better/cleaner/chemically different then oil that has previously been exposed to food and high cooking temps?

And again, I would only use a very small amount, maybe 5 gallons to 30 gallons of diesel. At that ratio, would the new cooking oil still act like veg oil, or just sort of disappear into the diesel?

 

Your location and climate might make a difference in your tank, lines, pump, pickup apparatus, and filter.


I would ask this question on the alternative fuel forum, regardless of how little traffic is on there. Every once in a while, the folks who really do have experience with VO check in. And if you search and find a related topic in the archives and bump it with your question, the subscribers might be notified via email, and be motivated to respond to your inquiry.


I can get a $1.00 off a gallon of fuel simply by doing all my grocery shopping at a particular grocer. Using a fake name and a fax machine number to avoid big brother seeing how many twinkies I eat, I signed up for that grocer's app, and am notified of their special prices on this and that, so I don't pay any more for groceries than I would at a bargain basement low quality grocer. And every once in a while, the grocer sends a notice that if I spend $50 bucks by such and such, I'll get double gas rewards.


So far, my consumption of diesel has fallen within the points awarded, such that I am able to get a $1.00 off per gallon of quality #2 diesel on every fill up. I'd sooner do that than save just 70 cents, for only 5 gallons, and have to dilute that 5 gallons with what 50 gallons of diesel bought at full price?


That being said, I'd do WVO in a heartbeat if I had a steady supply of free WVO and the time to process it. Having neither, I haven't tried it. But I can forsee a time when the opportunities will converge in the future.


For you, I'd suggest going to the forums outside of FTE that specialize in this topic, in addition to the alternative fuel forum on FTE.

 

My understanding of 'blending' vegetable oil, without a heated system or means of purging, is that you risk polymerization from heating and cooling cycles. Having it sit for any length of time in the ring lands, heads, fuel bowl, etc., are all potential areas for poly. Doesn't matter if it's new cooking oil, or properly treated used. They'll both polymerize given the right environment.

My observation in the eleven or so years I've been on alternative fuel forums, is that 'blenders' come and go. I've never seen a 'blender' stick around. I've seen a few here too. They always disappear. The vegetable oil users that stick around and are successful long term are the ones that run heated, 2 tank purge systems, and those that make it into biodiesel, which is what I do.

SkySkiJason has mastered veg oil. Two tanks and heat. There's one other person on this forum that runs VO blend named David. He blends, but I believe there's another element to his system to make it work. Hopefully he'll chime in.

If it were me, I wouldn't just dump it in without mods.

 

http://biodiesel.org/docs/default-so...-.pdf?sfvrsn=6

I wouldn't do it to save a couple of bucks on a tank of fuel, that's for sure.

BTW google is your friend.

 

I've been doing this for 15 years now.

Truck is an E99 with only a TS6 chip and no other modifications to anything.

In 240k miles I've had the VC off once for glow plugs. The tank down for socks and a pickup foot and just standard maintenance.

My setup is in my garage and it takes 20 minutes to mix 50 gal.

I only run it from June 1st til Oct 1st because of ambient temp.

I use donated veg oil from the local moose lodge.

I use a redline pump and a 55 gal drum with 3 hoses and 2 valves and a fuel nozzle on the third.

I recirc it as I "brew" it and finally throw the valve to the nozzle where there is a Napa Gold fuel filter in line to sort out anything larger than the micron size of our stock system.

I've played around with the ratios a bit to conform to temperature differences, but it is very slight.

I cut it with Kerosene or Jet fuel when available, blend in a specific amount of unleaded gas and add Power service additive. I have used diesel in the past but only when I can't find Kerosene.

The truck runs quieter and I don't run thru fuel filters at any point other than normal maintenance periods where I see nothing eyepopping.

The only down side is Cats and Dogs following the truck depending on if the oil was used for fish or chicken....LOL. Occasionally with a wind at your back you get a wiff of the exhaust when stopped. Not terribly annoying but it will deter you from stopping at a drive thru for lunch.

I did alot of homework when I began this program years ago, and all the guys I know that run this blend have reported no fuel related casualties. Some still have the same trucks.

Many oppose this and have they're own take on it, but they would be the ones who have never run it so you can take whoever you want for input. (It's all good. Listen to all arguements)

Last summer It was 1.10 a gallon to produce if that tells you anything.

For the amount of fuel I've made/run I have my truck paid for more than once so if in the future I do have a failure.......it owes me nothing. I tow a 28.5 cruiser at about 9500 lbs. I have a car hauler, a 29 5th wheel and I plow heavy in Northern Michigan. The truck definitely is my right hand and is worked. (but well maintained)

I would say that in the 240k that's on the rig, more than 100k is running this solution and it's still running as strong as the day I purchased it.

I do have Forscan and run it thru the mill from time to time and everything is great across the board.

A close friend of mine who turned me onto this (I was a naysayer and nervous) ran it for a year in his truck to prove it to me and he managed to without argument.

He is a mechanical engineer and a wrench weilding wizard.

I wasn't going to reply to the thread because it's always been a subject of contention between fellow FTE brothers but thought I would share my results.

If you need my formulation ratios I would be glad to provide them.

Denny

 

I wonder what the tax man has to say about burning that tax free WVO.

 

I think that can be a complicated question, depending on where you live.

The answer can also be different depending on what you use the truck for, as well as exactly how much WVO (or other "alternative" fuels), both in terms of the percentage in the tank at any given time, as well as the total you burn in a given year.
1.) Percentage. Under a certain percentage ( vs taxed diesel) in the tank, its not considered an untaxed fuel, but merely a fuel "supplement", no different then say pouring in a bottle of Power Service or similar. There is no fuel/road tax on the various fuel additive most of us use. The key is the percentage. I don't remember where I found it, but I remember that legally its a fairly high amount you can get away with; something like 10-20%

2.) There are various "alternative fuel" and "green" fuel programs in different states that allow for a certain volume per person to be used tax free. I believe there is also certain personal/ low volume exceptions federally as well. Probably something like 500-1000 gallons per year.

3.) Personally, I don't give 2 ( any other quantity) "poops" about it. If I go through the trouble of finding, collecting, processing, and blending an alt fuel ( be it WVO, SVO, WMO, or something else), the government isn't getting paid for my work/efforts. For me, its highly unlikely anyone would ever "stick' my tank. Its a personal vehicle ( no commercial plates), and I live in a more urban/suburban environment, with little or no farms or other well-known large scale "temptations" for illegal use of off-road fuel. So, very little incentive for law enforcement to set up "stings" or routinely check tanks in this area. If they ever did try, I'd refuse and tell them to get a warrant.

Further, unless you are using actual dyed off-road fuel, there is nothing they can do. As far as I know, dyed off-road fuel is the only thing they can get you for, on the side of the road. AND, it has to be the specific legally specified dye, with a very particular chemical composition, in order to fine you. So, if you use red ATF, and they stick your tank, they will not be happy, and may even ticket you, but it won't hold up in court when they can't provide a chemical analysis showing your fuel contained the EXACT legally mandated dye required to be put in off-road untaxed fuel.
There is no provision or standards applicable to roadside checks, that would address fuel that is black ( waste motor oil), or looks/smells like vegetable oil. Granted, if you were a big time producer, or they were after you for something else, etc...., eventually they could gather evidence for a tax evasion case down the road. But, again, they are not wasting their time on one person running a personal vehicle on french fries or old oil changes. Its not cost or time effective/efficient.

 

I have been filtering some myself. I will take pics of my filter rig when I can. But in a nutshell I "settle filter" in two tanks to pre filtering. My first filter is a whole house water filter with clear can. Similar to a old sediment fuel filter in old cars from the 50's. I step the filters own as follows 120 micron to a 40 micron then lastly a 10 micron. I am at this time gathering more. So far roughly 60 GL. I myself after seeing what happens in 10-20 below would not run in winter. I like my truck to start LOL. But I Dont think the summer would be an issue with higher temps. I do know the 6.2 Chev a friend has runs his fuel through a steel line wrapped around his exhaust pipe. He says you want to get the fuel up above 200* an it works all the way to 100% blend. I am going to keep it conservative with 50/50 I'll let ya know how it goes. But from what I read if you filter it right its ok.

 

Do you plan to convert your truck?

The folks who are negative about this, have probably never tried it.
What percentage of your fuel do you want to be cooking oil?
Do not fear cooking oil, but do respect it.
Without a converted truck, keep your % low.

I have operated on 100% uco for periods of time. My truck is converted.

 

IF I were to do it, I figure I would do the same as I successfully did with mineral/transformer oil. 4 gallons of SVO and 1 gallon of RUG, in a bucket. Mix thoroughly. Pour said 5 gallon mixture into tank and fill up, meaning 5gallons of 80/20 SVO/RUG to approx 30+ gallons of diesel.

So, I would have 15% by volume of the 80/20 mix to 85% pump diesel.

Its not so much about saving a few dollars, but trying to get back the noticeable performance improvement I got with the transformer oil; as I haven't been able to get more of it.

 

That's not going to happen with cooking oil. Different flashpoint and viscosity. What state do you live in?
For a starting point, without a converted truck, drop your % down to 10% for the South or 5% if you live in the North.

 

My 2cents is if you are going to have to process VO anyway and you intend on sticking with small quantities then your on track with your WMO idea

I dont centrifuge and work out of two 7gal buckets. Oil is collected from my own vehicles (free), gravity ran thru a 1micron sock filter(cheap), settled in bucket, 1micron filtered again into 2nd bucket, settled some more, then two gallons in tank at every fill up during summer. Valve screwed into each bucket 2" off bottom makes transfers easy.

If I were going to mess with VO blend I'd want to bench mix it with diesel in a clear container and sit it awhile to see what happens. Not that I distrust advice given from people actually doing it, I'd just want to see how it reacts over time.

 

I suspect this is me. If so, thanks for the honorable mention.
For the OP/Thread Starter, read my signature.