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00 7.3 cut off while driving. Won’t start

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Old 01-18-2018, 10:08 AM
Mandy988 Mandy988 is offline
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00 7.3 cut off while driving. Won’t start

My husbands 2000 7.3 F250SD cut off on him a few weeks ago while driving. (About a half mile past the house). He got it to refire after sitting for a bit and got the truck home. He went and got a new fuel filter and some anti gel(we had a snow storm with lots of cold weather) thinking it was the cold that did it. This happened on a Saturday 2 weeks ago. I had filled the fuel up that Wednesday in anticipation of the snow storm. (I’ve been driving this truck daily with no problem). He put the new fuel filter in. And it seemed to run fine. He let it idle for about an hour. The next day he tried going down the road agin. And again a half mile past the house it cut off. He thought now it was the fuel pump. So a friend ran him to town and they put a fuel pump in it. And again the truck would not stay running. It had to be towed home. Talked to a friend of mine that works on these 7.3. He suggested that the sending unit filters in the tank could have come loose. So I ordered the kit and sure enough when he dropped the tank the filter housing was broken. He fixed it. Put it back in and it still won’t run for more than a few seconds. He pulled the codes on the truck. It said the CPS was bad. No big deal. Got it from NAPA. Put it in. Truck still won’t stay running...... pulled codes again. It said the ICM was bad (truck has been bucking in rain for almost 2 years) so he replaced that. Not it says the PCM is bad. So before we go throwing any more money at this truck I thought I would ask for some advice. Any ideas what could be the problem? This all started with the snow storm we had here I. NC 2 weeks ago.
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Old 01-18-2018, 10:15 AM
Walleye Hunter Walleye Hunter is offline
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Welcome to FTE, these guys can and definitely will get you fixed up. First off, what are you reading codes with? Most code readers can't diagnose these truck and you'll need a set up that will, they are not expensive. As you have found, throwing parts and hoping is an expensive and unproductive approach. BTW ONLY OEM Ford sensors and electronic parts, others, like that NAPA CPS will not work, so you need to put the old one back in or get one from Ford.
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Old 01-18-2018, 10:20 AM
jackstraw jackstraw is offline
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Have you ever replaced the windshield?

The windshield seal can leak in a hidden way - droplets of water run down the inside of the driver side pillar and drip right on to the PCM, just to the left of the brake pedal. This can cause all sorts of random electrical gremlins as you describe.


P.S. At some point when you get the truck running on a dry day, run it for a while with the footwell heat on full blast. Then spray some water on the left top side of the cab, on to the windshield seal. Check for moisture around the PCM a few minutes later.
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Old 01-18-2018, 10:42 AM
Tailgate77478 Tailgate77478 is offline
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Check to make sure that the Tinnerman nut on the IPR hasn't come loose or fallen off. If it has, it would be directly below the IPR in the engine valley. If that's the culprit, just tighten it lightly...I would say finger tight with the socket in your fingers, but not on a wrench. The factory spec is 53 INCH pounds, which is only 4.5 ft/lbs, so not much tight at all. It does have a tendency to work it's way loose or off over many years.

If you want, you can put a dab of BLUE loctite on it, but not the red stuff.
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Old 01-18-2018, 10:42 AM
Mandy988 Mandy988 is offline
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He has been reading the code with a programmer that he acquired. No we haven’t replaced the windshield
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Old 01-18-2018, 11:27 AM
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You may think this sound crazy, but it is not, as this does happen. (happened to me)


Have you checked the oil level? These trucks hold about 15qts of oil. If for some reason (and it can happen and not know where the oil went) the oil level falls below 8 qts, the truck will loose oil pressure and the injectors close and will not fire. The injectors are opened by oil pressure. No oil pressure, no open injectors, no fuel, no run.


As stated before, we are here to talk these issues out and give suggestions BEFORE throwing a lot of money at a symptom and not the real problem.


You are 'looking' at a fuel problem... from what I am reading (filter/pump).... was there 'fuel' in the bowl when cranking the engine. How to find out.... Turn the key to 'wait to start' (wait for light to go out) and crank a couple of seconds....(with truck not running) Now, go to the fuel drain at the back of the fuel bowl and open it up... is fuel pouring out the bottom of the engine? If yes... you have fuel. if no... Why?


Also The CPS..... if it does not seal tight or the connections are not tight and sealed...moisture will get into and shut the truck down if running and/or give it trouble starting. Are the electrical connections Clean and making a good connection and put a sealant on it to keep moisture out. Where it goes into the engine... is it clean and sealed good?


Glad you are here and let us know how things are going, even when you get the truck going as we would like to know what 'your' problem is in order to help others.


Do not think that we are done 'helping' you and your husband as there are few issues to look at and this is a good starting place.


Welcome to the site.
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Old 01-18-2018, 11:28 AM
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Wesley Green Wesley Green is offline
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Next time it does it dump a big gulp worth of ice on the IPR and try to start it, if it starts look at the IPR
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Old 01-18-2018, 11:34 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mandy988 View Post
He has been reading the code with a programmer that he acquired. No we haven’t replaced the windshield

OBDII readers Do Not work on these trucks, if that is what he has.


I have a 'SuperChip Programmer and it does read codes for these trucks.
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Old 01-18-2018, 11:38 AM
M-S-G M-S-G is offline
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Buckling in rain IS a known CPS issue. Caused by wipers interfering with CPS.
It sounds like your CPS has failed, as they do with age. It was replaced with an after market CPS which shouldn't be trusted. My truck won't even run on the grey CPS.
Find real black CPS and a real grey CPS and experiment. By real I mean FORD.

This is the cheapest way of troubleshooting and requires removing 1 fastener.
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Old 01-18-2018, 11:43 AM
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Below is a couple of good sources if you can wait a couple of days for shipping.

http://www.dieselorings.com/1999-200...-cps-gray.html

Motorcraft Cam Position Sensor CPS 94-03
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Old 01-18-2018, 11:44 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by M-S-G View Post
Buckling in rain IS a known CPS issue. Caused by wipers interfering with CPS.
It sounds like your CPS has failed, as they do with age. It was replaced with an after market CPS which shouldn't be trusted. My truck won't even run on the grey CPS.
Find real black CPS and a real grey CPS and experiment. By real I mean FORD.

This is the cheapest way of troubleshooting and requires removing 1 fastener.

I would not 'jump' to the point that the CPS has 'failed' just yet... I do believe that the CPS may have caused the dying and no start issue. Moisture getting into the electrical connections and/or where it goes into the engine will cause these symptoms. Putting a new CPS in it may 'fix' this for now, but the old CPS may not be bad at all...


Years back I drove threw some water and the truck shut off dead, water got into the connections. Dryed it out and cleaned and sealed it and it was fine.
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Old 01-18-2018, 02:04 PM
Mandy988 Mandy988 is offline
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He replaced the crank position sensor. I’ll have to check the oil level. It had been leaking. We replaced the rear main seal about a month ago.
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Old 01-18-2018, 02:41 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mandy988 View Post
It said the ICM was bad (truck has been bucking in rain for almost 2 years) so he replaced that. Not it says the PCM is bad. So before we go throwing any more money at this truck I thought I would ask for some advice. Any ideas what could be the problem? This all started with the snow storm we had here I. NC 2 weeks ago.



Gonna assume you meant IDM. Was the code pulled P1670? That can often show up on the scan report, when there is nothing actually wrong with the IDM itself. The code documents that a feedback signal was not received between the IDM and the PCM, but many other things can cause that, including issues with the CPS. It is unfortunate that this code leads to unnecessary and expensive component replacement... but it sounds like you are trying to put a stop to that by asking online.


The most common issue indicated by the symptoms you describe, where the engine shuts off during the rain/snow (when the windshield wipers are on) and when driving in the same section of road (where there might be certain very strong radio frequencies in a spectrum that causes EMF).... is the Camshaft Position Sensor.


Because you purchased a new CPS from NAPA, rather than Ford / Motorcraft / International... there remains some significant doubt as to whether or not your husband's chosen replacement of the CPS actually eliminated the possibility that the CPS is still the issue.


The windshield wipers share a ground point with the PCM that potentially transmits interference with the CPS signal. The PCM has many grounds going to and from it, not just one ground, but it just so happens that when the windshield wipers are in INTERMITTANT Mode, the manner in which the wiper motor accomplishes intermittency, based on the rheostat like adjustment setting on the turn signal stalk, causes EMF interference with the CPS.


If this happens on the road, and you still need the wipers to work in order to drive, a quick solution is to turn the wipers all the way ON to steady state mode, by passing all the intermittent wiper settings. The steady state modes cause less interference.


Another thing that is sometimes helpful is to go through all the grounding points you can find on the vehicle, and remove, abrasively clean, and reattach them.


The CPS is a magnetic Hall Effect sensor, of which there are several in the truck. If you have an automatic, then there are a couple more magnetic Hall Effect sensors on top of the transmission. I have seen where a faulty diode on the rectifier bridge of a failing alternator can cause enough electro magnetic interference to effect the function of the transmission. Basically, the EMI disrupts the signal that the Hall Effect sensor is trying to pickup, and that interference prevents the PCM from getting the information it needs to make the right decision. So take a hard look at the alternator as well.


Having said all that, and despite doubting that the IDM was bad, there is a possibility that your PCM could be bad. But before condemning it, I would first put in a Genuine Motorcraft CPS, recondition all accessible grounding points, and thoroughly check the alternator, before throwing another high dollar part at the problem. In the meantime, avoid using the wipers in intermittent mode, and try to avoid that section of road were the problem always crops up.
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Old 01-18-2018, 02:47 PM
Walleye Hunter Walleye Hunter is offline
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If he didn't replace that cam position sensor with original Ford product he needs to re replace it with one that is.
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Old 01-18-2018, 03:41 PM
woowoo1974 woowoo1974 is offline
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My 97 did the same thing. I replaced the Cam sensor with one from the parts store and it did squat so I got another one thinking the new one was faulty and it did squat also. A friend said that only Ford OEM would work so I bought one from the Ford house and it works perfect.
Good luck.
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